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Ted TurnerLike most Liberals, Ted Turner is a slow learner. What the majority of Conservatives accept about God by age 10, only took Turner 70+ years: the avowed atheist now is seeking God.

We Christians warned the idiotic Left that there are no atheists in foxholes. Ted Turner is 75 years into his miserable life, and now finds himself staring into the abyss.

I know what you’re thinking: “Kevin, Turner was a billionaire, how could he be unhappy?”

Two reasons:

  1. Jane Fonda
  2. and money can’t buy you love and happiness

Here is an excerpt from a CNN article:

What will matter most about Ted Turner’s life story when they roll the final credits?

That he started the first 24-hour news network? Built a fortune once worth $10 billion? Was Time magazine’s “Man of the Year”? Received a star on Hollywood’s Walk of Fame? Made The New York Times best-seller list?

Maybe it was that time he raced a sailboat faster than anyone else. Or the year his baseball team won the World Series. Impressed yet? Did you know he had a president for a fishing buddy and won the heart of a movie star?

He even helped bring back an American icon, the buffalo, from the threat of extinction. Always the entrepreneur, he saved bison by convincing people to eat them — at his 44 Ted’s Montana Grill restaurants, of course.

Even considering all his accomplishments and feats of derring-do, Ted Turner is only human. And so, with three-quarters of a century in his rear-view mirror, he’s also thinking about the things ordinary people think about as the sun goes down.

You can be a billionaire or a bum, win sailing’s biggest prize or swab decks, own a television network or have trouble paying the cable bill: By the final curtain, life boils down to a few simple things.

Did I make my Mama and Daddy proud?

Am I loved?

Will anybody remember me?

Do I get into heaven?

Ted Turner at 75 has figured out that it doesn’t matter what you do, but it does matters who you are. Unlike God-fearing, Bible-thumping Conservatives who do good deeds because it’s who we are, Turner has done things to fill that void he has been missing. Turner saved the buffalo, because he was really trying to save himself.

I’m happy that Turner has had an epiphany, that he realizes he is meaningless in the scheme of things. That is the first step to growth.

From a political point of view, I suggest we begin winning over these Leftists a bit sooner.

 

 
 
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  • intheloop54

    I’ll believe it when I see it. He’s full of hot air.

    • http://www.thefreedomtrainusa.com/ FreedomTrainUSA

      An Full of BULLS**T TOO….

    • Larry Stauth

      The burden of belief is not ours to bear. The truth lies between Him and God, we are just merely spectators. Just be mindful, there is a reason why hate, anger and disdain were well taught subjects through out all the books.

      Negative emotions can be a cancer. Believe him or not, forgiveness is what is requested of us.

  • Tradecraft46

    Maybe he got a bad diagnosis from oncology.

  • http://www.thefreedomtrainusa.com/ FreedomTrainUSA

    Does Teddy Turner not want to spend Eternity in HELL????

  • livefreeordie

    He’s probably trying to find a way to charge people for their prayers.

  • Tennessee Slim

    Better late than never.

  • xeriscapelady

    Somehow it does not seem fair that garbage like him can live his life as he has and then expect GOD to forgive him. But without Jesus as his savior he will not make heaven. Sure by God’s standards we are ALL filthy rags and deserve hell. But somehow it does not seem fair when someone can live 75 years Godless, and then think he can right it and get to heaven scott free. What about the faithful, who worshipped the Lord and faithfully lived theirs lives most of their lives? How does that seem possible that both could be looked at equally? Surely not .

    • Carl Mayo

      that’s not the right way to look at it. maybe you grew up in a christian household, and never had a reason to doubt. some people don’t, and spiritual realities are just not a part of their world view. you should rejoice when anyone, no matter what they’ve done, finds God.

      • Larry Stauth

        I am inclined to agree, but then I think of Judas. He walked with Jesus. He saw the miracles.

        Yet, it was not enough for him to allow it to overrule his personal feelings. He ended up with guilt from it, even before he knew what was to come.

        Even the smallest child, Christian household, will protest when they think another child is getting more. Keeping in mind, we are all children of this world and Beelzebub is the Prince of this world.

        • bizbird6

          What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

          I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus never existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

          And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely fiction.7

          • Larry Stauth

            “I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ”

            That’s called free will. But that requires ignoring the proof.

            You should read something from someone who actually is more interested in trying to find the answer, instead of proving an opinion.

            You do know there are people who have written proof that Man never walked on the Moon? They list fact after fact… very convincing too… until you realize they completely ignored the testimony of people who watched the men get in the rocket, and then watched the rocket launch.

            How about you actually check historically correct writings… like the History of Nero, and why he “fiddled while Rome burned”.

            When you finish that, you can research the cipher codes written in the Jewish Toran (commonly known as the Old Testament of the Bible).

            Maybe research the writers, like Moses, Daniel, King David and King Solomon… along with the other Prophets.
            Then explain to men how 66 individual books, can be written over 3,000 years, and be absolutely cohesive. You do know the Bible is NOT one book, right? You also know that the text, originally written in Hebrew and Greek, have been validated as HISTORICALLY CORRECT by every Historical Organization known…

            Not one flaw of date, places or times found.

    • http://www.facebook.com/sstephaniew stephanie wilson

      i know how you feel. [hand slaps head] it drives me nuts too. it def. seems unfair.

    • Nate Kurt D

      but thats the great thing about our God is he forgives u for anything weather we want to accept it or not bc in Gods eyes we are all sinners no matter what the sin is. Even Bin Ladin himself coulda been saved for all the evil acts he has done…its hard to even think about that but if u read the Bible you know its true Paul also know as Saul killed hundreds of Christians and he become the voice of the Lord so anyone can be saved no matter how evil we think they are and thats what makes our Lord so AWESOME

    • Aaron Waters

      It does seem unfair but you have to remember this —>”22 This righteousness is given through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile, 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus. Romans 3:22-24

    • Larry Stauth

      We ALL fall short… Think about this, Paul was the guy holding the coats when they stoned Stephen to death. He would have also been in the group that questioned Jesus before handing Him over to Pilot. He also would have been one of those in the crowd screaming to free Barabbas and to crucify Jesus. Yet, he ended up righting nearly half of the New Testament.

      Salvation is a gift, given willingly from God, and not based on the might or merit of the deeds of men.

      But take heart, because there is the second half… the inheritance. Jesus talked about the men with the coins… and he also told of those being last here versus those first, and how the opposite will be true in Heaven.

      Meaning, those who lifted themselves, will have to wait in line, while those who did without, by chose or suffering, will be first in line.

    • AerynSun2011

      Anyone can speak words that they accept Christ, but if they are not truthful in their heart it will not matter when he meets his maker. God cannot be fooled.

    • Thomas Edison

      Matthew 20

      8 “When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, ‘Call the workers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last ones hired and going on to the first.’

      9 “The workers who were hired about five in the afternoon came and each received a denarius. 10 So when those came who were hired first, they expected to receive more. But each one of them also received a denarius. 11 When they received it, they began to grumble against the landowner. 12 ‘These who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the work and the heat of the day.’

      13 “But he answered one of them, ‘I am not being unfair to you, friend. Didn’t you agree to work for a denarius? 14 Take your pay and go. I want to give the one who was hired last the same as I gave you. 15 Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?’

    • JackGalt

      If God will not forgive him, if he is sincere, then what hope have I, who at times has been worse? Fair would be letting all of humanity perish for eternity. for that is all we deserve. Unfair is that any of us are saved.

  • Darlenam

    It is my belief, that it doesn’t matter how successful a person you are in life, whether you become a billionaire or a bum on the streets, you have to stand before the Lord in judgement as every human has done and will do, there is no escaping it. God doesn’t discriminate, he is an equal opportunity Judge. Again, just my opinion, for what it’s worth…

    • Rattlerjake

      His seeking God is for the “wrong” reason and God will see through this
      imposter. If Turner is really wanting forgiveness, let’s see if he
      works at undoing all of the damage he has helped to do to this country.
      I will be waiting to see if he EVER stands up for Christianity in
      public! Remember – FALSE PROPHETS!

  • LMD

    A lot of people start believing in God when they are getting close to the end of their lives.

    • Larry Stauth

      Yeah, it’s odd, how when people face a life or death tragedy, or severe pain, regardless of age, they all seem to cry out for God in that moment.

      It’s sad how people always ask “Where was God?”, when in fact, they were the ones that pushed Him away.

    • Critin Corner

      exactly my first thought about this story. He can’t buy his way out of death. It’s also true that him saying he is seeking God is only a start. He must truly, actually BELIEVE in his heart and soul in the name of Jesus Christ. Only God will know if he’s done that. He must truly be sorry for the life he’s led – it will show in his daily life– and he will answer for the many he’s caused to err by his words and actions. God is just and knows his heart–God doesn’t play games. People do.

      • Larry Stauth

        Actually.. Scripture says quite clearly… all you must do it believe who Jesus is. Salvation is a gift, not a reward.

        Scripture also does not say anything about guilt for the past, it says to repent. Just simply turn and walk away from your sins.

        As for answering, actually.. not one person who believes in the savior will EVER answer for their sins.

        And God is such a fair Judge, liars and thieves are stated as equals. A sin, is a sin, is a sin.. and sin cannot reside with God…

        That is what Jesus’ purpose was… to make sure none of those who had faith in Him would ever have to answer for their crimes. That includes Mr. Turner, myself and anyone else who ever lived on this earth.

        • Memphis Viking

          You have to do more than believe. Even the demons believe who Jesus is. You also have to repent your sins and accept Jesus as Lord and Savior. Only then do you receive the gift of salvation. But you’re right about the rest.

        • bizbird6

          What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

          I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus never existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

          And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely fiction.
          99

      • BUNIJA

        RIGHT CRITIN,SO IF HE REPENTED AND WAS SERIOUS GOD HAS FRGIVEN HIM,ONLY GOD KNOWS THE HEART OF MAN,THANKS

        KS

    • BUNIJA

      ACTUALLY,people that haven’t accepted Christ as lord and Savior,wont do that after a certain age,they have an attitude,well i didn’t do that when was young PERSON so why would he still love me after all these years,this is a lie from satan,GOD GAVE HIS SON JESUS CHRIST FOR YOU.HE HAS WAITED ON YOU ALL THIS TIME,IF YOU ARE CLOSE TO CHECKING OUT,ASK JESUS FOR FORGIVENESS TODAY,WE HAVE NO PROMISE OF TOMORROW.

      • bizbird6

        What you say is absolute nonsense!

        There is NO Satan and there is NO God!!!

        • BUNIJA

          HELLO BIZ:
          WISHES WONT CHANGE THE FACT YOU ARE INCORRECT,HOWEVER,SINCE I SEE THERE IS NO CHANGING YOUR MIND,CONTINUE TO FEEL THIS WAY,AND WHEN YOU STAND BEFORE THE CREATOR,YOU EXPLAIN TO HIM WHY HE DOESN’T EXIST,WISH I COULD CHANGE YOUR MIND, BUT GOD HAS GIVEN US A FREE WILL TO CHOOSE. REMEMBER GOD STILL LOVES YOU.

    • BUNIJA

      THANKS LMD U DID BRING UP A POINT WE DONT SEE OFTEN
      HAVE A GR8 DAY

    • genann59

      And unfortunately many die before realizing what they are missing out on. No one can take it for granted they will live long enough to be able to repent. You never really know when you time on earth is up, better to make yourself ready before that time.

  • haloperidal

    Mr. Turner is in his personal “end times” and apparently recognizes the futility of it all without an afterlife. While most people recognize this long before, late learning is better than not learning.

  • Debbie Ballard

    Don’t know where this article says he’s seeking God. Just because there is a mention of heaven in no way says he is seeking. God says “when you seek Me within all of your heart mind and soul you will find Me”. Just because someone’s at the end of his life and crossing his fingers he is wrong about God doesn’t mean he is seeking squat.

    • marmo43

      you are correct, never thought about it in that light. islamist seek heaven too along with their 72 virgins

    • dwight-watt@att.net

      The article at CNN actually said he prays to God at times as he is trying to determine things and as he sees people hurting so the original article did say he was seeking who God is and how he fits in his life. And yes Christians are conservatives and liberals. Just as they are former Jews and Gentiles and were Romans and non-Romans.

  • Janice Howard Penny

    By that first paragraph how could anyone tell you are a Christian? You’re calling his life miserable – staring into an abyss, oh, did I forget you called him an “idiot lefty”. It seems to me that most people realize someone is a Christian by their love. I only hear judgemental, hateful, and rebellious comments in this paragraph?! Maybe if us “Christians” talked, spoke, and even authored blessings for all the good things about other people instead of acting as though they are the pit of the earth that we walk all over “WE” wouldn’t get such a bad rap and would accomplish leading more people to the Lord. Romans 3 says, “For ALL have sinned and have fallen short of the glory of God” and that includes me and even you. Thank you Jesus! Also, its very ironic that there’s a disclaimer here in your posting policy that asks your readers not to post any violent, racist, profanity, or discourteous behavior when you did that yourself in this article. Interesting.

  • Frank Tillman

    Cut this man some slack he was/is mentally unstable don;t forge the married Jane Fonda and after she ditched him he nearly committed the big “S”.

  • Joshua Kent

    Rightly so, in death most people do call out on God, yet the thief on the cross did the same thing.

    As Christians we should not judge others in so much as what we see is what we judge, however in warning people about Hell, death and judgement from God in the end we are technically judging others at a basic level. The only judgement we can accurately cast if a judgment at all is to tell people without Christ there is only sorrow and hell and that if they don’t accept Christ they will torment in Hell forever.

    This list includes, some of what Paul said,

    “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be
    not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor
    effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.”

    1 Corinthians 6:9-10

    Also note to whom he was speaking to in the latter verse:

    ” And
    such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye
    are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our
    God.”

    Complicated as it sounds, Paul was teaching this to believers, with unbelievers around sort of like modern day church but more so with the application of being in the street due to the FACT that all the Apostles were dirt poor and could not afford a fancy Crefflo Dollar or Joel Osteen Church to “preach” from.

    • justice

      Amen brother

  • Tarheel_Soldier

    This man has chosen to accept God in his heart. Why make it a political statement? I am glad that he has become my brother in Christ, and if you are a true Christian you should be glad, too. Praise God from whom all blessings flow! Mr. Turner is just as worthy of Heaven as I am, as long as he seeks Jesus with a truly open heart. I am so thankful that God is a merciful and gracious God and accepts us as we are.

    • Jose

      Brother, Kevin wasn’t making Ted’s ‘seeking God’ a political statement. He was making a political point that we should be winning over these lefties before age 75. I agree.

      I pray Ted is sincere about seeking God, as his heart and his sincerity will be the fulcrum defining his residence in eternity.

      • genann59

        The Bible tells us that the angels in heaven rejoice even more so when an apparent lost soul is saved. If Turner is true in his repentance, the angels must be rejoicing in true earnest. I hope he is sincere, the more souls who repent, the fewer Satan steals from Jesus.

    • Rattlerjake

      False credit – Turner DID NOT save the American Bison. All he did was create a niche for breeding them for PROFIT, if there wasn’t a dollar to be made he would never have done anything for them. The American Bison was saved by the millions or billions of dollars that hunters spend that goes to conservation efforts to manage the bison as a game animal. Where’s all of the effort and money from turner to help any other endangered animal or plant? NONE, because the majority of other endangered species have no commercial value.

    • larrygrant876

      Not sure he has accepted Jesus Christ or not, doesn’t say, it just seems he’s doing some searching, plus he realizes he’s built an empire that is not fulfilling and means very little. I think when the lights go down even people like the Rolling Stones and Paul McCartney and whoever else must question how much any of it means and how short is the remainder of their stories.

    • bizbird6

      What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

      I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus never existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

      And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely fiction.4

      • Tarheel_Soldier

        That’s okay Bizbird, Jesus Christ believes in you. If you will just open your heart to Him, He’ll still let you in. It’s not an exclusive club or something. I just hope you let him in before it’s too late. I’ll pray for you. If you want to know how to let Him in, just let me know and we can talk about it. I hope you do.

  • Buck Robins

    Debbie is right.

  • http://rau.3littlefoxes.com/ LindaF

    I can certainly understand your animosity towards Jane Fonda, but have you considered that her conversion to Christianity may have been a factor in his change?

    • Neal Avery

      If I remember correctly, he was a hinderance to her conversion. I think he might have made fun of her. That might be why she moved on. Google it.

      • jbdollar

        Read the parable of the sower. If a poking a little fun at a convert causes them to turn away from Christ, they never had it to begin with.

        • Skycop

          But she was searching and in doing so, I am sure that she is a believer in God at this time. One a believer, always a believer, in my humble opinion.

          • jbdollar

            But that is not what is taught in the Bible. If one “leaves the faith”, they never had it from the start. 1 John 2:19

            They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.

    • Judy

      Jane’s conversion was fake. She went to a few Bible studies in the Atlanta area even. But after the divorce and she moved away, someone asked her about her conversion. She said something to the effect that that was just something silly she toyed with. Very sad.

      • Skycop

        I believe that Ted may have criticized Jane for her conversion, but he did not realize that she had converted. She was searching for God also.

    • Skycop

      Yes, I do agree with you on that point.

  • MrsBulldoggy .

    Same type of person who persecutes Christians in the beginning of his life…

  • marmo43

    the apostle paul who turned out to be the one person who did more to spread the Gospel of Christ, was the biggest persecutor of Christians after Christ returned to heaven. he over saw the stoning of Stephen, persecuted many. Blinded by the presence of God, he had a conversion and spread the gospel through out the middle east. it took him many years and several trips, but thank God he did. It is never too late for a person to repent, and a person can’t do anything so bad, God won’t accept him. Just like the prodigal son came back home and his father forgave and put a ring on his finger. Never discount what God is able to do. Just a shame the man wasted his whole life living outside the presence of God Christ and the Holy Spirit

    • bizbird6

      What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

      I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus never existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

      And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely fiction.5

  • Terry Lee

    A swinging toward God, which I hope he does for his own soul, by no means a swing to right for I know a number of Christians who are avowed liberals. I have had them in my churches, well, the churches in which I used to serve.

  • John Samuel Wilson

    “From a political point of view, I suggest we begin winning over these Leftists a bit sooner.” Easier said than done when they refuse to listen to people telling them the same truth they are trying so hard to suppress. Perhaps if more of them were faced with their own mortality?

    • mikec711

      I think it is key to not label and not focus on left vs right. Jesus was not a republican or a democrat. He was not even (gasp!) American. Even the trolling atheists on this blog are creations of a mighty God. If we are obedient, we try to make the introduction between Christ and those who do not know Him … even if obedient, however, it is not our job to bring in the harvest. We are too plant seeds and Christ will handle the harvest. Not right and left, not even those who know Christ and those who do not; it’s about those who have committed their life to Him … and those who have not (whether they be indifferent … or really steamed about it like some folks on this forum … which is sort of funny … because if they just didn’t believe it … they’d not bother with us … if I heard lots of people believed the moon is made of green cheese … I’d find it entertaining, but would not agitatedly confront them on it). They are instead following the old umpire’s addage “The less sure you are of the call, the louder you make it.”

  • genann59

    All that comes to my mind when reading this are the verses in the Bible that speaks of how the angels rejoice even more so when an apparent lost soul is saved. The end game is more than left versus right, or America versus anyone, it is the choice of God over Satan, and if this obviously intelligent man has settled his vanity to the point where he realizes God is in charge of it all, then more power to him, and more so, praise God again. Our time on earth is really short and the only important choice we have to make in this life is to accept Jesus and follow God. So if Turner has realized the error of his ways and God has snatched him out of Satan’s grip, score one more for God. Never really cared for Turner but if he has come to the realization of who is really the supreme being in the Universe, I hope he does not lose his way before he dies. Satan will double the attacks on Turner to try to convince him he is making the wrong move.I don’t care who a person is or what they might have done, if their soul can be saved, more power to them and to God on high.

    • bizbird6

      What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

      I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus never existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

      And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely fiction.8

  • PAGNOLINROME

    I’ve seen a lot of spin in my years, but this guy takes the prize, along with the love of his life Hanoi Jane. Whatever you personally believe as a christian or anti-christian, you would be well advised to question the crap in this story. Consider the source.

  • Albert York

    Saying there are no atheists in foxholes is disrespectful of all of the atheists who risked their lives in service to their country, including all of the superstitious people. http://ffrf.org/outreach/atheists-in-foxholes

  • Judy

    I read this page and the entire CNN interview listed above. Nowhere do I see ole Ted leaning towards God or anything Christian. Am I blind or what?

    • Nanette

      NO you are not..he put it out there IF I get to go to heaven..it is in us to ponder..IF,

      • pnyikos

        I couldn’t find these words anywhere. Which links did you click?

        • Nanette

          Corrected..

          Did I make my Mama and Daddy proud?

          Am I loved?

          Will anybody remember me?

          * Do I get into heaven?

    • pnyikos

      The linked CNN article does say this:

      “A man who has been
      virulently anti-religious admitted he tosses off a little prayer now and
      then, hoping there’s “somebody out there” to hear it.”

      That’s all I could find of Ted Turner’s words–three of them– on the subject. In particular, there is no quote and no reference to the “admission”. You’d think it was in the link “Ten questions for Ted Turner” that appears immediately after the text I quoted, but you won’t even find those three words there.

  • Dale Netherton

    If people believe in what they don’t understand or can provide evidence for, they are fantasizing. The concept of God cannot be defined without contradiction and since contradictions don’t and can’t exist, neither does God.

    • LuriasS

      When you die and are at the Great White Throne Judgment – Then you will KNOW and regret your words and bad decisions. I pray that you open your eyes and your heart before it is too late. We are not promised a tomorrow; Today is the day of Salvation, saith the Lord.
      Psalms 14:1 = “The fool hath said in his heart, ‘There is no God.’ They are corrupt, they have done abominable works, there is none that doeth good.”

      • Dale Netherton

        When you die you will know nothing as your mechanism for knowing will be dust.

    • Dudeahoy

      If people believe in what they don’t understand or can provide evidence for, they are fantasizing. The concept of Evolution cannot be defined without contradiction and since contradictions don’t and can’t exist, neither does Evolution.

      • Dale Netherton

        What is contradictory about the theory of evolution? Can you cite what contradictions you are talking about?

    • mikec711

      Dale, Your post certainly sounds atheistic (vs say agnostic). You do understand that failure to prove God (which is not done here) still does not prove a nonGod. Failure to find OJ guilty of killing 2 people does not prove him innocent. Simple logic (which you seem to have a grasp of) shows that “proving” God and dis”proving” God are equally impossible. If He walked in right now … people could say that it was not “Him”. If you are the age your picture suggests … I find it interesting that you can look at your descendants and see them as nothing more than chemical accidents after billions of years of other chemical accidents. That they could just likely have been slugs, or flowers, or something completely inert. So while I look at my beautiful children as amazing creations in the image of an infinite and marvelous God who created them … you must look at yours as just another accident. No good, no evil, no love (just endorphin being chemically stimulated), no purpose (no purpose is from Bertrand Russell, so you’re bucking a heavy weight atheist if you dispute that one). The funny thing is, if you’re right, we’re both fertilizer and the only difference is I had hope and you didn’t. If I’m right, … good luck man.

      • Dale Netherton

        The proof of God relies on he who claims there is such an existent. You cannot prove a negative which is elementary logic. As for hope there is no hope in impossibilities.

        • mikec711

          You contradicted yourself. You showed you did understand the elementary logic of proving a negative, but then by calling it an impossibility, you have referred to as a negative (and by definition unproven). I hope you enjoy your meaningless and hopeless life with all of the meaningless and hopeless people that your endorphins reach a higher level of stimulation in their presence. I have a loving family and we always hope (and pray) that folks like you with no hope can one day see the absurd science behind abiogenesis (and the recursive question if life was planted from elsewhere), the absurd science in big bang (which flies in the face of Laws of ThermoDynamics and our solar system flies in the face of the laws of conservation of angular velocity) … and the absurdity of things like the eye which has irreducible complexity. I do pray that you feel the emptiness that comes from not knowing your creator … but it’s something you have to come to on your own.

          • bizbird6

            You don’t know what you are talking about!

            You are ALL WET!!!

          • mikec711

            Thanks for enlightening me with so much fact and knowledge bizbird. I’ve actually researched the topics in great length, but since the conclusions disagree with the blogs you read yesterday … I must be wrong. No facts, no evidence, just an empty character assassination. An outside observer would have to say that you are a little light in the area of research and evidence. Thus I have to commend, you are a man of great faith … in nothingness. Sadly, also, a man who has no purpose, no hope, no loved ones (after all, we’re all just responding to electrical stimuli) … and I’d rather have done the research and be all wet, than believing others and having nothing.

          • bizbird6

            Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

            According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

            Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief and social well-being was published in the Journal of
            Religion & Society.

            Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

            Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior, Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage pregnancy than societies where many people profess belief in God.

            Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people – Japan is one of the least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

            (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both mothers and
            children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

            Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced that there is a
            deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do
            twice as badly as the others.
            Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000 people a year.

            At the other end of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of evolution (many believe it had a
            helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five
            times greater than in Europe and ten
            times higher than in Japan.

            All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

            At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals a different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will respect social customs and laws.

            All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.

            Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do
            not share their sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”, they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their priority becomes
            not the world they live in but themselves.

            The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior. Hence gun laws
            which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings who deserve protection, but as potential
            aggressors who deserve to die. And hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

            As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of unwanted
            pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit society as a whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I say”. The result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections.

            Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.

            Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal logic, no matter
            how absurd to outside observers.

            The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public discussion. Look no further
            than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime time television.

            Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere. As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory Paul’s study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you should tell them that God does not exist.”

            I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that God would be an atheist,

            i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies become secular. 31

            http://www.humaniststudies.org

    • Mercyful

      Dale! You do not exist.
      How do you explain all around you from the universe to the little flowers, the human body, the fact that you can think, love, see, smell, etc… how else can you explain all this? It takes more faith to believe that there is no God (sinse you can’t explain how all came to existence) than it takes to believe IN GOD.

      • Dale Netherton

        The universe exists period. It doesn’t need a creator any more than a creator would.

      • bizbird6

        What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

        No, the universe WAS, IS, and WILL ALWAYS BE.

        The UNIVERSE is ETERNAL, while God NEVER EXISTED!

        To say that there was a creator CONTRADICTS the Fundamental Law of Science which is that the TOTAL amount of MATTER and ENERGY in the Universe will always be CONSTANT! 9

    • jbdollar

      And all this came about by accident. Nothing exploded and formed a complex, functional universe. If a creation exists, there must be a Creator. When I pick up a book, I assume there is an author. Your logic makes no sense.

      • bizbird6

        What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

        No, the universe WAS, IS, and WILL ALWAYS BE.

        The UNIVERSE is ETERNAL, while God NEVER EXISTED!

        To say that there was a creator CONTRADICTS the Fundamental Law of Science which is that the TOTAL amount of MATTER and ENERGY in the Universe will always be CONSTANT!

    • AlanWH

      Your Premise, “Contradictions don’t and can’t exist,” for Denying YHVH’S(GOD) Existence is more than a little Flawed. There is Life and Death, Light and Darkness, Good and Evil, Blessing and Cursing, etc. These are All “contradicitons.” The Same ELOHIM(GOD) Who Created The Heavens and The Earth, Genesis 1:1 Created All These Things too. “In the Beginning was The Word and the Word was with ELOHIM(GOD) and The Word was ELOHIM. The Same was in the Beginning with ELOHIM. All Things were Made by HIM and Without HIM was not any thing made that was Made.” John 1:1-3 May HE Open Your Mind and Heart to HIS Eternal Love and Truth. In YAHSHUA’S(JESUS) Name. Amen.

      • Dale Netherton

        Your understanding of contradictions is in error. Life is life and death is death. they are two separate conditions. Likewise darkness and light. etc. Spouting off with scripture is simply repeating ancient guesses as to what everything is all about.

    • pnyikos

      Nowhere do you reveal what this alleged contradiction is. Maybe you mean the superlatives that medieval philosophers gratuitously heaped on “The God of Abraham, Isaak and Jacob” to use Blaise Pascal’s term. You know, omnipotent, omniscient, perfectly benevolent–what he called “The God of the Philosophers.” This may surprise a lot of people, but there is no warrant in the Bible for such mathematically precise superlatives.

      Let’s see you find a contradiction in “Creator of our physical universe just before the Big Bang.” That’s a concept of God too, you know.

      • Dale Netherton

        A contradiction is” a combination of statements, ideas, or features of a situation that are opposed to one another: the proposed new system suffers from a set of internal contradictions.” Omniscience and omnipotent are contradictory. You cannot have both of these attributes in a single entity ( I.e. God ) as they are opposed to one another. You cannot be all knowing and all powerful simultaneously. This cannot be reconciled and therefore God cannot exist.

        • Mercyful

          I feel sorry for you and for all who say that there is no God. There will be a day when every knee shall bow, regardles of what you believe. Then there will be judgement for all who rejected our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ.
          I pray for God to reveal himself to you and to make himself known to you. May God be merciful and gracious to you.
          In Jesus’ name I pray, Amen.

          • Dale Netherton

            You should feel sorry for yourself because you have swallowed a big con .

          • Mercyful

            OK! I will pray harder for you:
            Lord, I come to you right now with a special request.
            Open Dale’s eyes and let him see that you ARE the God of the Universe, that Jesus IS the only one who died on the cross for all our sins, resurrected on the 3rd day, sent the Holy Spirit to be with us, ascended to heaven and is sitting on the right hand of His Father, our God, from where He will come (soon) and rapture the ones who believe in Him so we’ll be reunited in heaven for ever.
            Lord, let Dale see that you ARE REAL and that You LOVE him.
            In Jesus’ name I pray. Amen.

          • Dale Netherton

            As to be expected there is nothing to indicate your wishing has any potency.

          • Mercyful

            Wait and pay attention, He will manifest Himself at the right time.

          • Dale Netherton

            This has been the promise for two thousand years. Its based on nothing but fear mongering. That which doesn’t exist can make nothing happen.

          • Mercyful

            Tell me: what would you loose if you’d check it out by listen or reading about Jesus? What do you gain by being so stubborn?
            Read Lee Strobel’s books, he was an atheist and decided he was going to proove to the world that there was no God. Just read his books and see for yourself.

          • Dale Netherton

            What I would lose is the use of reason. What I gain is integrity. Those who turn to faith are wasting their intellectual life on a bogus claim.

          • Mercyful

            Did you try to get some information before you made up your mind? I still like you to read Strobel’s books. I just hate to see anyone going to be eternally lost because they didn’t take the time to do some research.

          • Dale Netherton

            Ask yourself. ” What could Strobel or anyone else say to provide evidence for God?” The answer is nothing. NO reason to waste time on reading about the same old disproven arguments that there is a God. Likewise there is no afterlife. No need to worry about it.

          • Mercyful

            OK Dale, you have the right to choose and so you did.
            I still hope and pray our Lord reaches out to you and lets you see the truth BEFORE it’s too late. I wish you well.

          • bizbird6

            Why are you Christians always defending God?

            Isn’t God suppose to be omnipotent? He is strong enough to speak and defend himself isn’t he? Why does he need to you weak mortal beings to always speak for him? Why is he so silent?

            Doesn’t the fact that he is so silent shows that maybe he does NOT exist and maybe NEVER existed at all?

            Doesn’t this SILENCE speak LOUDER than all your screaming and shouting? 45

  • Gary Seymour

    Anyone can come to Christ, even Ted. Look me up anytime Ted if you want to say the sinners prayer. I’m praying for you

    • jbdollar

      There is more to it than the sinner’s prayer. His heart needs to be transformed and his eyes opened to see his sin, turn from it, and recognize Jesus Christ as the Redeemer. His wife Jane was “born again” at one time, to no avail. Millions have “prayed a prayer” and have become just a slightly more religious version of their old sinful self. If any person is in Christ they are a new creation. If there is no renewing of the mind there is no salvation.

      • Gary Seymour

        agreed, it’s not about religion; from that I say run. It’s about relationship. Thanks for the post

  • Haymster

    Ted Turner Must Have Listened To Black Sabbath On 78 Speed.

  • dnav

    It almost sounds like the writer of the article is mad that Turner got to have fun and live the high life and repent in the end and be saved.

    Why should you be mad?

    Be thankful you have known God your whole life and have done deeds worthy of a great reward and inheritance in the heavenlies and be thankful that another lost one was rescued, it’s a fantastic testimony that the high life could never fill the void.

    Welcome Ted, I pray that you truly turn to the lord in your heart and then continue in the Word and that you come to know the truth and that the truth makes you free.

  • fidlin1

    God wishes no man to perish. There is a plan for your life. If there is breath you are still on the journey. Make it count. Listen to the Lord, surround yourself with wise Godly counsel that wants nothing personally from you and has good fruit. Make a mark and leave a legacy that will stand the test of time and will last in eternity. YOU ARE THE GREATEST TREASURE.

    • bizbird6

      What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

      I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus NEVER existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

      And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely FICTION. 8

  • Dwayne

    My first thought was “screw him”. But within a second I re-thought it and thought, “well good for him, at last he sees the light”.

  • bbnnmm

    ALL, All, all, did I mention A-L-L, will eventually seek and realize and accept the TRUTH that IS GOD and be saved. Some sooner than others but ALL none the less. I guess it’s Ted’s time. God will not lose any of His beloved creations, period. Because that would make Him and His Son Jesus a failure at redemption and that is a Spiritual IMPOSSIBILITY. His Mercy is forever and beyond our comprehension. AMEN!

    • Mercyful

      You are wrong! God does not force anyone to accept the gift of salvation.
      He gave us a “free will” and we decide if we want to belong to God’s Family or not.
      Whoever rejects the Trinity (God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit) will NOT get to go to heaven and will be eternally and hopelesly separated from God.
      Gos is perfect and so is the place where all the ones that accepted Christ will be. He can not allow imperfect beings to roam around because then it would not be perfect anylonger.
      The only way to become worthy of this place is by accepting the gift of salvation that was paid for by Jesus’ shedding of blood on the cross. He gave us the promise of life after this worldly one by His resurrection. Jesus did it willingly because He loves us so much but, we must accept Him as our Savior.
      There is nothing else we can do to get to heaven. He paid the full price.
      Some say they want to be where all their friends are (hell) and do not realize that hell is the most lonely place there is. There is nothing good in hell: no friends, no one to talk to, only pain and suffering.
      Today is the day that we must accept Christ, tomorrow it could be too late.

      • bizbird6

        What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

        I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus NEVER existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

        And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely FICTION. 1

      • bbnnmm

        Who said anything about FORCE??? ALL will come to realize the truth by the GRACE of God, no force there folks.

    • fdleupp

      Wrong. He “is not willing that any should be lost” 2Peter 3:9. He will force no one, else why would He “…stand at the door and knock?”

      • bbnnmm

        Who said anything about FORCE??? ALL will come to realize the truth by the GRACE of God, no force there folks.

    • Jane18

      Sorry, not “all” will choose GOD…

  • gundlr

    Let’s just hope that Ted Turner will get the right advice and listen to the servants of God, and not the servants of Satan that are sent to lie and deceive. Ted the only answer is Jesus Christ, not a church, religion, sect or cult. Listen to men like Charles Stanley, David Jeremiah and or John Hagee. It is the blood of Jesus Christ that cleaness from all sin. Trust in Him and Him alone and you shall be saved. Then find a good church that teaches the Bible and you will grow in grace and knowledge of our wondrous Lord. God be with you.

    • bizbird6

      What you say is absolute nonsense!!!

      I don’t believe there was ever even a Jesus Christ. You should read a book by Earl Doheny. Earl claimed that Jesus never existed. Why don’t you look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

      And while you are doing that, you should also look up Bart Ehrman and Bishop John Spong. They wrote many books that the Bible is a completely fiction.

  • ADRoberts

    There was NO video. There was NO indication that he actually is thinking that he is going to have to answer for his actions compared to what God wanted him to do.
    So where is this “turning to find God.?”

  • just_reality

    Thanks for referencing the CNN article (not sure if everyone read it though). Kind of amazing that he has done so much good and donated so much money to others without being religious.

    • Carline D. Long Jr.

      Good hearted does not always also mean right minded. It is never too late to believe. He is on the right path :)

      • just_reality

        Just thinking that Mr. Turner has done all this good for others with no belief in there being a reward for it in an afterlife and no belief in there being punishment if he did harmful things to others. To me, that puts him in a rare and admirable class compared to most of the CEOs and uber-rich people I have read about. Some earlier commentors had some harsh words for him, but in the big picture, we could use more people who do good, and do it not out of sense of fear or obedience, but just because they have chosen to love their neighbor as themselve.

  • jbdollar

    But God said to him, ‘Fool! This night your soul will be required of you; then whose will those things be which you have provided?” So is he who lays up treasure for himself and is not rich toward toward God.” Luke 12:20-21, Parable of the Rich Fool, the words of our Lord Jesus Christ.

  • LifeDontWasteIt

    Seven things the the Lord hates (!)… ‘haughty eyes”…
    Let’s all realize we are just as big of sinners as Ted Turner is! God resists/opposes the proud, but gives grace to the humble. Only God’s grace saves anyone of us. I hope Ted finds the real Truth in Jesus Christ. :)

  • Jeffrey Liggens

    “I suggest we begin winning over these Leftists a bit sooner.” The only thing cynicism tends to win is rejection and division. Many “so-called’ Christian conservatives need to humble themselves and seek Jesus Christ THEMSELVES, that He might live through them to win others whom might not share their political views. As they point their finger with their condescending attitude at the “Liberals”, many are as bereft of virtue as those they condemn. Jesus Christ has nothing to do with this behavior towards people.

  • tapp8277pw

    I’m viewing this as a prompt to pray for Ted, a man whom God loves and Jesus died for. What great news that he is now coming to the end of himself! Let’s all spend some time interceding for him that he, like Ted Knight, will discover the truth about God and the truth about himself, become deeply convicted about what he is to do and give himself wholly to Jesus.

  • KittyKittyKit

    Ted, you’ve lived a pretty amazing, successful and accomplished life. Probably done an extreme amount of good, and who knows, maybe you p–ssed a lot of people off too……..in the end, the rich, the poor, the slave, and the free man, all have to face those final days and hours before we “cross-over” to whatever is on the other side.
    I hope you’ll understand this. There was a man born into this world in the poorest of conditions, and by all evidence, lived a “perfect life” that could be flawed by only one claim, that, IF it could be proved FALSE, he would NOT be perfect, but one of the greatest FRAUDS of all time.
    This man claimed to be “The ONLY begotten Son of God”. He said, ” If you don’t believe the “words” I’m telling you, then believe me for the works (miracles) sake because they prove what I’m saying is true, that NO OTHER MAN has ever done these kinds of miracles and could NOT do them unless he was sent from GOD.”
    He went on to say, (para-phrasing) Look folks, I’m the GOOD SHEPHERD, the good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. I’m going to lay down my life for MY SHEEP. MY SHEEP hear MY voice, and will not follow another. MY SHEEP hear my voice and they follow ME, and “I” give unto them eternal life.”
    I know that’s a BIG CLAIM but I tell you before it comes to pass, that you may believe me when it happens, that I am going to LAY DOWN my life for YOU that I might take it again. NO MAN TAKES MY LIFE but “I” lay it down. After I have allowed them to KILL me, I’ll be put in the grave, and I will RISE AGAIN the THIRD DAY after I’m put to death, so you might KNOW of a surety, that I HAVE THE POWER over life and death and I ALONE, HAVE THE POWER to give MY SHEEP, MY FOLLOWERS, ETERNAL LIFE.
    So this man went about doing GOOD,…….HEALING THE SICK…….RAISING THE DEAD………SPEAKING THE TRUTH……….DOING MIRACLES. NO ONE DISPUTES THESE FACTS ABOUT HIM….not even the ones who planned to have him killed.
    The TOP RELIGIOUS PEOPLE, the nicest, most famous people, of his day, and culture, thought that he was a fraud and a BLASPHEMER for saying, of himself, that GOD was “his father” and he was his ONLY BEGOTTEN SON. Such blasphemy, in their minds, deserved a DEATH PENALTY, no matter how much good he’d done…………and even they had to admit they could find NO ACCUSATIONS against the man.
    This man KNEW from the beginning that these TOP RELIGIOUS POLITICIANS and MEDIA MOGULS of their day, would put a plan together to KILL him, because it had been prophesied of this man for thousands of years……and now he was here………a PERFECT MAN……the ONLY MAN who could lay claim to being the Son of God, because, without any descent, EVERY ONE KNOWS GOD IS PERFECT…….and only God could empower a man to do the MIRACLES this man did, and then voluntarily lay down his life for EVERY PERSON in the world, even those who would vilely beat him and crucify him, and FORGIVE THEM, and then go and suffer in HELL, as a SUBSTITUTE for ANYONE who would accept this PERSONAL OFFERING OF HIMSELF in their place, and thereby, HE ALONE, EARNED THE “RIGHT” TO ETERNAL LIFE, having NEVER “missed the mark” (sinned), by willfully committing an “IMPERFECT ACT” (sin), which would have made him IMPERFECT and no longer able to be JOINED or CONNECTED to his PERFECT FATHER, GOD. He would be just like you and me……imperfect beings, because ALL OF US have willfully committed at least ONE (and that is all it takes to become imperfect) IMPERFECT ACT, and have, thereby, fallen SHORT of the PERFECTION OF GOD. Had he “sinned”, committed any imperfect act, he could NEVER have done the miracles he did, or be able to be “raised from the dead” any more than “we” could because the WAGES, of “sin”, is DEATH, (eternal separation from God, life, light, love, wisdom,)
    “WE”, (if we KNOW we are NOT “perfect”), know we NEED someone PERFECT to “stand-in” for us, someone who is ONE OF US, who understands us, because he “is” one of us, and can stand between us and his Father, and say, IF THEY DON’T TRY TO TRUST IN THEIR OWN WORKS AND DEEDS but will accept the FACT, that I ALONE am PERFECT and YOUR ONLY BEGOTTEN SON, and accept my personal sacrifice for them, in their place, because they EARNED eternal separation and suffering and HELL by willfully doing WRONG things, but “I” NEVER DID ANYTHING WRONG to deserve a moments separation from you, let alone HELL, but I have obeyed you, because of the GLORY you set before me, I dispised the shame of the cross, and VOLUNTARILLY LAID DOWN MY LIFE FOR ALL OF MANKIND, that they can BE ETERNALLY JOINED UNTO YOU AGAIN, THROUGH ME, if they will accept my sacrifice of my own life for them, and FAITH that I AM LORD and you have RAISED ME FROM THE DEAD, they will be saved.
    I wrote EVERY PERSON’S NAME in the BOOK OF LIFE, as a BENEFICIARY of MY INHERITANCE from BEFORE the foundation of the world, to GUARANTEE to EVERY PERSON the opportunity to receive ETERNAL LIFE, if they will acknowledge it as an INHERITANCE that belongs to ME ALONE and I am GIVING IT AS A GIFT, A GRANT, if they will accept it.
    NO ONE has to accept the GIFT of eternal life PROVIDED BY MY HAND, my works, my life, if they don’t want to. They can try to stand on their ” own merit” if they want to, but they need the ONLY STANDARD OF MERIT you will accept is PERFECTION…….otherwise, my having lived a “perfect life” is meaningless.
    If they choose to REJECT my INHERITANCE, which I have officially transferred to them by putting their name in the BENEFICIARY LIST of my last will and testament, then their NAME is to be ERASED OUT of the BOOK OF LIFE, and WHOSOEVER is NOT FOUND WRITTEN in the Book of Life, will be cast into the LAKE OF FIRE with Devil and his angels…………..but it purely THEIR FREE-WILL CHOICE.
    I HAVE SAVED EVERYONE FROM ETERNAL DEATH AND HELL. IT’S A DONE DEAL. NO MAN CAN EARN IT OR DESERVE IT. IT HAS TO BE ACCEPTED AS AN INHERITANCE, BUT THEY DON’T HAVE TO ACCEPT IT, JUST BECAUSE IT’S OFFERED TO THEM……….I PREDESTINATED THEM TO BE CONFORMED TO THE IMAGE OF THE SON OF GOD, BUT THEY WILLFULLY CHOSE AGAINST THAT AND CHOSE ETERNAL SEPARATION AND HELL……IT WAS THEIR CHOICE, NOT MINE.
    Do NOT FEAR for babies, and badly mentally retarded individuals, or ANYONE who has never HEARD of my NAME and what I did for them. Even if they DIE, their name is STILL IN THE BOOK OF LIFE because they did NOT have the ability or opportunity to CHOOSE to accept my inheritance for them, and they will be exempt from being cast into the Lake of Fire, at the Great White Throne Judgment, at the end of my 1000 year reign. These folks do NOT stand before MY JUDGMENT SEAT, called the BEMA seat, because ONLY THOSE who learned of me, and ACCEPTED me, and those who learned of me and REJECTED me, will stand before me. Those who ACCEPTED MY SACRIFICE enter into ETERNAL LIFE, and those who chose to REJECT my sacrifice are cast down to hell……..either way, IT WAS THEIR FREE CHOICE…….but NO ONE can enter into the presence of my FATHER unless you come THROUGH ME, because I AM THE ONLY PERFECT ONE. I, ALONE, am THE way,….THE truth…..and THE LIFE, and NO ONE comes unto the Father but through me.
    Do we have a deal?……..Isn’t that GOOD NEWS??? YOU, whosoever you are, can have ETERNAL LIFE, if you will simply come to God TODAY, and tell him you’re not perfect, and you believe his ONLY BEGOTTEN SON is perfect and that he gave his life for you and you are SORRY for EVERY willfully imperfect act (sin) you ever committed, and ask him to FORGIVE YOU for those acts, and then ASK JESUS to come into your heart RIGHT NOW because he says “Behold I stand at the DOOR (of your heart) and KNOCK…..if ANY MAN hear my voice, and OPEN UNTO ME, I WILL COME INTO HIM…..and sup with him, and he with me.” “I WILL NEVER LEAVE YOU NOR FORSAKE YOU that you might BOLDLY SAY, the LORD IS MY HELPER and find help in time of need.”
    HE THAT HAS THE SON, HAS LIFE………..HE THAT HAS NOT THE SON OF GOD, SHALL NOT SEE LIFE, but the wrath of God abides upon him.
    Once you truly repent of your sin and invite THE SON OF GOD into your heart, YOU HAVE THE SON, forever, and you HAVE “eternal life”……it’s your choice.
    ONE LAST THING…………the NAME OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF THE TRUE AND ONLY LIVING GOD IS JESUS CHRIST OF NAZARETH OF THE GALILEES IN ISRAEL, ……….his name is Jesus, and he loves you…invite him in TODAY. Yesterday is past, and no one is guaranteed tomorrow…..do it TODAY, while it is called TODAY.
    God bless all of you.

  • Truly Worried

    The only difference between a Christian & non believer is forgiveness of Christ! We humans are ALL sinners. period.

    • bizbird6

      There is NO such thing as SIN. Sin is an invention that never existed.

      And since there is no sin, FORGIVENESS is NOT NEEDED!

      • Gary Seymour

        The true humanist has spoken. Jesus to you:

        Joh_8:44 You are of your father the devil, and your will is to do your father’s desires. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he lies, he speaks out of his own character, for he is a liar and the father of lies.

  • old_salty_dawg99

    If Ted has truly accepted GOD then GREAT but if he is like far to many(one is too many) people who have been conned by people like Joel Osteen and Rick Warren he will still have the same fate as he was facing before he supposedly accepted GOD. Now if he accepted CHRIST as his Savior and truly has become a child of GOD I say GREAT JOB Teddy boy. Welcome to the Family. I pray the latter is why he has changed and that he becomes a great asset for GOD on earth America needs someone who can counter Obammy’s actions that are DESTROYING America.

    • johnnywood

      I must have missed something as I did not notice that he actually claimed to have turned to GOD. He simply “looked over the edge” as his life is winding down and it scarred him. Or maybe I missed that part of this post.

  • bizbird6

    Who killed some 3000 innocent people
    in NY City in 2001, Believers or Non-believers?

    If these believing Muslim were Atheists or Agnostics, these 3000 or so New York
    victims would be alive today.

    Religion results in far more harm and evil than good.

    Look at all those religious wars, the Inquisition, burning of heretics, and
    suicidal bombings where thousands were victims.

    World War 1 and 2 results in the death of Millions and Millions, and yet the
    main participants of both wars were all Catholics (Italy and Germany),
    Christians (Germany), and Shintoist (Japan).

    Both the population and leaders of those countries were raised and brought up
    in Traditional Religion which did nothing to prevent the Wars and the slaughter
    of Millions.

    For example, Hitler and Mussolini were raised as Catholics and Stalin was
    raised a Russian Orthodox (I heard Stalin even wanted to be a priest in his
    childhood days. Hitler was even a Catholic Altar Boy when he was a Child.)

    It is not of LACK of belief, but strong BELIEF in religion that causes all
    this Harm and Evil in the World.

    It would be much better for the World if we ALL ABANDON TRADITIONAL Religion
    and adopt a Non-religious Belief.

    The FASTEST Growing Religion in the World today is “Non-Belief”,
    which increased from almost zero over 100 years ago to the third largest Belief
    in the World (next to Christianity and Islam).

    I predict that it will be the largest Belief in the next 100 years or
    sooner. I would NOT even be surprised if almost all Religious Belief will be
    extinct as Greek Mythology by then.

    • Gary Seymour

      your comment about religion doing more harm then good is the only smart thing you have said in all of your posts. That is why you need Christ; He is not a religion, He is the greatest love relationship you will ever know. If you’re married, you don’t have a religion with her do you? Of course not, you have a relationship with her. Well, I don’t have a religion with Christ; I have a relationship with Him. Case closed. Now go to bed before you embarrass yourself any further.

      Rom_10:13 For “everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved.”

  • bizbird6

    Religious People Branded As Less Intelligent Than
    Atheists In Provocative New Study

    The Huffington Post | By Macrina Cooper-White
    Posted: 08/14/2013 3:48 pm EDT | Updated: 08/15/2013
    11:47 am EDT

    That’s the provocative conclusion of a new review of 63 studies of intelligence and religion that span the past century. The meta-analysis showed that in 53 of the studies, conducted between 1928 to 2012, there was an inverse relation between religiosity — having religious beliefs, or performing religious rituals — and intelligence. That is, on average, non-believers scored higher than religious people on intelligence tests.

    What might explain the effect?

    Scientists behind studies included in the review most often suggested that “religious beliefs are irrational, not anchored in science, not
    testable and, therefore, unappealing to intelligent people who ‘know better.’”

    But the researchers who conducted the new meta-analysis say the answer is a bit more complicated. They suspect intelligent people might have less of a “need” for religion.

    “Intelligence may also lead to greater self-control ability,
    self-esteem, perceived control over life events, and supportive relationships,
    obviating some of the benefits that religion sometimes provides,” study
    co-author Jordan Silberman, a graduate student of neuroeconomics at the
    University of Rochester, told The Huffington Post in an email.

    So if you’re a believer, does this mean you’re a dope?

    “I’m sure there are intelligent religious people and unintelligent atheists out there,” Silberman said in the email. “The findings pertain to the average intelligence of religious and non-religious people, but they don’t necessarily apply to any single
    person. Knowing that a person is religious would not lead me to bet any money
    on whether or not the person is intelligent.”

    The researchers acknowledge the limitations of the meta-analysis. It did not look at type of religion, for example, or at the role culture might play in the interaction between religiosity and intelligence.

    In addition, The Independent pointed out that the researchers used a narrow definition of intelligence. In the paper, intelligence is defined as “the ability to reason, plan, solve problems, think abstractly, comprehend complex ideas, learn quickly, and learn from experience.” This excludes other forms of intelligence, like creative and emotional intelligence.

    The meta-analysis was published in Personality and Social Psychology Review.

    Quick Poll

    What do you think about the study’s bold claim?

    I’m a total believer in the study –it makes a lot of sense.

    56.22%

    I have no faith in the study’s findings — believers are just as smart as non-believers.

    15.81%

    It’s just researchers playing with statistics — it doesn’t apply to individual people.

    28 %

    • Girlie58

      Sorry for the atheists when they die and find out while in hell, that there is a God. The smartest creation by God is Satan and he is succeeding in deceiving people, like the atheists, that there is no God. So sorry for you guys. We know who your God is.

      • johnnywood

        Ps. 14:1 “The fool has said in his heart,There is no GOD….”

        • bizbird6

          You are the fool!

          • Gary Seymour

            Hey, a fool trying to blame someone else. You follow your master, Satan. You’re a good puppet

          • johnnywood

            I won`t say what you are.

      • bizbird6

        The whole BASIS of Religion (including of Christianity and other 30 or so major Religions) is BASED on PROMISES.

        The Promises is that if a person becomes an Adherent of that Religion and behaved in a certain REQUIRED way, then he or she will be given a reward after his or her death. (Although some Religions don’t promise such a reward!)

        Yet, has these promises ever been kept? Has any one ever died, returned from the dead, and testify that there is indeed such a reward? I certainly never heard of such a case.

        Remember also that many of these Religions contradict each other. For example, Islam says Christians who refuses to abandon their faith and convert to Islam will go to hell! Other faiths has also stated similar laws.

        So the question is what happens if an adherent dies and one Religion says that he or she will go to heaven and another Religion says that he or she will go to Hell! Where does this person go to then?

        • Gary Seymour

          Please don’t lump Christianity, which is solely based on relationship, with your dead Catholic religion based on works; you’ll never be good enough to earn your way to heaven and Mary is not listening; she’s dead!!!!!. My relationship with Christ is alive and your religion is dead and decaying like this old world

    • johnnywood

      “Figures don`t lie but liars do figure.”

    • Gary Seymour

      If you accept Christ now and then when you come to the end of your life and it wasn’t true, He wasn’t true, then you’ve lost nothing. But if He was true, and the only way to get into heaven,then you’ve lost everything. You’re apparently not even intelligent enough to to know that much. Even the trees raise their branches to heaven; they can’t speak a word but are smart enough to praise the God of heaven and earth.

  • bizbird6

    The Bible is an extremely inaccurate and a Fraud.

    The Bible is full of misquotes, lies, and forgeries. You need to read two Bible experts who spent a lifetime studying the Bible. One is Bart Ehrman,
    who have written some 20 books already about the Bible. One of them is in the “Top Ten Best Seller list” called, “Misquoting Jesus”. The
    other is Bishop Spong who retired from the Episcopal Church.

    Both of them are experts on the Bible and both of them said that the Bible is full of inaccuracies, lies, and forgeries. They not only studied the Bible as you know
    them today, but also the original ancient text that the Bible today were
    translated from. Many of the ancient or medieval translators were amateurs, liars,
    fiction creators, or extremely poor translators that completely misread
    the earlier Bible.

    The Bible is NOT an piece of “revelation that was dropped from heaven”, but a Human piece written and translated over the many centuries by imperfect, fallible, ignorant, and erroneous Human Beings who don’t know any better.

    We must never use the Bible as our guide, but regard this as just a piece of FICTION and NOTHING MORE.

    • johnnywood

      I believe that most of the early church fathers and theologians would disagree with you and John Spong.

    • Gary Seymour

      You’re funny, but pathetic can be funny too. The fool has said in his heart there is no God.

  • bizbird6

    John Shelby Spong

    Retired American Bishop of the Episcopal Church

    GET UPDATES FROM John Shelby Spong

    Gospel of John: What Everyone Should Know About The Fourth Gospel

    Posted: 06/11/2013 12:09pm

    Almost any poll of regular church goers will reveal that their favorite book in the New Testament is the Gospel of John. It is the book that is most often used at Christian funerals. It includes such well known and oft-quoted texts as: “God so
    loved the world that he gave his only son that whoever believes in him should
    not perish but have everlasting life.” It boasts the shortest verse in the
    Bible: “Jesus wept,” which serves the needs of many cross word puzzle
    creators. Its prologue was used for centuries in Catholic liturgies as
    “the last gospel” at the mass. It includes characters like Doubting
    Thomas, whose very name has entered our public discourse.

    Yet, I suspect that if these devotees of John’s Gospel were introduced to the world of Johannine scholarship, they would be both shocked and angered by contemporary insights into this treasured book. It is to place much of this scholarship into the public arena that I have written the book, “The Fourth Gospel: Tales of a Jewish Mystic.”

    Among the conclusions that I have reached in my intensive five-year-long study
    of John’s Gospel are these:

    1) There is no way that the Fourth Gospel was written by John Zebedee or by any of the disciples of Jesus. The author of this book is not a single individual, but is at least three different writers/editors, who did their layered work over a period of 25
    to 30 years.

    2) There is probably not a single word attributed to Jesus in this book that the Jesus of history actually spoke. This includes all the “I Am” sayings and all of the
    “Farewell Discourses.”

    3) Not one of the signs (the Fourth Gospel’s word for miracles) recorded in this book was, in all probability, something that actually happened. This means that Jesus never changed water into wine, fed a multitude with five loaves and two fish or raised Lazarus from the dead.

    4) Many of the characters who appear in the pages of the Fourth Gospel are literary creations of its author and were never intended to be understood as real people, who actually lived in history. This includes Nathaniel, who is introduced with great fanfare in chapter one and is treated in John’s Gospel as one of
    “the Twelve,” as well as the enigmatic character called by the Fourth
    Gospel “the disciple whom Jesus loved,” who is introduced in Chapter
    13 and who stars in this narrative from then on up to and including the
    resurrection event. Between those two “bookend” characters, we run
    into such well-known figures as Nicodemus, the Samaritan woman by the well, the
    man crippled for 38 years and the man born blind, none of whom has ever been
    mentioned before in any written Christian source and each of whom in all
    probability is nothing more than the literary creation of the author.

    5) John’s Gospel seems to ridicule anyone who might read this book as a work of literal history. For example, Jesus says to Nicodemus: “You must be born again.”
    Nicodemus, the literalist, says: “Born again? I am a grown man! How can I
    crawl back into my mother’s womb and be born again?”
    Jesus says to the Samaritan woman: “If you know the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you ‘Give me a drink,’ you would have asked him and he would give you living water.” The Samaritan woman, a literalist, responds: “Man, you
    don’t even have a bucket!”

    6) The Gospel also exaggerates its details, once more I believe, to counter any attempt to read it literally. For example, Jesus does not just turn water into wine, he turns it into 150 gallons of wine! Jesus does not just give sight to a blind man, he gives sight to a man born blind! Jesus does not just raise a person from the dead, he raises one who has been dead and even buried for four days, one who is still bound in grave clothes and one who, according to the King James translation “already stinketh” with the odor of decaying flesh!

    Finally this book will challenge the way the Fourth Gospel has been used in Christian history as the guarantor of what came to be called Christian orthodoxy or creedal Christianity. The Council of Nicea in 325 C.E. leaned on the Fourth Gospel as literal history in order to formulate the creeds and ultimately to undergird uch doctrines as the Incarnation and the Holy Trinity.

    The texts used to support that creedal development, my studies have led me to affirm, have nothing to do with an external God entering humanity in the person of Jesus, but are rather attempts to describe the experience of the human breaking the boundaries of consciousness and entering into the transformation available inside a sense of a mystical oneness with God. If that is so, then the Fourth Gospel has the potential to become the primary biblical source upon the basis of which Christianity can be changed dramatically to speak with radical freshness to the 21st century.

    Christianity is not about the divine becoming human so much as it is about the human becoming divine. That is a paradigm shift of the first order.

    These are the conclusions to which my study of John’s Gospel has led me, and they are the conclusions that I explore and document in this book “The Fourth Gospel: Tales of a Jewish Mystic.”

    • johnnywood

      My study of your post proves to me that you either never existed or you are an idiot. BTW, Bishop Spong is a liar and not a true biblical scholar.

      • bizbird6

        You should look up “Bishop John Shelby Spong” in the “Wiki Encyclopedia” and see his BIO and qualifications. You might be surprised to find out how Smart and Qualified he is.

        How many persons do you know that dedicated his whole life to God and the Bible and ended being Bishop.

        Yet, after all those years he realized that BOTH God and the Bible are totally different from what he was told all his life! His life story is very interesting and you need to look him up.

        • Gary Seymour

          bow now or bow later, but you will bow the knee

          • bizbird6

            I rather kick and kick hard!!!

    • Gary Seymour

      you will bow the knee

      • bizbird6

        I rather kick and kick hard!!!!!

  • Girlie58

    May The Lord enter Turner’s heart as he seeks Him. May turner accept Jesus as the only way, the truth, and the life. So that his life can have meaning.

  • bizbird6

    You Christians share the same Religion as Hitler. While he was murdering Jews, he was reading the Bible and praying to God.

    Hitler
    said he was a catholic and he was never excommunicated from the catholic
    church. Some Hitler quotes:

    “I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so.”— Adolf
    Hitler, to Gen. Gerhard Engel, 1941

    “I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the
    Almighty Creator.”— Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, p. 46

    “I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Almighty Creator. By
    fighting the Jews, I am doing the Lord’s work.”— Adolf Hitler, ibid. p. 65

    “This human world of ours would be inconceivable without the practical
    existence of a religious belief.”— Adolf Hitler, ibid. p 152

    You can’t call Hitler not a Christian, because that’s not your call.

    “If all the Christians who have called other Christians ‘not really a
    Christian’ were to vanish, there’d be no Christians left.” – Anonymous.

    • William James Ward

      You may well be on your way to telling Hitler what you think.
      William

      • bizbird6

        Believe it or not, but YOU YOURSELF may be there with Hitler also!

        According to the Islam Religion, Christians who insist on staying Christian rather than convert to Islam is destined to HELL!

        See, that is why those followers of Omar Bin Ladin never felt sorry for what happen in New York in Sept. 2001. They thought that those Christians who were destined for HELL had a wake up call. Now these Christians might now be more aware of the Islam Religion and ultimately save their own souls!

        • William James Ward

          Islamist Moron!!!……………….William

          • bizbird6

            Calling people names doesn’t change the issues!

            Everything that I said is the complete truth.

            There is not just one Religion in the world but dozens and dozens of different Religions. Staying with one Religion may earn you Boy Scout badges, but violating the other Religions at the same time time may earn you a ticket to hell!

            Myself, I am neutral in terms of Religious conflicts. Frankly, I am skeptical on ALL of them.

          • William James Ward

            Jesus said, “I am the way the truth and the life” you
            can’t beat that, until you have a spiritual awakening
            to that fact you are dead in trespasses and sins and
            the Truth is not in you until you call on Him……………………William

          • bizbird6

            Bah!

          • Gary Seymour

            Bow the knee

          • bizbird6

            I rather kick and kick hard!!!

          • Gary Seymour

            praying for you friend

          • bizbird6

            I thank you for praying for me, but I believe that you are wasting your time.

            Why?

            Well, look at the 5,000,000 Jews that died during World War 2. Do you think that they did not pray for deliverance from certain death?

            Of, course they ALL did, everyone of them. You would too if you were in their place.

            Yet, did God save them?

            The answer is “NO”.

            So, see, if God did NOT answer the prayers of 5,000,000 Jews asking to be saved, what makes you think that he will answer your prayers?

            See, that is 5,000,000 proofs that God does NOT answer prayers.

            What proofs do you have that God DOES answer prayers?

          • Gary Seymour

            I will continue to pray for you and that you will truly find the Truth.

            Joh_8:32 and you will know the truth, and the truth will set you free.”

            Rom_8:2 For the law of the Spirit of life has set you free in Christ Jesus from the law of sin and death.

          • bizbird6

            God is NOT loving!!

            1. God murdered thousands or millions in Noah’s flood. He may try to justify it by saying that mankind is wicked. But does that include the children too?

            Is he saying that a 4 or 5 year old child is wicked and deserve to die? How about a 2 year old infant? Wicked also?

            2. Sodom and Gomorrah. Again the people are wicked! But again the Innocent children and infants too?

            3. First Born Egyptians? But these are NOT wicked! God killed them just to teach the stubborn Pharaoh a lesson. Again, this is Loving and JUST????

            4. Canaanites? Again Wicked? (Or Just in the wrong place in the wrong time?) Again, the children and infants are wicked too?

            See, God is NOT Loving at all! In fact, he is a Monster and
            BULLY. Pushing his weight around over those poor humans!

            Murdering men, women, and children are what Genghis Khan, Attila the Hun, Stalin, and Hitler does, not a Loving and Just God.

            That is why we can not accept, worship or believe in such a Monster..

            (See, that is why Hitler murdered all those Jews. He is following the example of his Monster God).1

          • Gary Seymour

            You’re like Jesus said, a blind guide, leading the blind, and both fall into a ditch

        • Gary Seymour

          My prayer for you is that God would strip everything out of your life, EVERYTHING that is blocking you from seeing the Savior who loves you. If that’s your job, so be it, your wealth, so be it, your pride, your possessions, whatever is blocking you from Him, those things I am asking God to remove out of your life and strip every argument, every vain imagination that fills your head, and lay it all bare before His feet. I’m praying for you.

    • just_reality

      Thanks for the post. I knew the catholic church did nothing while the holocaust was occurring, but I didn’t know Hitler was catholic. But that is similar to the Spanish civil war when the catholic church sided with the fascists, and the colonization of the Americas when the catholic church supported genocide of the native population, and the Inquisition, etc.

    • Gary Seymour

      You’re problem is clear; you have religion and religion is dead; you can’t pray to Mary because Mary is dead. Ecc_9:5 For the living know that they will die, but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten.

      No amount of Our Father’s or Stations of the cross, no matter if you say hail Mary’s till Jesus comes, you are going to hell unless you enter into a relationship with Christ. Let’s say that you’re looking for a job and while walking down Main street, you see a sign in a store window that says help wanted. You go inside and take the sign out of the window, you go to the boss and say, “I’m your man.” He looks at you and says “you’re right, you’re hired.” You see he was boss a year before you came in; he was boss ten years before you came in; but it took you coming to him to make him your boss. And it takes you coming to Jesus to make Him the boss of your life. The good news is, you get to choose. The bad news is, you get to choose.

      Jos 24:15 And if it is evil in your eyes to serve the LORD, choose this day whom you will serve, whether the gods your fathers served in the region beyond the River, or the gods of the Amorites in whose land you dwell. But as for me and my house, we will serve the LORD.”

  • William James Ward

    Jesus said, “whosoever so much as calls on my name in the last days
    will be saved.” Has Ted Turner called on Jesus, if so or not so, why
    try to judge, we are all responsible for our lives and must give account.
    It is the decision that man makes about Christ that matters, not how much
    money, fame and praise from man they have in order to have life
    eternal in glory with God. Jesus saves and that does not change with
    intellectual arguments of who said what nor personal interpretations
    of Scripture. What some people did in the name of religion or Christianity
    that was evil is a testimony that they were neither Christians and probably
    not saved. It is written, “Many are called but few are chosen”, lumping
    the intellectual perfidy of evil men with those who “believe and be saved”
    is a road to nowhere and an argument to divert from Biblical truth.
    Ted Turner has a chance as we all do and like the thief on the Cross
    next to Jesus turned to Him for forgiveness of sin and Jesus told
    he would be with Him in Paradise, a man rotten to the end and there
    it was forgiveness for asking. May Ted Turner overcome pride and self
    love and focus on only what matters, Jesus Christ and Him crucified.
    William

    • bizbird6

      The Christian Bible is a TOTAL Rubbish!!!!

      I would throw it away in the nearest trash bin.

      It is NOT WORTH the paper that it is printed on.

      You should read up on what those Bible Experts says about the Bible.

      You should read books by Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Earl Doheny, and many others. Or at least look them up in the Wiki Encyclopedia.1

      • William James Ward

        Moron!!!…………………William

        • bizbird6

          So calling people names will make you more Right????

          Baloney!!!!!!

          • Gary Seymour

            bow the knee

          • bizbird6

            Rather kick and kick hard!!

          • Gary Seymour

            You can kick all you want, but there is going to come a day my friend, when you will bow before the King of kings and the Lord of lords.

            Php 2:9 Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name,

            Php 2:10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth,

            Php 2:11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

            You can bow the knee now and have the abundant life you always dreamed of, or you can keep kicking until you breath your last breath and bow the knee then but be eternally separated from Christ for all eternity.

            Mat_22:13 Then the king said to the attendants, ‘Bind him hand and foot and cast him into the outer darkness. In that place there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.’

            I’m praying for you today friend.

      • Gary Seymour

        Php_3:8 Indeed, I count everything as loss because of the surpassing worth of knowing Christ Jesus my Lord. For his sake I have suffered the loss of all things and count them as rubbish, in order that I may gain Christ

  • bizbird6

    The whole BASIS of Religion (including of Christianity and other 30 or so major Religions) is BASED on PROMISES.

    The Promises is that if a person becomes an Adherent of that Religion and behaved in a certain REQUIRED way, then he or she will be given a reward after his or her death. (Although some Religions don’t promise such a reward!)

    Yet, has these promises ever been kept? Has any one ever died, returned from the dead, and testify that there is indeed such a reward? I certainly never heard of such a case.

    Remember also that many of these Religions contradict each other. For example, Islam says Christians who refuses to abandon their faith and convert to Islam will go to hell! Other faiths has also stated similar laws.

    So the question is what happens if an adherent dies and one Religion says that he or she will go to heaven and another Religion says that he or she will go to Hell! Where does this person go to then? 1

    • Larry Stauth

      That is NOT correct… The basis of Jewish and Muslim religion is it’s your responsibility to live righteous.

      Christianity claims it’s the “fruit” or the result.

      In fact, Christianity is NOTHING to do with any one. The Promise is, accept this truth or not, it’s your choice. And when the time comes for you to leave this world, your choice will carry over.

      What I mean.. God is Love, God is Light… If you choose NOT to accept God, he is NOT going to force you to be with Him… which means you will be away from Light and Love… Dark, cold and Hell abound.

      And yes… Jesus WAS the fulfillment… He died on the Cross, as recorded in Roman record… under both the Greek name Jesus and the Hebrew translation Joshua (pronounce Ya-shoo-ah)…

      He left for 3 days, then returned, sat with thousands of people, who attested to this, also in Jewish AND Roman record.

      Keeping in mind, while many, many people choose to think that the Bible is the ONLY account of Jesus, there is actually MORE historically validated documentation to support Jesus’ existence, death AND resurrection, than there is on Alexander the Great, Napoleon and Kin Ramses the First, COMBINED!

      In fact, there is more credibility documentation to prove Jesus existed than Abraham Lincoln, Thomas Jefferson and George Washington.

      There is no “Heaven” or “Hell” in any religious documentation. They are “suppositions”. They are taken out of context.

      Keeping in mind, Christians, Jews and Muslims are all Abrahamic religions. They all stem from Abraham and the covenant made by God, that His descendants would be with Him.

      For the Christians, there is NO Hell… If you are not with God, you are simply AWAY from God. Muslims, Mormons, Catholics and Jehovah Witness’ take a side ways view of WHO is granted salvation…

      But ONLY one can be right, so a bit of discernment is involved.

      BUT, to put in an analogy… If there is a piece of candy on the table, and 4-5 people tell you you will not die if you eat it, and only one guy tells you you will be fine… wouldn’t it make you second guess the one guy, NOT the 4-5?

      BTW, The “Law” of the Jews… the way to obtain righteousness… is the exact same as Jesus. The only difference is Jesus already paid the price.

      The price? The price of sin is death. Not of your physical form… your spiritual form.

      BTW… Gandhi quoted Jesus, Jesus’ name and teaching appearing in Buddhist teachings. Hindus also adopted many views, based on noted teachings by Jesus’…

      That is why He is still considered the single most influential man who walked this earth.

      • bizbird6

        Regardless how influential Christ may be, he supposedly a long time ago, and it is very difficult to track down if he actually lived or not and what he actually said, if anything at all.

        I trust more the truth we we discover TODAY!!! The truth is Science!! The truth of Science is everywhere, electric lights, radio, television, telephones, airplanes, Mass education, Internet, etc., etc., etc.

        Let’s forget what someone that may or may not have lived 2000 years ago might or might not have said and focus on today.

        A famous quote that I heard is this: “Science flew us to the Moon, while Religion flew up into buildings.”

        • Gary Seymour

          On the Day that you come face to Face with Him, you’ll find out.

          • Larry Stauth

            I bet if he was knocked off a the side of a cliff, “Oh God!” would be the first words out of his mouth.. followed closely by “Help me”…

            He is definitely the type of person that spends his days saying there is no God, then when tragedy strikes, he wonders why God didn’t stop it…

          • Gary Seymour

            Oh, Larry, Biz needs Jesus and we must show him that God is not mad at him, He’s madly in love with him. We may be the only Jesus he may ever see. When he looks at us through our words, who will he see?

            1Co 9:18 What then is my reward? That in my preaching I may present the gospel free of charge, so as not to make full use of my right in the gospel.

            1Co 9:19 For though I am free from all, I have made myself a servant to all, that I might win more of them.

            1Co 9:20 To the Jews I became as a Jew, in order to win Jews. To those under the law I became as one under the law (though not being myself under the law) that I might win those under the law.

            1Co 9:21 To those outside the law I became as one outside the law (not being outside the law of God but under the law of Christ) that I might win those outside the law.

            1Co 9:22 To the weak I became weak, that I might win the weak. I have become all things to all people, that by all means I might save some.

            1Co 9:23 I do it all for the sake of the gospel, that I may share with them in its blessings.

            1Co 9:24 Do you not know that in a race all the runners run, but only one receives the prize? So run that you may obtain it.

            1Co 9:25 Every athlete exercises self-control in all things. They do it to receive a perishable wreath, but we an imperishable.

            1Co 9:26 So I do not run aimlessly; I do not box as one beating the air.

            1Co 9:27 But I discipline my body and keep it under control, lest after preaching to others I myself should be disqualified.

            I’m praying for you Biz

          • bizbird6

            Bart D. Ehrman

            Author, ‘Forged: Writing in the Name of God—Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’

            Who Wrote The Bible and Why It Matters

            Posted: 03/25/11 09:38 PM ET

            Apart from the most rabid fundamentalists among us, nearly everyone admits that the Bible might contain errors — a faulty creation story here, a historical mistake there, a contradiction or two in some other place. But is it possible that the problem is worse than that — that the Bible actually contains lies?

            Most people wouldn’t put it that way, since the Bible is, after all, sacred Scripture for millions on our planet. But good Christian scholars of the Bible, including the top Protestant and Catholic scholars of America, will tell you that the Bible is full of lies, even if they refuse to use the term. And here is the truth: Many of the books
            of the New Testament were written by people who lied about their identity,
            claiming to be a famous apostle — Peter, Paul or James — knowing full well
            they were someone else. In modern parlance, that is a lie, and a book written
            by someone who lies about his identity is a forgery.

            Most modern scholars of the Bible shy away from these terms, and for understandable reasons, some having to do with their clientele. Teaching in Christian seminaries, or to largely Christian undergraduate populations, who wants to denigrate the cherished texts of Scripture by calling them forgeries built on lies? And so scholars use a different term for this phenomenon and call such books
            “pseudepigrapha.”

            You will find this antiseptic term throughout the writings of modern scholars of the Bible. It’s the term used in university classes on the New Testament, and in seminary courses, and in Ph.D seminars. What the people who use the term do not tell you is that it literally means “writing that is inscribed with a lie.”

            And that’s what such writings are.
            Whoever wrote the New Testament book of 2 Peter claimed to be Peter. But scholars everywhere — except for our friends among the fundamentalists — will
            tell you that there is no way on God’s green earth that Peter wrote the book.
            Someone else wrote it claiming to be Peter. Scholars may also tell you that it was an acceptable practice in the ancient world for someone to write a book in
            the name of someone else. But that is where they are wrong. If you look at what ancient people actually said about the practice, you’ll see that they invariably called it lying and condemned it as a deceitful practice, even in
            Christian circles. 2 Peter was finally accepted into the New Testament because the church fathers, centuries later, were convinced that Peter wrote it. But he didn’t. Someone else did. And that someone else lied about his identity.

            The same is true of many of the letters allegedly written by Paul. Most scholars will tell you that whereas seven of the 13 letters that go under Paul’s name are his, the other six are not. Their authors merely claimed to be Paul. In the ancient world, books like that were labeled as pseudoi — lies.

            This may all seem like a bit of antiquarian curiosity, especially for people whose lives don’t depend on the Bible or even people of faith for whom biblical matters are a peripheral interest at best. But in fact, it matters sometimes. Whoever wrote the book of 1 Timothy claimed to be Paul. But he was lying about that — he was someone else living after Paul had died. In his book, the author of 1 Timothy used
            Paul’s name and authority to address a problem that he saw in the church. Women were speaking out, exercising authority and teaching men. That had to stop. The author told women to be silent and submissive, and reminded his readers about what happened the first time a woman was allowed to exercise authority over a man, in that little incident in the garden of Eden. No, the author argued, if women wanted to be saved, they were to have babies (1 Tim. 2:11-15).

            Largely on the basis of this passage, the apostle Paul has been branded, by more liberation minded people of recent generations, as one of history’s great misogynists. The problem, of course, is that Paul never said any such thing. And why does it matter? Because the passage is still used by church leaders today to oppress and silence women.
            Why are there no women priests in the Catholic Church? Why are women not allowed to preach in conservative evangelical churches? Why are there churches
            today that do not allow women even to speak? In no small measure it is because Paul allegedly taught that women had to be silent, submissive and pregnant.Except that the person who taught this was not Paul, but someone lying about his identity so that his readers would think he was Paul.

            It may be one of the greatest ironies of the Christian scriptures that some of them insist on truth, while telling a lie. For no author is truth more important than for the
            “Paul” of Ephesians. He refers to the gospel as “the word of truth” (1:13); he indicates that the “truth is in Jesus”; he tells his readers to “speak the truth” to their neighbors (4:24-25); and he instructs his readers to “fasten the belt of truth around your waist” (6:14). And yet he himself lied about who he was. He was not really Paul.

            It appears that some of the New Testament writers, such as the authors of 2 Peter, 1 Timothy and Ephesians, felt they were perfectly justified to lie in order to tell the truth. But we today can at least evaluate their claims and realize just how human, and fallible, they were. They were creatures of their time and place. And so too
            were their teachings, lies and all.

            Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from HarperOne Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’. His latest b Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North
            Carolina, Chapel Hill, and the New York Times bestselling author of ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from Harper One.Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’.

          • Larry Stauth

            And this is collaborated by what? As I have said, validating a nut job, because he found he had an opinion NOT based in fact, does not make him correct, and makes you ignorant.

            The simple fact that the LETTER written by Peter, known as the Book of 2 Peter, is actually a part of historic record…

            As in, the ORIGINAL LETTER HAS BEEN VALIDATED!!!!

            As for Timothy and Ephesians, they were LETTERS WRITTEN BY PAUL… who was in prison in Rome at the time.

            Guess what the Vatican has, in their possessions? Yes, the original letters.

            Then again, an ignorant souls, such as yourself has no clue the source, origins or validity of the writings.

            As I said… The National Histoic Society HAS VALIDATED THE WRITINGS IN THE BIBLE TO BE HISTORICALLY CORRECT AND VALID.

            In other words, the experts on history have stated, without biased, that they found NO HISTORIC FLAWS AND ALL STATED PROVEN INFORMATION IS VALID!!

            That means, they have been proven to be written by the mentioned writer, when they said they were written and to whom they were written.

            If you insist on continuing this charade, knock yourself out.

            Does not prove you to be anything but an uninformed idiot, that most kindergarten kids can outwit.

            It’s your life.. but might I suggest to try finding UNBIASED and objective views, not just one’s that try to validate your flawed opinions.

        • lgwatson

          So, were all of the things discovered by science created from nothing?

          • bizbird6

            The Universe was NEVER created because it ALWAYS existed.

            Remember the FUNDAMENTAL Law of Science that the total amount of Matter and Energy in the Universe is always constant and can never be created nor destroyed?

            In fact, the God’s Creation hypothesis violates this Law so God could NEVER have created anything.

          • sandraleesmith46

            Even science agrees it had a beginning and will have an end, so that one’s down the drain; wonder who told you that lie? And Creation violates nothing; God simply converted energy to matter, which even physicists do today in their labs. HE is the energy source so no problem there, except in your mind.

          • Fuzzwell

            Very well said, Sandra

          • Fuzzwell

            Thanks for following!

          • sandraleesmith46

            You’re welcome. :-)

          • Larry Stauth

            Check your facts… Even Science says it had a beginning.

            Your notation is called the Zero-Energy Universe HYPOTHESIS. NOTE: It says Hypothesis, which means unproven idea.

            Others in the science community are more honest about it…

            “How the energy conservation law is obeyed by the universe during its evolution is an important but not yet unanimously resolved question” — Akinbo Ojo, Standard Science Centre.

            In fact, the “Big Bang” theory is one “accepted” theories of science. But they have yet to explain why the 2 largest planets in our solar system are in the middle, while the 2 smallest are the first and last… Or how 2 of them rotate in reverse of the others.

            How about you study the Laws of Thermo Dynamics, that encompasses ALL things… things like everything goes from Order to chaos…

            Guess that only applies to EVERYTHING except Life.. well, except parts of life.

            Fact is, it takes MORE faith to believe in much of the modern science, than it does to believe in religious doctrine.

            Mainly because modern day scientists are more interested in that Grant Money, than they are about truth. Just as Drug companies are more worried about treating the symptoms of a illness, than finding a cure. (Healthy people do not need meds).

            It’s obvious, you know less about Science than you do about Christianity.

            BTW… Jesus was hung on the cross by the Religious Leaders… think about that for a second…

          • bizbird6

            Religious People Branded As Less Intelligent Than
            Atheists In Provocative New Study

            The Huffington Post | By Macrina Cooper-White
            Posted: 08/14/2013 3:48 pm EDT | Updated: 08/15/2013
            11:47 am EDT 4

            That’s the provocative conclusion of a new review of 63 studies of intelligence and religion that span the past century. The meta-analysis showed that in 53 of the studies, conducted between 1928 to 2012, there was an inverse relation between religiosity — having religious beliefs, or performing religious rituals — and intelligence. That is, on average, non-believers scored higher than religious people on intelligence tests.

            What might explain the effect?

            Scientists behind studies included in the review most often suggested that “religious beliefs are irrational, not anchored in science, not
            testable and, therefore, unappealing to intelligent people who ‘know better.’”

            But the researchers who conducted the new meta-analysis say the answer is a bit more complicated. They suspect intelligent people might have less of a “need” for religion.

            “Intelligence may also lead to greater self-control ability,
            self-esteem, perceived control over life events, and supportive relationships,
            obviating some of the benefits that religion sometimes provides,” study
            co-author Jordan Silberman, a graduate student of neuroeconomics at the
            University of Rochester, told The Huffington Post in an email.

            So if you’re a believer, does this mean you’re a dope?

            “I’m sure there are intelligent religious people and unintelligent atheists out there,” Silberman said in the email. “The findings pertain to the average intelligence of religious and non-religious people, but they don’t necessarily apply to any single
            person. Knowing that a person is religious would not lead me to bet any money
            on whether or not the person is intelligent.”

            The researchers acknowledge the limitations of the meta-analysis. It did not look at type of religion, for example, or at the role culture might play in the interaction between religiosity and intelligence.

            In addition, The Independent pointed out that the researchers used a narrow definition of intelligence. In the paper, intelligence is defined as “the ability to reason, plan, solve problems, think abstractly, comprehend complex ideas, learn quickly, and learn from experience.” This excludes other forms of intelligence, like creative and emotional intelligence.

            The meta-analysis was published in Personality and Social Psychology Review.

            Quick Poll

            What do you think about the study’s bold claim?

            I’m a total believer in the study –it makes a lot of sense.

            56.22%

            I have no faith in the study’s findings — believers are just as smart as non-believers.

            15.81%

            It’s just researchers playing with statistics — it doesn’t apply to individual people.

            28 %

          • Larry Stauth

            Wow.. quote “Huff Post”.. lol, why not find someone that actually have an IMPARTIAL view?

            You do understand the word “UNBIASED”, right? Newsflash…

            20 of the Top 20 Universities in the World are Christian BASED!!!

            The fact that the studies are controlled, and the data is inconclusive, because it does not direct that individuals answered truthfully.

            But considering that the top 3 Cancer Research Facilities in the US are also Christian says a lot…

            Maybe you have heard of the #1 Cancer Research Organization… ST. JUDE!

            Maybe you have heard of John Hopkins?

            Yale, Harvard, Notre Dame, Princeton.. all of them founded and build on Christian beliefs long after those, so called studies…

            YEP, Not only you stupid, but you do not even bother to double check what you are postings…

            I am done. Your not ignorant, your stupid.. and your obviously a troll…

            Go bug someone else with your garbage, you have exposed that you know nothing, too many times to count..

            And yes… I am going to ignore all comments from you. I am also recommending someone ban you for trolling…

            Because you obviously have nothing to add, and only wish to find any excuse to argue, even when your flat out wrong.

          • bizbird6

            We are all based on some previous culture. Greek and Roman culture is still prevalent on our architectural buildings.

            Latin formed our language roots. I have nothing against Christian contributions to our civilization which are still very dominant today.

            However, I believe that the Christian Religion is false and its influence should be greatly reduced in our country as this religion is fading in many other countries already.

          • Larry Stauth

            Ignored. Go away troll.

        • sandraleesmith46

          That’s a really flimsy prop you’re leaning your eternal fate on; you wouldn’t believe how much of what was taught as science “truth” when I was a kid has already been proven wrong, sometimes 2 or more times over. It takes FAR more blind faith to believe in the deity of science and follow that religion than it does to follow Jesus.

          • Fuzzwell

            How sad to get up every morning knowing that that is the best it will ever be, with no hope of eternity with God.

          • bizbird6

            Why are you Christians always defending God?

            Isn’t God suppose to be omnipotent? He is strong enough to speak and defend himself isn’t he? Why does he need to you weak mortal beings to always speak for him? Why is he so silent?

            Doesn’t the fact that he is so silent shows that maybe he does NOT exist and maybe NEVER existed at all?

            Doesn’t this SILENCE speak LOUDER than all your screaming and shouting? 32

        • Larry Stauth

          Bizbird.. HOW do you know Man went to the moon? There are people that have written it was all done in a private studio and give bit after bit of evidence?

          I know they went to the moon, because I have examined ALL evidence and it started with reports from people that were there.

          Jesus DID live, He did preach in the Country we know know as Israel. You have not only the written doctrine of his friends, but also the written record of his enemies and impartial witness’.

          You have record after record of those same witness’ willing to face sever torture, for refusing to deny what they witnessed.

          As for your quote… You do realize, that most of the top Scientific minds, that created EVERYTHING you referenced.. electric light, radio, television, etc… all of them were created by men who believed Jesus was the savior.

          Heck, check the history of Public Education… almost ALL Colleges were founded by Christian Organization… ESPECIALLY the Ivy League Schools.

          In fact, if not for a group of Baptists in Massachusetts, there would be no public education. They actually rallied to get so the children had to be taught, because they felt an uneducated person was more vulnerable to evil.

          The leading Organizations for Medical Research is John Hopkins and St. Jude… BOTH Christian based.

          The Internet was the only one on there that is a stretch. Because you really have no clue the influence of IBM. But prior to Windows, all computers were hardware based, and the main ideal was whether or not it was “IBM compatible”. IBM was formed by, yep.. individuals with strong religious and moral values.

          The fact is, and I said it already… you are, in all senses of the term.. Wrong, period… facts are facts, whether you like them of not.

          You can say “the sun will not come up tomorrow” all you want… but that will not change the fact that it will, in deed come up.

          Oh, and btw, comparing Muslim’s with Christians, given the Muslim Doctrine support killing in the name of their faith, would be like me comparing you to a Satanist… who by belief gain power from spreading lies and deceit.

          And since that is, essentially what you are doing, and worst, not even your own lies… Which makes you dense AND clueless, by definition.

          • bizbird6

            A lot of Islamic believers blew themselves too, yet did they ever meet or saw Mohammed????

            In fact more Muslims died for their Religion this Century than Christians.

            Does this mean the Islam is more true than Christianity?

      • bizbird6

        Why are you Christians always defending God?

        Isn’t God suppose to be omnipotent? He is strong enough to speak and defend himself isn’t he? Why does he need to you weak mortal beings to always speak for him? Why is he so silent?

        Doesn’t the fact that he is so silent shows that maybe he does NOT exist and maybe NEVER existed at all?

        Doesn’t this SILENCE speak LOUDER than all your screaming and shouting? 21

      • bizbird6

        Bart D. Ehrman

        Author, ‘Forged: Writing in the Name of God—Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’

        Who Wrote The Bible and Why It Matters

        Posted: 03/25/11 09:38 PM ET0

        Apart from the most rabid fundamentalists among us, nearly everyone admits that the Bible might contain errors — a faulty creation story here, a historical mistake there, a contradiction or two in some other place. But is it possible that the problem is worse than that — that the Bible actually contains lies?

        Most people wouldn’t put it that way, since the Bible is, after all, sacred Scripture for millions on our planet. But good Christian scholars of the Bible, including the top Protestant and Catholic scholars of America, will tell you that the Bible is full of lies, even if they refuse to use the term. And here is the truth: Many of the books
        of the New Testament were written by people who lied about their identity,
        claiming to be a famous apostle — Peter, Paul or James — knowing full well
        they were someone else. In modern parlance, that is a lie, and a book written
        by someone who lies about his identity is a forgery.

        Most modern scholars of the Bible shy away from these terms, and for understandable reasons, some having to do with their clientele. Teaching in Christian seminaries, or to largely Christian undergraduate populations, who wants to denigrate the cherished texts of Scripture by calling them forgeries built on lies? And so scholars use a different term for this phenomenon and call such books
        “pseudepigrapha.”

        You will find this antiseptic term throughout the writings of modern scholars of the Bible. It’s the term used in university classes on the New Testament, and in seminary courses, and in Ph.D seminars. What the people who use the term do not tell you is that it literally means “writing that is inscribed with a lie.”

        And that’s what such writings are.
        Whoever wrote the New Testament book of 2 Peter claimed to be Peter. But
        scholars everywhere — except for our friends among the fundamentalists — will
        tell you that there is no way on God’s green earth that Peter wrote the book.
        Someone else wrote it claiming to be Peter. Scholars may also tell you that it
        was an acceptable practice in the ancient world for someone to write a book in
        the name of someone else. But that is where they are wrong. If you look at what
        ancient people actually said about the practice, you’ll see that they
        invariably called it lying and condemned it as a deceitful practice, even in
        Christian circles. 2 Peter was finally accepted into the New Testament because
        the church fathers, centuries later, were convinced that Peter wrote it. But he
        didn’t. Someone else did. And that someone else lied about his identity.

        The same is true of many of the letters allegedly written by Paul. Most scholars will tell you that whereas seven of the 13 letters that go under Paul’s name are his, the other six are not. Their authors merely claimed to be Paul. In the ancient world, books like that were labeled as pseudoi — lies.

        This may all seem like a bit of antiquarian curiosity, especially for people whose lives don’t depend on the Bible or even people of faith for whom biblical matters are a peripheral interest at best. But in fact, it matters sometimes. Whoever wrote the book of 1 Timothy claimed to be Paul. But he was lying about that — he was someone else living after Paul had died. In his book, the author of 1 Timothy used
        Paul’s name and authority to address a problem that he saw in the church. Women were speaking out, exercising authority and teaching men. That had to stop. The author told women to be silent and submissive, and reminded his readers about what happened the first time a woman was allowed to exercise authority over a man, in that little incident in the garden of Eden. No, the author argued, if women wanted to be saved, they were to have babies (1 Tim. 2:11-15).

        Largely on the basis of this passage, the apostle Paul has been branded, by more liberation minded people of recent generations, as one of history’s great misogynists. The problem, of course, is that Paul never said any such thing. And why does it matter? Because the passage is still used by church leaders today to oppress and silence women.
        Why are there no women priests in the Catholic Church? Why are women not
        allowed to preach in conservative evangelical churches? Why are there churches
        today that do not allow women even to speak? In no small measure it is because
        Paul allegedly taught that women had to be silent, submissive and pregnant.
        Except that the person who taught this was not Paul, but someone lying about
        his identity so that his readers would think he was Paul.

        It may be one of the greatest ironies of the Christian scriptures that some of them insist on truth, while telling a lie. For no author is truth more important than for the
        “Paul” of Ephesians. He refers to the gospel as “the word of truth” (1:13); he indicates that the “truth is in Jesus”; he tells his readers to “speak the truth” to their neighbors (4:24-25); and he instructs his readers to “fasten the belt of truth around your waist” (6:14). And yet he himself lied about who he was. He was not really Paul.

        It appears that some of the New Testament writers, such as the authors of 2 Peter, 1 Timothy and Ephesians, felt they were perfectly justified to lie in order to tell the truth. But we today can at least evaluate their claims and realize just how human, and fallible, they were. They were creatures of their time and place. And so too
        were their teachings, lies and all.

        Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from HarperOne Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’. His latest b Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray
        Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North
        Carolina, Chapel Hill, and the New York Times bestselling author of ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from Harper One.Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’.

    • Gary Seymour

      You’re problem is that you only know of religion and religion will not save you. Religion is man’s way of trying to get to God. Christianity is not a religion; religion is based on works to try and get to heaven, and believe me, your works, my works, will never be good enough to get into heaven.

      Christianity is relationship, not man made. God sent His only Son, to take your place, my place, and bear your sin and my sin on a cross that we should have died on and should die on. Unless you repent and allow God to change your heart, I’am afraid this is your fate as described below. You will be on the train that goes to hell.

      “The Train That Went To Hell ”

      There were men and women among the crowd,the high, the low, the meek, and proud. There were beautiful women and the handsomest men, who had gambled their souls for the price of sin.

      There were rich men most wealthy, among the crew, Deacons, church members, and ministers too. There were elderly on crutches and others on canes, All trapped within the Hell Bound Train……..

      There were men of all races, men of great names, men of sound knowledge and wisdom and fame. There were men of all creeds, the young and the old, who had gambled with Satan for the price of their soul.

      Satan took his seat and the journey
      began………………To Eternal Damnation, ” The result for
      sin.”…………….

      Now one of the prisoners among the crowd, gathered the strength to say, ” Satan, what have we done that we deserve to be treated in such a way? ” ” What have we done the others cried,” that we deserve to be punished by you! ” ” Well I’ll tell you “, said the devil, “you did what I told you to do! ”
      ” But Satan you said we’d never be lost if we gave our lives to you.”
      ” Of course I did, ” the devil sneered,” What else was I to do !”

      And then he laughed an awful laugh that made his body shake, and threw back his head on his shoulders and tears of joy streamed down his face.

      ” But Satan,” said one, ” you said I was too young to give up the pleasures of life. ” You said I should wait and when I got old I could give my life to Christ! ” “You told me,” said the wealthy, that I was too rich and I didn’t need God’s grace.” ” You said “if I gave him all that I had, then my wealth would go to waste.” ” You told me “, said the haughty, ” that I was too proud to humble myself to Christ! ” You said I could do it without him and I didn’t need him in my life. And indeed, I’ve been most clever, to have blinded you in this way! Why my friends, you’ve been faithful, you
      endured to the very end, you’ve labored hard in the ways of sin. You all
      hardened your hearts and closed your eyes, and closed your ears to the word of God!!!

      You’ve worshiped me, is this not true? So faithful servants, I must pay you. You’ve finished your course, so I’ll carry you through. After all dear servants, that’s the least that I can do!

      And then he laughed an awful laugh that made his whole body shake, and threw back his head on his shoulders as tears of joy streamed down his face!

      But Satan you told us much too plain that this would never be! ” Then you were fools “, the devil sneered, ” to put your trust in me “! And so I have deceived you and brought you to this fate, at last you’re waking up, but now it is to late!

      For when Christ desired to save your soul, you turned your back on him, and because you did, you cannot live, for DEATH IS THE PRICE OF SIN!

      ” Mercy, Satan mercy! ” came the millions of cries, but Satan laughed and simply said, ” merciless am I.” You had your chance, you made your choice, you chose to live for me. Now give me one good reason why I should set you free? They cried all the louder, “please have mercy on our souls! ” Satan turned to answer, and his voice was hard and cold.” Why should my heart be softened and surrender to your cries? When the Bible told you plainly that the soul that sins shall DIE! ”

      And then he laughed an awful laugh that made his whole body shake, and threw his head back on his shoulders, and tears of joy streamed down his face.

      But, they cried, ” just give us time, to fix our hearts, and change our minds,” But Satan answered, ” When you were called to bow, you wouldn’t take heed, so it’s to late now ! ”

      They cried and they pleaded; They screamed and they moaned. They begged and they panicked, they shrieked and they groaned!

      There was never a more heartbreaking sound. Than the plead from the souls on the TRAIN HELL BOUND………..And I can see the devil grin when he laughs and say’s ” because you’ve sinned YOU SHALL DIE!!! ”

      Now the train moved on at an awful pace, as hot winds scorched their hands and face. When out of the distance arose a yell, ” oh look! cried the devil, ” We’re now nearing hell !

      And then how the prisoners screamed in pain, and begged the devil to stop the train. Some peered out the window at the horrible sight, for ahead in the distance, brisk smoke filled the night.

      And in their despair, some fell to their knees, and begged the devil to set them free. Others knelt down and began to pray, but it was to late for now they must pay for the work which they had done.

      And now in the distance they saw flames ahead, and they twisted and pulled and struggled in vain. For their hands were tied and their feet were chained.

      The windows and doors were all shut fast. The people screamed and the devil laughed!

      Some looked around and THERE WAS NO ESCAPE! So they covered their eyes and buried their faces. Women fainted and fell to the floor, for the Horror of hell was just to much to endure!

      Satan out laughed each scream and out laughed each groan. He laughed louder than every plead and moan. He laughed louder than every useless appeal for Satan was shrewd and he laughs even still!

      AS THE HIGH, THE LOW, THE RICH, AND THE
      POOR, WERE GONE TO HELL……………TO RETURN NO MORE!!

      ****REPENT OR PERISH****

      Author Unknown

      Jesus is coming soon so please hurry and make your
      choice!!

      • Larry Stauth

        Mr. Seymour.. all I can say is wow.. SPOT ON!

    • lgwatson

      I believe that Jesus is the son of God and my savior. If I’m wrong and you are right, I haven’t gained or lost. If I’m right and you are wrong you lose big time.

      • bizbird6

        Non-Belief is BOOMING. Christianity is declining!

        Promises of afterlife or whatever are NOTHING if they are BOGUS.

        That is why people are ignoring Christianity.

        I can promise you the Moon, but if my promises are empty and worthless, then you would still end up with NOTHING!

        Millions are NOT believers of these empty promises, so they never expected these empty promises in the beginning!

    • sandraleesmith46

      You, sir, are a FOOL who would NOT believe Jesus if He was standing in your FACE telling you it’s true! As for “unproven”; not so; the Bible has been proven accurate historically repeatedly, as no other “religious” text has been, especially about things it foretold before they happened and had as written record ahead of the actual events. Today, we’re watching yet more of that unfolding before our eyes,exactly as was predicted in some cases LONG before even Jesus was born.

      • Fuzzwell

        Sandra, even though we have the Great Commission, some people will NEVER believe. They have been blinded by Satan. They do not want to give up their FUN life style, never even understanding that once they accept Christ, they don’t want to do those EVIL things any longer. And how sad to have NO HOPE!

        • bizbird6

          Bart D. Ehrman

          Author, ‘Forged: Writing in the Name of God—Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’

          Who Wrote The Bible and Why It Matters

          Posted: 03/25/11 09:38 PM ET 8

          Apart from the most rabid fundamentalists among us, nearly everyone admits that the Bible might contain errors — a faulty creation story here, a historical mistake there, a contradiction or two in some other place. But is it possible that the problem is worse than that — that the Bible actually contains lies?

          Most people wouldn’t put it that way, since the Bible is, after all, sacred Scripture for millions on our planet. But good Christian scholars of the Bible, including the top Protestant and Catholic scholars of America, will tell you that the Bible is full of lies, even if they refuse to use the term. And here is the truth: Many of the books
          of the New Testament were written by people who lied about their identity,
          claiming to be a famous apostle — Peter, Paul or James — knowing full well
          they were someone else. In modern parlance, that is a lie, and a book written
          by someone who lies about his identity is a forgery.

          Most modern scholars of the Bible shy away from these terms, and for understandable reasons, some having to do with their clientele. Teaching in Christian seminaries, or to largely Christian undergraduate populations, who wants to denigrate the cherished texts of Scripture by calling them forgeries built on lies? And so scholars use a different term for this phenomenon and call such books
          “pseudepigrapha.”

          You will find this antiseptic term throughout the writings of modern scholars of the Bible. It’s the term used in university classes on the New Testament, and in seminary courses, and in Ph.D seminars. What the people who use the term do not tell you is that it literally means “writing that is inscribed with a lie.”

          And that’s what such writings are.
          Whoever wrote the New Testament book of 2 Peter claimed to be Peter. But
          scholars everywhere — except for our friends among the fundamentalists — will
          tell you that there is no way on God’s green earth that Peter wrote the book.
          Someone else wrote it claiming to be Peter. Scholars may also tell you that it
          was an acceptable practice in the ancient world for someone to write a book in
          the name of someone else. But that is where they are wrong. If you look at what
          ancient people actually said about the practice, you’ll see that they
          invariably called it lying and condemned it as a deceitful practice, even in
          Christian circles. 2 Peter was finally accepted into the New Testament because
          the church fathers, centuries later, were convinced that Peter wrote it. But he
          didn’t. Someone else did. And that someone else lied about his identity.

          The same is true of many of the letters allegedly written by Paul. Most scholars will tell you that whereas seven of the 13 letters that go under Paul’s name are his, the other six are not. Their authors merely claimed to be Paul. In the ancient world, books like that were labeled as pseudoi — lies.

          This may all seem like a bit of antiquarian curiosity, especially for people whose lives don’t depend on the Bible or even people of faith for whom biblical matters are a peripheral interest at best. But in fact, it matters sometimes. Whoever wrote the book of 1 Timothy claimed to be Paul. But he was lying about that — he was someone else living after Paul had died. In his book, the author of 1 Timothy used
          Paul’s name and authority to address a problem that he saw in the church. Women were speaking out, exercising authority and teaching men. That had to stop. The author told women to be silent and submissive, and reminded his readers about what happened the first time a woman was allowed to exercise authority over a man, in that little incident in the garden of Eden. No, the author argued, if women wanted to be saved, they were to have babies (1 Tim. 2:11-15).

          Largely on the basis of this passage, the apostle Paul has been branded, by more liberation minded people of recent generations, as one of history’s great misogynists. The problem, of course, is that Paul never said any such thing. And why does it matter? Because the passage is still used by church leaders today to oppress and silence women.
          Why are there no women priests in the Catholic Church? Why are women not
          allowed to preach in conservative evangelical churches? Why are there churches
          today that do not allow women even to speak? In no small measure it is because
          Paul allegedly taught that women had to be silent, submissive and pregnant.
          Except that the person who taught this was not Paul, but someone lying about
          his identity so that his readers would think he was Paul.

          It may be one of the greatest ironies of the Christian scriptures that some of them insist on truth, while telling a lie. For no author is truth more important than for the
          “Paul” of Ephesians. He refers to the gospel as “the word of truth” (1:13); he indicates that the “truth is in Jesus”; he tells his readers to “speak the truth” to their neighbors (4:24-25); and he instructs his readers to “fasten the belt of truth around your waist” (6:14). And yet he himself lied about who he was. He was not really Paul.

          It appears that some of the New Testament writers, such as the authors of 2 Peter, 1 Timothy and Ephesians, felt they were perfectly justified to lie in order to tell the truth. But we today can at least evaluate their claims and realize just how human, and fallible, they were. They were creatures of their time and place. And so too
          were their teachings, lies and all.

          Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from HarperOne Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’. His latest b Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray
          Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North
          Carolina, Chapel Hill, and the New York Times bestselling author of ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from Harper One.Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’.

  • bizbird6

    The Christian Bible is a TOTAL Rubbish!!!!

    I would throw it away in the nearest trash bin.

    It is NOT WORTH the paper that it is printed on.

    You should read up on what those Bible Experts says about the Bible.

    You should read books by Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Earl Doheny, and many others. Or at least look these Bible Experts up in the Wiki Encyclopedia.

    • Larry Stauth

      Yes, because buys in the 20th Century trump the guys who actually were there.

      Try reading the doctrine of Jewish Scribe Josephus. A roman Scribe charged to journal events in the specific sector.

      In fact, check the very articulate Roman record, INCLUDING the notation of Jesus’ questioning by authorities, including the Governor, Herod…

      How about you read “Foxes Book of Martyrs”, which documents the means of death for all of Jesus’ disciples.

      I can show you book after book, published by the Arab’s, that claim the Jewish Holocaust never happened.

      How about you research the “Dead Sea Scrolls” that not only validate the Jewish text of the Old Testament, but also had several copies of the Coptic versus with them.

      How about you read the history of Nero, who took over the Roman Empire just 4 years after Jesus’ death, and how he made a sport out of killing Christians.

      Then think about it for a second… how sure would you have to be to face being tortured, just because you say you are a follower of Jesus. Note: Christian was the tag given to followers BY Nero…

      Nero was also the man responsible for witnessing the beheading of Paul of Tarsus, who wrote nearly half of the New Testament Letters.

      Or the fact that John wrote Revelation for the Isle of Patmos, John being the youngest disciple to walk with Jesus. .

      Yeah… I will really trust 20th Century writers, with pre-depositions and agility to ignore simple facts…

      Like the fact that Jewish have been trying to rid the world of Jesus’ long before Atheists became a common term… IF Jesus really didn’t exist, why the heck have they been trying so hard to prove He was not who He claimed to be?

      You need validation form 20th Century writers? Ok, try former Agnostic and World Renown Journalist Lee Stroblel, “Case for a Creator”. Who set out to prove to other that their was no God… and as He objectively researched the facts, the truth became abundantly clear. He even address’ point by point his research and the evidence presented, just like a true journalist should.
      BTW, in case you do not know what an Agnostic is: (http://atheism.about.com/od/aboutagnosticism/a/atheism.htm)

      To put blunt, you by definition are Agnostic. You do not just believe, you adamantly oppose, and you let your own personal feelings blind you from the truth.

      I wonder, which would be harder… facing the truth now.. or later, when you did not have a choice?

      • bizbird6

        You should read Earl Doheny books that researched Jesus in great detail. Doheny also knows the prior languages of the Bible. He found out that Christ was mainly the invention of persons living about 1 or 2 centuries after the time of Christ. You need to look up Earl Doheny in the Wiki Encyclopedia. You will find a list of books that he wrote.

        You sources are completely bogus and proves nothing. You are not a professional researcher at all, just another Christian Believer with an Agenda to push. I trust professional researcher more, whose only interest is the complete truth.

        This is why I like Science. Nothing is as honest than Science. It has no agenda, other than honest truth. If a hypothesis proves false, then abandon it and come up with a new hypothesis.

        Christians, however, are willing to tell any LIE to push their Agenda. They THINK that Lying is for the other person’s own good, but actually it totally mislead not just the other person but the Liar as well.

        • Larry Stauth

          Earl Doherty is a “Humanist”.. His “Jesus Puzzle” has been disputed and refuted as the garbage it is, by smarter minds than me. It was proven he never “researched” anything and only referenced third party interpretations.

          I love the fact that the only other books he has wriiten are “Science Fiction”.

          But then of course, the Smithonian knows nothing of history? Yeah.. they have labelled the Bible Historically correct…

          Completely bogus? please.. do tell, brain trust? Josephus?

          http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josephus

          http://www.amazon.com/The-Case-For-Creator-Investigates/dp/0310242096

          http://www.leestrobel.com/Bio.php

          As fro your assertion of Science versus religion… you do understand that the Bible actually stated the World was round, before Galaieo?

          You do understand Columbus referenced that fact when making his bid to the Queen of Portugal?

          You do understand that the Jewish ordered handling of food, is STILL proven to be the most effective way to prevent illness?

          You do know, it has been proven there are over 200 Scientific facts, stated in the the Bible, that had not been proven until Centuries later?

          Most notably, the statement “Blood is the source of life”.. up until the late 1960’s, people thought it was just a useless fluid and thought they could cure illness by draining… ever wonder why the barber pole was white with red stripes?

          Microbiology HAS confirmed, blood, is truly the only source of life.

          As for your assertion.. Christians who lie, are actually not Christians, just people that claim they are Christians…

          A true Christian would respect the difference.

          Then again, based upon your OWN claims.. A Christian would fear losing their salvation by lying, and an atheist wouldn’t have any reason to NOT lie, since there is no God and you are only wrong if you get caught…

          The fact is.. and I am going to say this directly… YOU ARE WRONG. You are using liars and attempting to justify your position by furthering the lie of others.

          In other words, save your breath… You ignorance of the facts is obvious and the inability to properly discern truth from your personal feelings is overly apparent.

          But take heart… if Christians are mistaken… when you die, you get to be worm food and your life meant NOTHING!

          But.. and really hope you try and contemplate this for a second… IF Christians are right, then your life could have meant something and you are going to really be disappointed when you have to answer to a higher power, and then try to reason how they didn’t exist.

          As I see it, Christians are in a win/win situation. They lead productive lives, giving and helping… if God doesn’t exist, they end up no better or worst than you…

          But if they are right… well.. then you are going to be really unhappy.

          • bizbird6

            How about Bart Ehrman? He is listed in Wiki and has written over 20 books on the Bible. Several of his books are best sellers.

            Are you smarter than him? Are you listed in Wiki and have you written over 20 books on the Bible.

            And Bart Ehrman says that the Bible is a complete Fraud, and full of Misquotes, Forgeries, and LIES!

          • sandraleesmith46

            Best sellers??? THAT’S your justification for believing them??? What about that idiotic Da Vinci Code? That was a best seller too, but it sure wasn’t accurate, or of anything more than entertainment value! And WIki as a resoursce is about as useful; since anyone can post anything there and claim it as “factual”! And who in blazes is Bart Ehrman??? Not any Biblical scholar I ever heard of.

          • Fuzzwell

            Sandra, I love when people quote WIKI as fact. My cat is smarter than that. They will never believe the Bible until they accept Christ and experience it with new eyes.

          • sandraleesmith46

            Really! Do they not know anyone can post anything there and claim it’s true; that it’s about as reliable as believing O when he opens his mouth?

          • bizbird6

            Then why don’t you do your own research and prove otherwise! Or do you lack confidence, intelligence, and know how to do that!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            I’ve done my research, and I have no need to “prove” anything. My heart is at peace.

          • bizbird6

            Ignorance is bliss!

            But you also heard, “Ignorance of the law is no excuse”.

          • sandraleesmith46

            The BEGINNING of wisdom is the fear {reverential awe} of the Lord:and praise Him I’ve gone well past that, with the guidance of His Holy Spirit. But that isn’t the only area of study in my life either. I have a pretty fair grasp on what precisely is going on in the world, who’s behind it and why, and where it’s heading as well. So of which “law” is it that you believe I’m “ignorant”? Just because I believe in God doesn’t equate with ignorance, or stupidity, not even with folly.

          • bizbird6

            Why are you Christians always defending God?

            Isn’t God suppose to be omnipotent? He is strong enough to speak and defend himself isn’t he? Why does he need to you weak mortal beings to always speak for him? Why is he so silent?

            Doesn’t the fact that he is so silent shows that maybe he does NOT exist and maybe NEVER existed at all?

            Doesn’t this SILENCE speak LOUDER than all your screaming and shouting? 12

          • sandraleesmith46

            Odd…God doesn’t talk to you? Maybe you’re just not listening? Or maybe the prince of the power of the air is just drowning Him out on you, with all his noise. As for “silent” that you don’t see His plan unfolding in front of you says you don’t know what that plan is…and that’s your fault, because He put it out there long past where everyone could see it.

          • bizbird6

            What??? God speaks to you???

            As i mentioned before, the next time he speaks to you please record his voice so that we can ALL hear what he sounds like???

            I mean, does he speaks with an accent? Is his voice high pitch or low pitch?

            Come on now, since he has spoken to you, tell us more about your Experiences with him? Or are you lying???

          • sandraleesmith46

            God speaks in many ways to His own, as He always has done. No accent, on the 2 occasions it has been audible, but also not long enough to even start a recording device, had I KNOWN ahead He intended to speak on either occasion. And as the Word tells us, it’s a “still, small voice” because He doesn’t want to blow us away. The one time He “let loose”, He FLATTENED the Hebrews. Mostly, He speaks through His written Word, but He has also used dreams and visions on occasions to convey messages to me, and to others I know as well.

            Laugh and mock all you want. I really feel sorry for you.

          • bizbird6

            Then you need to feel sorry for the Millions that are abandoning him.

            However, are you sure that it is really God that is speaking? (I mean how many persons in the world has actually heard the voice of God?) However, maybe it is really the Devil trying to deceive you? How can you tell that it is really the voice of God and NOT the Devil?

            Or, maybe you need to see a Mental Health person. People who speak to God now days are being lock up in the Psycho Ward!

          • bizbird6

            Your cat must be really smart then!

            Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Earl Doherty has writtren more books about the Bible than all of you Christian defenders!

          • Fuzzwell Furry Ball of Fluff

            Thank you, my cat was very very smart. He has gone to Heaven to be with God now. Thank you for your condolences.

          • bizbird6

            I can see if those that knock the Bible does not really know the Bible, but they DO!! They are Bible Experts that knows the Bible 100 times better than you do!

            In fact, they were all previous Christian believers that now regard the Bible as TOTAL Frauds!!!

            And Wiki is considered very reliable. If you don’t think so, you are welcome to do a better Wiki!!!

          • Fuzzwell Furry Ball of Fluff

            Not worth the waste of words. Please don’t write to me again. You will no longer be replied too.

          • bizbird6

            Ehrman has written over 20 books about the Bible and can read the original language of the Bible.

            How about you? How many books have you written about the Bible? and can you read any other language of the Bible than English????

          • sandraleesmith46

            Whoopee; that just makes him an educated fool, instead of a regular one. No I don’t read Biblical languages, but I keep a good Strong’s on hand which DOES so nicely, thank-you very much. And I don’t write books because that’s not what I’m called to do. Should God call me to do that, I would. But your pal has NEVER had the Holy Spirit in him, ergo he’s never been a Christian, and has never been CAPABLE of rightly dividing the Word, which REQUIRES that indwelling in order to do, as it SAYS in the Word! I have, however read the Bible in another language, and it was the same in that language as in English!

          • bizbird6

            The Bible in another language is NOT the same as English, especially in the original language of the Bible.
            Why??? When the Bible was translated into English, King James got the best poets and writers in the English language to write up the Bible in the most beautiful language possible. Since he was a King, he was able to make the English Bible into a piece of poet beauty!
            However, the Bible in the original language was NOTHING like that. In the original, you will conflicting forms, conflicting styles, and conflicting messages.
            The conflicting styles indicate that there were many, many writers, not just one. And even worse, the names were phony. Different people with different styles would use the same names.
            Anyway, you need to read the Bible Experts, like Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Eary Doherty who can explain all these things much, much better than me. Why don’t you look up Bart Ehrman in Wiki which listed all his books?

          • sandraleesmith46

            The MESSAGE of the Bible in French, which was the other language besides English I’ve read it in, was the same as it is in English; although frankly I find the French far more poetic and lovely than the KJV in English. But that’s my personal opinion. In English, there are, in fact, many different translations besides the KJV; for example the Geneva which predates the KJV, and inspired it because ol’ King Jimmy was JEALOUS! It’s an easier read than the KJV in general. Then there are the RSV, the NIV, the amplified version, the New KJV, and probably at least a dozen or so more. There are the Douay-Reims approved and those that are not, etc. And having read many of those translations and studied using the Hebrew and Greek dictionaries as well. I really don’t need your supposed “experts” of whom I’ve never heard of a single one in “Bible” circles, whether fundamentalist, evangelical, or pentecostal.
            No one ever said the Bible was written by one person; it was 40-odd men over a period of some 2,000 years who wrote it, and the majority of those men never knew or even met each other in that time. Since Methuselah was the longest lived man on record and died before the first book was written down, by a good stretch, that would be an outlandish claim to make. What is consistent is the MESSAGE of the Bible from Genesis through Revelation. And it might be if you actually studied it under the tutelage of the Holy Spirit, you’d understand that, but in order to do that, you have to meet God’s requirements first, and I’m not sure that’s a likely event. Why are you so determined to fight against knowledge and belief in something you claim is fantasy and a lie? What are you so afraid of that you feel compelled to convince those of us who believe it’s not true? Most will respond to counter your statements, but not to “convince” you so much as any readers who might be wondering and shaky. I KNOW that my Redeemer lives. That you cannot and will not ever shake. Can I “prove” it in the sense of “court of law”? No, and neither can anyone else; but conversely, neither can YOU prove that He doesn’t under the same rules of evidence. So I’m curious why you feel such a strong compulsion to make it out to be a lie? Why should it matter to you what others believe? See, the truth is I really don’t care what you believe; that’s between you and God, but I do care when you go to publicly smearing that which I believe, and others do, on the public fora, and mocking it.

          • bizbird6

            I am telling the TRUTH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            I don’t doubt you believe that to be truth; but THE Truth also has another Name, and I don’t believe you’re acquainted with Him very well if at all. THE Truth doesn’t offend me in the least. Quite the opposite in fact.

          • bizbird6

            If you never heard him, then it is about time that you do.

            Just look him up in Wiki.

            Read his books because it will blow your mind!!

          • Larry Stauth

            And I have checked on your source.. Answer to your question, YES I AM! And obviously, smarter than you, since obviously you have no clue about the man, and taken him purely on his written word… the written word of ONE man..

            Versus a couple thousands? Let’s separate the fact that ALL of those thousands actually lived through the time. Separate the facts that over half of those individuals were writing about him, in order to discount his testimony. Separate the fact that hundreds of thousands died, by those trying to quell the witness’ of the man’s testimony..

            The fact you have the word of thousands versus one.. In a court of law, that would be called overwhelming evidence AGAINST the one!

            Add in the fact, the the authors OWN statements were he started with the conclusion and sought out for ANY evidence to validate it…

            In other words, completely OPPOSITE what an impartial writer should do, given that it meant he ignored anything that might have refuted his views and drew conclusions based on his opinions and NOT facts…

            Yep… I am smarter. Heck, I know some grade school kids who are smarter than that guy.

          • bizbird6

            It is NOT numbers that count, it is who is more knowledgeable and correct!

            If you ask people in Columbus day if the worlds is flat or round, the flat vote will win by a landslide.

            But is this correct??? Of course NOT!!!!

          • Larry Stauth

            You really are that clueless? People mocked Columbus for his views that the world was round.

            The “great minds” of that time said it was “fact” that the world was flat and the Sun evolved around the Earth.

            But over many decades before, Jewish writings tell us:

            Job 26:7 (doctrine older than the time of Moses)

            The wind blows to the south and turns to the north; round and round it goes, ever returning on its course.

            We also find thing’s “unseen” created…

            Hebrews 11:3

            By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.

            In Genesis, God gave Noah the specifics to building a boat, something that is still marveled today, especially since ship building would not be a standard for many generations later, but it would be decades before anything nearly that size would be designed.

            The whole chapter of Leviticus 15 (one of the 5 Books of Moses) describes, in detail, sanitation, including washing under prescribed details… like washing under running water. It would be long after the Dark Ages before Science would catch up…

            And largely because of the plagues that spread through the world and the fact that Jews seemed to be immune. They were accused of witchcraft… but it became apparent it was the cleanliness and cooking/diet that were keys.. Diet of what not to eat, like pigs and certain fowl is also in Leviticus.. and anyone knows now, that you do not eat pork or fowl that is not completely cooked.

            Deuteronomy 15 details sanitation, Science would not catch up until the 1800’s…

            The Story of Jonah details “mountains under the ocean”.. Science wouldn’t catch up until roughly 1900’s.

            The Scripture also explains that God created according to “Kinds”… not individual animals… and science has proven there are strict boundries.

            Example, both Lions and Tigers are cats, yet when Science chose to try and cross bread, the result was a sickly animal.

            When you breed a Horse and Mule, the result is an animal incapable of reproducing.

            Scripture tells us that man was formed from the dust of the earth… Science is just now catching up, proving the human body is made up of 28 individual elements, all of which can be found naturally in earth.

            The First Law of Thermodynamics established (Genesis 2:1-2). The First Law states that the total quantity of energy and matter in the universe is a constant. One form of energy or matter may be converted into another, but the total quantity always remains the same. Therefore the creation isfinished, exactly as God said way back in Genesis.

            The first three verses of Genesis accurately express all known aspects of the creation (Genesis 1:1-3). Science expresses the universe in terms of: time, space, matter, and energy.

            In Genesis chapter one we read: “In the beginning (time) God created the heavens (space) and the earth (matter)…Then God said, “Let there be light (energy).”

            No other creation account agrees with the observable
            evidence.

            As said, it has been shown that that are over 100 known “Scientific facts” written many, many years before Science validated them…

            There was NO way for men of those ages to know those things. In fact, many of the Scientific Fact have not been proven until long after times/date critics claim it was written.

            Include the fact that Historians have proven that all of the original texts have been validated to historically accurate for people, places, language usage and periodically correct events.

            Such as the time of Jesus, someone would have needed access to Historian records to fully understand the reason why Pontus Pilot would condemn an man “found without guilt” to a death sentence.

            Or the fact that he tried to pawn the issue off on the Governor, Herod.

            A personal with no knowledge of the time would not understand the claim by Paul, that he was Greek, Jewish AND a Roman Citizen… they would also need to fully understand the complicated laws, like the facts that ANY Roman citizen arrested, upon their request, MUST be tried before Caesar. Versus non-citizens, who would be tried by local authorities.

          • bizbird6

            Why are you Christians always defending God?

            Isn’t God suppose to be omnipotent? He is strong enough to speak and defend himself isn’t he? Why does he need to you weak mortal beings to always speak for him? Why is he so silent?

            Doesn’t the fact that he is so silent shows that maybe he does NOT exist and maybe NEVER existed at all?

            Doesn’t this SILENCE speak LOUDER than all your screaming and shouting? 100

          • bizbird6

            Bart D. Ehrman

            Author, ‘Forged: Writing in the Name of God—Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’

            Who Wrote The Bible and Why It Matters

            Posted: 03/25/11 09:38 PM ET

            Apart from the most rabid fundamentalists among us, nearly everyone admits that the Bible might contain errors — a faulty creation story here, a historical mistake there, a contradiction or two in some other place. But is it possible that the problem is worse than that — that the Bible actually contains lies?

            Most people wouldn’t put it that way, since the Bible is, after all, sacred Scripture for millions on our planet. But good Christian scholars of the Bible, including the top Protestant and Catholic scholars of America, will tell you that the Bible is full of lies, even if they refuse to use the term. And here is the truth: Many of the books
            of the New Testament were written by people who lied about their identity,
            claiming to be a famous apostle — Peter, Paul or James — knowing full well
            they were someone else. In modern parlance, that is a lie, and a book written
            by someone who lies about his identity is a forgery.

            Most modern scholars of the Bible shy away from these terms, and for understandable reasons, some having to do with their clientele. Teaching in Christian seminaries, or to largely Christian undergraduate populations, who wants to denigrate the cherished texts of Scripture by calling them forgeries built on lies? And so scholars use a different term for this phenomenon and call such books
            “pseudepigrapha.”

            You will find this antiseptic term throughout the writings of modern scholars of the Bible. It’s the term used in university classes on the New Testament, and in seminary courses, and in Ph.D seminars. What the people who use the term do not tell you is that it literally means “writing that is inscribed with a lie.”

            And that’s what such writings are.
            Whoever wrote the New Testament book of 2 Peter claimed to be Peter. But
            scholars everywhere — except for our friends among the fundamentalists — will
            tell you that there is no way on God’s green earth that Peter wrote the book.
            Someone else wrote it claiming to be Peter. Scholars may also tell you that it
            was an acceptable practice in the ancient world for someone to write a book in
            the name of someone else. But that is where they are wrong. If you look at what
            ancient people actually said about the practice, you’ll see that they
            invariably called it lying and condemned it as a deceitful practice, even in
            Christian circles. 2 Peter was finally accepted into the New Testament because
            the church fathers, centuries later, were convinced that Peter wrote it. But he
            didn’t. Someone else did. And that someone else lied about his identity.

            The same is true of many of the letters allegedly written by Paul. Most scholars will tell you that whereas seven of the 13 letters that go under Paul’s name are his, the other six are not. Their authors merely claimed to be Paul. In the ancient world, books like that were labeled as pseudoi — lies.

            This may all seem like a bit of antiquarian curiosity, especially for people whose lives don’t depend on the Bible or even people of faith for whom biblical matters are a peripheral interest at best. But in fact, it matters sometimes. Whoever wrote the book of 1 Timothy claimed to be Paul. But he was lying about that — he was someone else living after Paul had died. In his book, the author of 1 Timothy used
            Paul’s name and authority to address a problem that he saw in the church. Women were speaking out, exercising authority and teaching men. That had to stop. The author told women to be silent and submissive, and reminded his readers about what happened the first time a woman was allowed to exercise authority over a man, in that little incident in the garden of Eden. No, the author argued, if women wanted to be saved, they were to have babies (1 Tim. 2:11-15).

            Largely on the basis of this passage, the apostle Paul has been branded, by more liberation minded people of recent generations, as one of history’s great misogynists. The problem, of course, is that Paul never said any such thing. And why does it matter? Because the passage is still used by church leaders today to oppress and silence women.
            Why are there no women priests in the Catholic Church? Why are women not
            allowed to preach in conservative evangelical churches? Why are there churches
            today that do not allow women even to speak? In no small measure it is because
            Paul allegedly taught that women had to be silent, submissive and pregnant.
            Except that the person who taught this was not Paul, but someone lying about
            his identity so that his readers would think he was Paul.

            It may be one of the greatest ironies of the Christian scriptures that some of them insist on truth, while telling a lie. For no author is truth more important than for the
            “Paul” of Ephesians. He refers to the gospel as “the word of truth” (1:13); he indicates that the “truth is in Jesus”; he tells his readers to “speak the truth” to their neighbors (4:24-25); and he instructs his readers to “fasten the belt of truth around your waist” (6:14). And yet he himself lied about who he was. He was not really Paul.

            It appears that some of the New Testament writers, such as the authors of 2 Peter, 1 Timothy and Ephesians, felt they were perfectly justified to lie in order to tell the truth. But we today can at least evaluate their claims and realize just how human, and fallible, they were. They were creatures of their time and place. And so too
            were their teachings, lies and all.

            Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from HarperOne Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’. His latest b Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray
            Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North
            Carolina, Chapel Hill, and the New York Times bestselling author of ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from Harper One.Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’.

          • sandraleesmith46

            Great come back. I will disagree, however, on when we learned that the life was in the blood; that was a KNOWN fact by the time my Mom was practicing nursing in the late ’30s and during WW II very clearly. I believe, if memory serves, it was around the time of our Civil War that it was discovered that O2 is transported through the blood and thus it was essential to life. In any case certainly it was known well before I was a student nurse in the mid ’60s.

          • Larry Stauth

            Believe you are misunderstanding. Much of the misconceptions of the purpose of blood was seen as a carrier. They did understand that Oxygen was carried.

            But they also thought is someone is stick, it was because the blood was tainted (like spoiled milk).

            This led to the practice of bloodletting and the use of leeches.

            There was much growth through the years, but it was Darwin’s analogy that blood was just the vehicle.

            Today, we understand it is not only the source of sustaining life, All life begins with a single cell. The blood cells not only feed oxygen, they actually work to form the organs, right down to your skin.

            Microbiologist have discovered that the individual cell is actually a complete team of very sophisticated machine.

          • sandraleesmith46

            Surprise, back in the dark ages when I studied nursing, part of the course was an overview of medical history, including all that, but God’s Word announced that “the life is in the blood” back before Cain bashed Abel with a rock; it’s not as new information as you think apparently. We even learned microbiology when I was a student. I get it. I’m saying you’re mistaken on the timing. I saw my Mom’s books from when she was a student as well, and they included such information, although not in the degree of detail which I later learned. BTW leeches are still used today for certain procedures, quite effectively.

          • bizbird6

            You are distorting the issue completely. The main issue is NOT in regards if Doherty did or did not research anything, but if Christ ever existed at all!

            The main point is that Christ NEVER existed, but was just a FICTIONAL character.

            Those Christians were worshiping someone that NEVER existed.

          • bizbird6

            Non-Belief is BOOMING. Christianity is declining!

            Promises of afterlife or whatever are NOTHING if they are BOGUS.

            That is why people are ignoring Christianity.

            I can promise you the Moon, but if my promises are empty and worthless, then you would still end up with NOTHING!

            Millions are NOT believers of these empty promises, so they never expected these empty promises in the beginning!

        • Gary Seymour

          I feel sorry for you. Jesus spoke well of you.

          Joh_8:47 Whoever is of God hears the words of God. The reason why you do not hear them is that you are not of God.”

        • Light_V_Dark

          Brilliant-Godless-Scientists are quite often, Sociopathic-Misanthropist-Nihilistic-Pederasts, like Queen Dickie Dawkins and Arthur C. Clarke. You are actually AUTISTIC¿¿
          ….
          http://www.renewamerica.com/bb/viewtopic.php?p=175097#p175097
          ….
          Based on Wired Magazine’s observation that atheists tend to be quarrelsome, socially challenged men, to say nothing of the unpleasant personalities of leading public atheists such as Richard Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens and Michel Onfray, one could reasonably hypothesize that there is likely to be a strong correlation between Asperger’s and atheism.

          AN APPETITE FOR WONDER; AND SEX WITH LITTLE BOYS¿¿
          THE MAKING OF A SCIENTIST AND A FAERY PRINCESS¿?

          http://media.salon.com/2013/09/appetite_wonder.jpg?w=600

        • sandraleesmith46

          Really; so this fool thinks that Matthew, and John who wrote 2 of the gospels and John additionally wrote letters and the Revelation, after walking with Jesus for those 3 years were just fiction too? Or perhaps they hallucinated those 3 years? Grow a brain please, before you drivel again…

          • bizbird6

            If you read Bart Ehrman, Matthew and John never wrote the Bible. Imposters wrote it under their names. That is why Ehrman said the Bible is a LIE!

          • sandraleesmith46

            Sure, and if you read O, he claims he’s a Christian too, but his EVERY action and even the ring he wears, say different. Sorry, I’ll listen to the Holy Spirit, first and THEN any human regardless of what his credentials claim. Ask your pal, how it is that 40-odd men over a span of about 2,000 years wrote a 66 book collection that hold a consistent message from start to finish, when most of them never even met each other, and they sure didn’t have the Internet or even Ma Bell?

      • Mercyful

        Thank you Larry! Couldn’t have said it better.
        So sad that so many promtly embrace anybody’s statement without even questioning it but reject the truth that has proven itself over and over for thousands of years in and outside the Bible.

        • bizbird6

          People believed that the world was FLAT for even longer than thousands of years.

          In fact, probably a hundred or thousand times longer. It’s about time that the Bible goes extinct like the Dinosaurs.

      • sandraleesmith46

        CS Lewis is another who was trying to prove there was no God and became a Christian as a result of his findings. Well presented. And spot on.

        • Fuzzwell

          Even his Communist/Athiest wife became a Christian.

        • bizbird6

          CS Lewis has been dead for over half a century (1963), and belongs to another day and age.

          Let’s focus on people who has written books during the last 10 years at least.

    • Gary Seymour

      I feel sorry for you bizbird6, for when you come face to Face with the infinite God of the universe one day, and you will, it will be too late for you to change your mind. You are a dead man walking. Born once, die twice, born twice, die once. You must be born again. I am praying for you. One day you will bow the knee and confess that Jesus Christ is Lord.

      Rev_21:8 But as for the cowardly, the faithless, the detestable, as for murderers, the sexually immoral, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars, their portion will be in the lake that burns with fire and sulfur, which is the second death.”

    • rochesternative

      I’ve been a Christian for a long time. I don’t profess to know all commentators…or even a lot of them. So I’ve never heard of any of the guys you mentioned. I have however, heard of Billy Graham, Rick Warren, Andy Stanley, John Piper and Dr. Charles Stanley. All of them are well known and considered experts.
      There are a lot of people who profess to be Christians and experts on the Bible who truly do not know of what they speak. These people, misrepresent the Gospel (Joel Olsteen is one)

      • bizbird6

        Everyone that I listed are in Wiki Encyclopedia and have written many books.

    • Light_V_Dark

      I don’t argue with Heathen or “Christian”. Some people are evil and beyond redemption. You, appear to be one of THEM¿¿

      Revelation 2:2 Aramaic Bible in Plain English
      “I know your works, your toil and your patience, and that you cannot tolerate The Evil One, and you have tested those who claim to be Apostles, and they are not, and you have found them false.”

      http://24.media.tumblr.com/06178ff0b0f8f7e91a2a1e53102379fa/tumblr_mfi3i62f4G1rbrhnko1_250.gif

  • bizbird6

    God is NOT loving!!

    1. He murdered thousands or millions in Noah’s flood. He may try
    to justify it by saying that mankind is wicked. But does that include the
    children too? Is he saying that a 4 or 5 year old child is wicked and deserve
    to die? How about a 2 year old infant? Wicked also?

    2. Sodom and Gomorrah. Again the people are wicked! But again
    the Innocent children too?

    3. First Born Egyptians? But these are NOT wicked! God killed
    them just to teach the stubborn Pharaoh a lesson. Again, this is Loving and JUST????

    4. Canaanites? Again Wicked? (Or Just in the wrong place in the
    wrong time?) Again, the children and infants are wicked too?

    See, God is NOT Loving at all! In fact, he is a Monster and
    BULLY. Pushing his weight around over those poor humans!

    • rochesternative

      Items 1-4 are from the Old Testament. The people who lived at this time were “under the law” of the Hebrews. Grace does not come into play until much later. Furthermore, Hitler was NOT a Christian. You seem a bit conflicted, stating at the beginning of your post that God is not loving and then go on to say that we should not worship or BELIEVE in Him. In the old Testament, God shows occasional grace (forgiveness not deserved), but it is not until Jesus dies that there is true grace for all.

      • Larry Stauth

        Actually, Grace was there the whole time. Look at the Covenant with Abraham. It was there, but it needed to be fulfilled. This is why we read that Moses and Elijah were seen with Jesus at the time of the story of Jesus’ transfiguration.

        If not for grace, anyone before would have been condemned.

        Also see Jesus’ story regarding the rich man and Lazarus. Just comparing the 2 men, we can see grace abound in Lazarus.

        As for Hitler… He was actually Jewish. Which was much of the reasoning behind his views. He claimed to be Christian, to win the support of the German Church.

        But anyone that has read the biography commissioned by Adolf Hitler (himself), you will find that he supported Darwin’s ideas, and his “Superior Race” theories and where 100% based on the writing of Charles Darwin.

        Hitler openly paraded the thought that White skinned Germany’s were superior in every way. This is why Germany defeats, like Max Schmelings defeat to Joe Louis or Jesse Owens winning gold at the Olympics were 2 major setback to his control over the people.

    • Light_V_Dark

      God kills the Wicked, out of mercy. Children, raised by the Wicked, will turn out WICKED. When God kills these children, He let’s them reside in heaven.

      The rebellion against God, has ALWAYS been sexual.

      http://www.renewamerica.com/bb/viewtopic.php?p=175239#p175239

      “In other words, (Alfred) Kinsey set out to conduct a study that would reinforce his own liberal attitudes to sexuality, not because of pure scientific motives but because of his atheism and his belief in the Darwinian view that humans were merely animals and morality was repressive.”

      “Darwin’s Rogue Monkey, How a Diehard Evolutionist Used Junk Science to Kickstart the Sexual Revolution.” http://www.investigatemagazine.com/Kinsey.htm. (28 May, 2008)
      ….
      This little guy will die of his own wickedness and depravity. I wouldn’t mind helping him along, though.
      http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcTKuM8qy_iYzMzlRzE-lvjJBbJiVcs5QdPysowb81hzNgHZ1jHrWA

      • bizbird6

        Rather than kill all those Children from Noah’s Flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, Egyptian First Born, Canaan, etc., there are millions of alternative that an Omnipotent can choose to do.

        Rather than just Kill them ALL (like Genghis Khan, Attila, Stalin, or Hitler), Omnipotent God can adopt those children and put them into good families so that they can be raised as “Good” people instead.

        God can even choose to send good missionaries so as to CONVERT those “wicked” people so that they can ALL be spared and continue to be decent people.

        Again, God is suppose to be OMNIPOTENT, which mean that he can do ANYTHING!!!!

        Also, how about those “Egyptian First Born”? They are NOT wicked at all or guilty of anything? Their only crime is that their Leader (Pharaoh) was stubborn.

        So you deserve to be killed also because the elected President of the USA is no good also? So you deserve to die because of the actions of the US President? Come on now, use your head for once!!

        This is the behavior of an “All Wise”, All Loving”, “All Just” God????

        • Light_V_Dark
        • Light_V_Dark

          Proud Atheists are EVIL. Li’l Christians FORGIVE YOU..IT’S ALMOST OVER, BIZ..

          Re: Trolls: LvD, Cromag, and DaveC
          Isn’t there some ruleAxeloakleafdavehinesretardeddesign wrote: Actually i’m more of a Furry. But some Furries are also Bronies, but not all of them against changing what people say http://www.renewamerica.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=16673&p=175313#p175313

        • Judy

          The evil people of Noah’s day had most certainly heard the truth about God. God did see to that. Sodom’s people also knew the truth but chose to stay evil. They all were warned. Plus, God knows the future and knew that those little children you keep taking about were going to grow up evil like their parents so they really weren’t just innocent little children. I gotta tell ya, you will NEVER understand Christianity or the Bible unless you ask Jesus to come into to you heart, life ad soul. As an unbeliever you cannot know or understand the Scriptues. That’s one of the reasons Jesus spoke in parables many times. Non-Christians couldn’t or wouldn’t understand what He was saying.

          • bizbird6

            If God is Omnipotent, why didn’t he just adopt those Children and raised them to be good people rather than just kill all of them.

            God is NOT LOVE OR JUST, he is an EVIL Monster and Butcher that is worse than Genghis Khan, Attila, or Hitler!

      • bizbird6

        “When God kills these children, He let’s them reside in heaven.”

        where is your proof for that? There is NO proof of that in the Bible.

        You are setting yourself as “God” when you decide FOR God.

        Isn’t that Blasphemy when you try to play God???!!!

        • Light_V_Dark

          Corinthians 2:14
          14 For a beastly man perceiveth not those things that be of the Spirit of God; for it is folly to him, and he may not understand, for it is examined ghostly [for it is examined, "or assayed", ghostly].
          ···
          1 Corinthians 2:15
          15 But he who is spiritual judges all things, yet he himself is “rightly” judged by no one.

        • Light_V_Dark

          http://downloadpolitics.com/entry.php?95-Good-News-Atheists-GOD-DOES-NOT-LOVE-YOU!-EAT-SOME-%A1T-AND-DIE!

          It is a battle between Light and Darkness. You DON’T UNDERSTAND THIS, AND NEVER WILL.
          John 3:19-21 (WYC)
          19 And this is the DOOM, for LIGHT came into the world, AND MEN LOVED MORE DARKNESS THAN LIGHT; FOR THEIR WORKS WERE EVIL[^]·

          20 For each man that doeth evil, hateth the light; and he cometh not to the light [and cometh not to the light], that his works be not reproved.

          21 But he that doeth truth, cometh to the light, that his works be showed, that they be done in God.

        • Light_V_Dark

          This is evidence of the Supernatural. You will sneer…I’M NOT IMPRESSED??!!!¡¡¡¿¿¿

          Joplin, Missouri,
          A little boy and his father were also in a vehicle that was being tossed around. As another car was hurtling to them, the boy recounted that two large butterfly people were holding the other car back. Only the boy saw the angels. However, the father witnessed the miracle.

          Another story is that of a little 4-year-old boy was found in the middle of a field 6 miles away. A deputy sheriff rescued the boy and asked him how he got there? The little boy responded, “The angels brought me and set me down here.”

          http://www.renewamerica.com/bb/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=15522&p=175251#p175251

          http://bloximages.newyork1.vip.townnews.com/stltoday.com/content/tncms/assets/v3/editorial/9/ad/9adef8da-7ccc-58c4-95c3-88ae8f7e05ff/4eea5fdf49946.preview-620.jpg?mobile_touch=true

        • Light_V_Dark

          http://downloadpolitics.com/entry.php?199-Woe-unto-them-that-call-evil-good-and-good-evil-Isaiah-5-20
          God kills evil people. Governments kill INNOCENT ONES.

          If we don’t sigh up and BE HEALTHY, we will be..*EXCUTED IN A KINDLY MANNER!

          Under Socialism, you would not be allowed to be poor. You would be forcibly fed, clothed, lodged, taught, and employed whether you liked it or not. If it were discovered that you had not character and industry enough to be worth all this trouble*, you might possibly be executed in a kindly manner; but whilst you were permitted to live, you would have to live well.”
          http://www.awakeandarise.org/Images/FabianWindow.jpg

        • Light_V_Dark

          You have to understand, Biz, that the way to rebuff a fictional vamire, is to show a Bible to her.

          Proverbs 4,
          18*The way of the righteous is like the first gleam of dawn, which shines ever brighter until the full light of day.

          19*But the way of the wicked is like total darkness. They have no idea what they are stumbling over.

          Little Christians will flip out because this passage is from the Old Jew Testament.
          http://downloadpolitics.com/entry.php?95-Good-News-Atheists-GOD-DOES-NOT-LOVE-YOU!-EAT-SOME-%A1T-AND-DIE!

        • Light_V_Dark

          My last post to you, Biz. Some people know more than I do. You aren’t one of them.

          http://www.renewamerica.com/bb/viewtopic.php?p=175236#p175236
          Perverted love and perverted hatred underlie acts. The simpleton loves simplicity, preferring to be unwarned against evil; the scorner finds delight in letting his rank tongue blossom into speech; and the false direction given to love gives a fatal twist to its corresponding hate, so that the fool detests ‘knowledge’ as a thief the policeman’s lantern. You cannot love what you should loathe, without loathing what you should love. Inner longings and revulsions settle character and acts.

        • Light_V_Dark

          I’m sorry, I said I wasn’t going to post to you anymore, but, this is poignant. Today’s Christian hates this as much as you do, because it comes from the JEW BIBLE.

          http://carm.org/kjv/Prov/Prov_8.htm
          17 I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me.

          35 For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain favour of the LORD.

          36 But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

    • Light_V_Dark

      I don’t have to quote the Bible. Evil people deserve death. But, just the way you live(sic), shaves 20 years off your lives on average.

      And the more you hiss at, scorn, mock and persecute your betters, the faster you speed up the process, IMBECILE¿¿

      http://images.cdn.bigcartel.com/bigcartel/product_images/126248703/max_h-1000+max_w-1000/tumblr_mudhw1FozH1ri8vdto2_500.jpg

    • Light_V_Dark

      Hitler was a Rightwing-Butch-Ubermensch-Atheist…Leftists are Femmes. That is why you will ALWAYS INVOKE GAYDOLPH’S NAME….FOREVER AND EVER¿¿
      ….
      gaynazis.com

      German gays made a cult of Richard Wagner’s operas. They flocked to them and made the operas pickup sites. Hitler was often in the audience, and was known to adore Wagner’s operas. He said “Wagner is my religion.”

      http://gaynazis.com/HitlerYoungSelfSketchSide.jpg

      • Light_V_Dark

        I EXXED myself by accident, Comrade. Common in Wicked People’s quivers, is that you are often Vegetarians and Animal Rights Loons.

        vegetariansareevil.com
        Pol Pot, Adolf Hitler, Charles Manson, Genghis Khan, what is it about vegetarians that make them so especially vicious, while they believe that they are morally superior to the rest of us?

        http://vegetariansareevil.com/images/evilvegsthumb.jpg

  • Light_V_Dark
  • Light_V_Dark

    What’s wrong with this picture, is that 99% of Li’l Christians, HEART their Mohammedan brothers as much as the Liberals do. They’ve always adored Communists, and now, Sodomites¿¿ JESUS LOVES ALL HIS LITTLE CHILDREN, NO EXCEPTIONS¿!

    http://4.bp.blogspot.com/-EJNXMzFnH7Q/Uar_OEQ-z0I/AAAAAAAAB1g/URiu4op_4X4/s1600/christian+vs+Islam.jpg

  • Light_V_Dark

    Liberals went right orgasmic over this Satanic-Harpie. Our Li’l Christians prayed for, or ignored her…Because, when you make believe that there is no such thing as EVIL, it can’t hurt you¿¿
    http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_hUqhilguoPs/RyUoCtB8ZiI/AAAAAAAABrg/VnldcPxCuHI/s1600/codepinkdesireeanitaalifairooz5.jpg

  • bizbird6

    John Shelby Spong

    Retired American Bishop of the Episcopal Church

    GET UPDATES FROM John Shelby Spong

    Gospel of John: What Everyone Should Know About The Fourth Gospel

    Posted: 06/11/2013 12:09pm

    Almost any poll of regular church goers will reveal that their favorite book in the New Testament is the Gospel of John. It is the book that is most often used at Christian funerals. It includes such well known and oft-quoted texts as: “God so
    loved the world that he gave his only son that whoever believes in him should
    not perish but have everlasting life.” It boasts the shortest verse in the
    Bible: “Jesus wept,” which serves the needs of many cross word puzzle
    creators. Its prologue was used for centuries in Catholic liturgies as
    “the last gospel” at the mass. It includes characters like Doubting
    Thomas, whose very name has entered our public discourse.

    Yet, I suspect that if these devotees of John’s Gospel were introduced to the world of Johannine scholarship, they would be both shocked and angered by contemporary insights into this treasured book. It is to place much of this scholarship into the public arena that I have written the book, “The Fourth Gospel: Tales of a Jewish Mystic.”

    Among the conclusions that I have reached in my intensive five-year-long study
    of John’s Gospel are these:

    1) There is no way that the Fourth Gospel was written by John Zebedee or by any of the disciples of Jesus. The author of this book is not a single individual, but is at least three different writers/editors, who did their layered work over a period of 25
    to 30 years.

    2) There is probably not a single word attributed to Jesus in this book that the Jesus of history actually spoke. This includes all the “I Am” sayings and all of the
    “Farewell Discourses.”

    3) Not one of the signs (the Fourth Gospel’s word for miracles) recorded in this book was, in all probability, something that actually happened. This means that Jesus never changed water into wine, fed a multitude with five loaves and two fish or raised Lazarus from the dead.

    4) Many of the characters who appear in the pages of the Fourth Gospel are literary creations of its author and were never intended to be understood as real people, who actually lived in history. This includes Nathaniel, who is introduced with great fanfare in chapter one and is treated in John’s Gospel as one of
    “the Twelve,” as well as the enigmatic character called by the Fourth
    Gospel “the disciple whom Jesus loved,” who is introduced in Chapter
    13 and who stars in this narrative from then on up to and including the
    resurrection event. Between those two “bookend” characters, we run
    into such well-known figures as Nicodemus, the Samaritan woman by the well, the
    man crippled for 38 years and the man born blind, none of whom has ever been
    mentioned before in any written Christian source and each of whom in all
    probability is nothing more than the literary creation of the author.

    5) John’s Gospel seems to ridicule anyone who might read this book as a work of literal history. For example, Jesus says to Nicodemus: “You must be born again.”
    Nicodemus, the literalist, says: “Born again? I am a grown man! How can I
    crawl back into my mother’s womb and be born again?”
    Jesus says to the Samaritan woman: “If you know the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you ‘Give me a drink,’ you would have asked him and he would give you living water.” The Samaritan woman, a literalist, responds: “Man, you
    don’t even have a bucket!”

    6) The Gospel also exaggerates its details, once more I believe, to counter any attempt to read it literally. For example, Jesus does not just turn water into wine, he turns it into 150 gallons of wine! Jesus does not just give sight to a blind man, he gives sight to a man born blind! Jesus does not just raise a person from the dead, he raises one who has been dead and even buried for four days, one who is still bound in grave clothes and one who, according to the King James translation “already stinketh” with the odor of decaying flesh!

    Finally this book will challenge the way the Fourth Gospel has been used in Christian history as the guarantor of what came to be called Christian orthodoxy or creedal Christianity. The Council of Nicea in 325 C.E. leaned on the Fourth Gospel as literal history in order to formulate the creeds and ultimately to undergird uch doctrines as the Incarnation and the Holy Trinity.

    The texts used to support that creedal development, my studies have led me to affirm, have nothing to do with an external God entering humanity in the person of Jesus, but are rather attempts to describe the experience of the human breaking the boundaries of consciousness and entering into the transformation available inside a sense of a mystical oneness with God. If that is so, then the Fourth Gospel has the potential to become the primary biblical source upon the basis of which Christianity can be changed dramatically to speak with radical freshness to the 21st century.

    Christianity is not about the divine becoming human so much as it is about the human becoming divine. That is a paradigm shift of the first order.

    These are the conclusions to which my study of John’s Gospel has led me, and they are the conclusions that I explore and document in this book “The Fourth Gospel: Tales of a Jewish Mystic.”1

    • Larry Stauth

      From Spong’s bio…

      A prominent theme in Spong’s writing is that the popular and literal interpretations of Christian scripture are not sustainable and do not speak honestly to the situation of modern Christian communities

      (In other words, he makes his own interpretations based on things he feels are pertinent, instead of the facts).

      He is representative of a stream of thought with roots in the medieval universalism of Peter Abelard and the existentialism of Paul Tillich, whom he has called his favorite theologian

      Look up those individuals and the mentioned theologies… for an intelligent person, it should be clear why this man is called a heretic.

      The list of critics for this guy is longer than the President… He is as much a creditably source as my dog.

      Seriously.. Maybe you should actually COMPARE what he is writing to what is written…

      But I loved the fact he attempts to conclude John did not write it, because, essentially he said so..

      Which I think is why the man had been censored by the church… note.. Evidence REQUIRES actually validated proof. Thinking something does not constitute fact.

      And posting this stuff, only goes to prove you are more ignorant, by actually posting it. And intelligent person would actually take the time to double check to make sure the guy wasn’t a crackpot…

      or recanted his position…

      • bizbird6

        He is NOT a Crack pot because he is a Bishop and has written many books. He is also listed in Wiki. The Episcopal Church does not promote “crack pots” to Bishop positions.

        How many books have you written? Are you a Bishop? Are you listed in Wiki?

        It sound like you are a “NO BODY”, yet you knock down all these people who have done so many great things. (I don’t mean to offend you, but it is the total truth!)

        Actually the same is true with Ted Turner He has done more than you or anyone who has written any thing on this Blog.

        Just the fact that so many people are talking about him shows that he is better than you all.

        How come YOUR name doesn’t appear on top of this article?

        • Judy

          Since bishops are not in the Bible, they’re worthless. And anyone and anything can be ‘listed’ in Wiki, so that’s really not a plus either. Oh, and any nut ball can write a book! It’s great that Ted and others have done a lot of good in the world but will count for NOTHING unless they repent and ask Jesus into their lives. All of our ‘good’ deeds are as filthy rags to God unless we believe in His Son Jesus. It’s really the only thing God asks of us

  • bizbird6

    Bart D. Ehrman

    Author, ‘Forged: Writing in the Name of God—Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’

    Who Wrote The Bible and Why It Matters

    Posted: 03/25/11 09:38 PM ET

    Apart from the most rabid fundamentalists among us, nearly everyone admits that the Bible might contain errors — a faulty creation story here, a historical mistake there, a contradiction or two in some other place. But is it possible that the problem is worse than that — that the Bible actually contains lies?

    Most people wouldn’t put it that way, since the Bible is, after all, sacred Scripture for millions on our planet. But good Christian scholars of the Bible, including the top Protestant and Catholic scholars of America, will tell you that the Bible is full of lies, even if they refuse to use the term. And here is the truth: Many of the books
    of the New Testament were written by people who lied about their identity,
    claiming to be a famous apostle — Peter, Paul or James — knowing full well
    they were someone else. In modern parlance, that is a lie, and a book written
    by someone who lies about his identity is a forgery.

    Most modern scholars of the Bible shy away from these terms, and for understandable reasons, some having to do with their clientele. Teaching in Christian seminaries, or to largely Christian undergraduate populations, who wants to denigrate the cherished texts of Scripture by calling them forgeries built on lies? And so scholars use a different term for this phenomenon and call such books
    “pseudepigrapha.”

    You will find this antiseptic term throughout the writings of modern scholars of the Bible. It’s the term used in university classes on the New Testament, and in seminary courses, and in Ph.D seminars. What the people who use the term do not tell you is that it literally means “writing that is inscribed with a lie.”

    And that’s what such writings are.
    Whoever wrote the New Testament book of 2 Peter claimed to be Peter. But
    scholars everywhere — except for our friends among the fundamentalists — will
    tell you that there is no way on God’s green earth that Peter wrote the book.
    Someone else wrote it claiming to be Peter. Scholars may also tell you that it
    was an acceptable practice in the ancient world for someone to write a book in
    the name of someone else. But that is where they are wrong. If you look at what
    ancient people actually said about the practice, you’ll see that they
    invariably called it lying and condemned it as a deceitful practice, even in
    Christian circles. 2 Peter was finally accepted into the New Testament because
    the church fathers, centuries later, were convinced that Peter wrote it. But he
    didn’t. Someone else did. And that someone else lied about his identity.

    The same is true of many of the letters allegedly written by Paul. Most scholars will tell you that whereas seven of the 13 letters that go under Paul’s name are his, the other six are not. Their authors merely claimed to be Paul. In the ancient world, books like that were labeled as pseudoi — lies.

    This may all seem like a bit of antiquarian curiosity, especially for people whose lives don’t depend on the Bible or even people of faith for whom biblical matters are a peripheral interest at best. But in fact, it matters sometimes. Whoever wrote the book of 1 Timothy claimed to be Paul. But he was lying about that — he was someone else living after Paul had died. In his book, the author of 1 Timothy used
    Paul’s name and authority to address a problem that he saw in the church. Women were speaking out, exercising authority and teaching men. That had to stop. The author told women to be silent and submissive, and reminded his readers about what happened the first time a woman was allowed to exercise authority over a man, in that little incident in the garden of Eden. No, the author argued, if women wanted to be saved, they were to have babies (1 Tim. 2:11-15).

    Largely on the basis of this passage, the apostle Paul has been branded, by more liberation minded people of recent generations, as one of history’s great misogynists. The problem, of course, is that Paul never said any such thing. And why does it matter? Because the passage is still used by church leaders today to oppress and silence women.
    Why are there no women priests in the Catholic Church? Why are women not
    allowed to preach in conservative evangelical churches? Why are there churches
    today that do not allow women even to speak? In no small measure it is because
    Paul allegedly taught that women had to be silent, submissive and pregnant.
    Except that the person who taught this was not Paul, but someone lying about
    his identity so that his readers would think he was Paul.

    It may be one of the greatest ironies of the Christian scriptures that some of them insist on truth, while telling a lie. For no author is truth more important than for the
    “Paul” of Ephesians. He refers to the gospel as “the word of truth” (1:13); he indicates that the “truth is in Jesus”; he tells his readers to “speak the truth” to their neighbors (4:24-25); and he instructs his readers to “fasten the belt of truth around your waist” (6:14). And yet he himself lied about who he was. He was not really Paul.

    It appears that some of the New Testament writers, such as the authors of 2 Peter, 1 Timothy and Ephesians, felt they were perfectly justified to lie in order to tell the truth. But we today can at least evaluate their claims and realize just how human, and fallible, they were. They were creatures of their time and place. And so too
    were their teachings, lies and all.

    Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from HarperOne Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’. His latest b Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray
    Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North
    Carolina, Chapel Hill, and the New York Times bestselling author of ‘M’Forged: Writing in the Name of God — Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’, is now available from Harper One.Misquoting Jesus’ and ‘Jesus, Interrupted’.

    • Gary Seymour

      I feel sorry for you friend because one day you are going to find out for yourself just how wrong you are and then it will be too late for you to change your mind. You’re arguments against the Bible are laughable at best; the sources you refer to were not there and are concocting their own ideas and spewing them out as truth. The writers of the Bible were there, especially the New Testament writers who physically saw and spoke with Jesus and witnessed events first hand. These men of old are far more credible then the sources you tout which are no sources at all, no, only sorry little men trying to exalt their vain imaginations above the knowledge of Christ, but in Jesus Name, I destroy those arguments and take those phony thoughts captive to obey Christ.

      2Cor_10:5 We destroy arguments and every lofty opinion raised against the knowledge of God, and take every thought captive to obey Christ,

      • bizbird6

        New Testament writers??? They don’t exist! How does one learn to read and write? By going to school right?

        But were there public schools in Christ’s days? There is a good chance that Christ, all his apostles, and all his relatives NEVER learned to read and write!

        The only people who can read and write were a few wealthy landowners who can hire private tutors. Those tutors come to the home of these few wealthy people teach their children how to read and write.

        Can the son of Carpenter or son of a fishermen read and write? I doubt it. The literacy rates in those days were something like 1% or 2%.

        So very few of Christ contacts can read and write so the chances or Christ having any contact with any NEW Testament writer were totally remote.

        • Gary Seymour

          Spoken like a true humanist; oh, I forgot, you all believe your ancestors came from apes. Sorry to disappoint you sparky but people were quite intelligent in those days, in fact much smarter than you have revealed yourself to be.

          The difference between them and you is that they were smart enough to accept the Truth when they heard it and saw it. You on the other hand, continue to come up with reasons not to believe, which one day, will be to your sorrow.

          One day you will wake up and discover that your life is over and you are face to Face with Jesus Christ and the reality that all of the stupid, blind individuals, who led other silly, blind individuals like yourself who are willing to fall for anything and everything right to the gates of hell and kept you from receiving the truth of Jesus Christ, and you’ll have no one to blame but yourself

          . But here’s the real bottom line; the reason you keep denying God, the Bible, and Jesus Christ is because if you acknowledged any of those three, you would have to live by the moral rules and eternal laws set up from the foundation of the world. And you think if you don’t acknowledge them then those rules don’t apply to you.

          You can dismiss me and everyone else who is trying to save your life from eternal separation from the God who loves you, but you won’t be able to dismiss Christ looking you in the eyes and saying depart from Me, you worker of iniquity, I never knew you.

          • bizbird6

            No we did NOT come from Apes but we have common ancestors as the Ape!

            We WILL NOT come across Christ. I use “WE” because that applies to both you and me and everyone else! Christ probably never existed and even if he did, he is long dead and buried!

            It is about time we move on and embrace Science!!

            Science gave us Electric lights, TV, Radios, airplanes and even this computer that you are using now!!!

            Science has proven its worth to the world, while Religion has proven nothing.

          • Gary Seymour

            Well my friend, I guess our discussion is over; I have done what God has called me to do and that is to tell you the truth and pray that you believe it. Now when your day comes, you are without excuse for not accepting Christ and for rejecting Him. May God have mercy on your soul; I ‘m praying for your salvation.

            Rom 1:16 For I am not ashamed of the gospel, for it is the power of God for salvation to everyone who believes, to the Jew first and also to the Greek.

            Rom 1:17 For in it the righteousness of God is revealed from faith for faith, as it is written, “The righteous shall live by faith.”

            Rom 1:18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.

            Rom 1:19 For what can be known about God is plain to them, because God has shown it to them.

            Rom 1:20 For his invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made. So they are without excuse.

            Rom 1:21 For although they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened.

            Rom 1:22 Claiming to be wise, they became fools,

            Rom 1:23 and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and creeping things.

            Rom 1:24 Therefore God gave them up in the lusts of their hearts to impurity, to the dishonoring of their bodies among themselves,
            Rom 1:25 because they exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever! Amen.

            Rom 1:26 For this reason God gave them up to dishonorable passions. For their women exchanged natural relations for those that are contrary to nature;

            Rom 1:27 and the men likewise gave up natural relations with women and were consumed with passion for one another, men committing shameless acts with men and receiving in themselves the due penalty for their error.
            Rom 1:28 And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done.

            Rom 1:29 They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness, evil, covetousness, malice. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, maliciousness. They are gossips,

            Rom 1:30 slanderers, haters of God, insolent, haughty, boastful, inventors of evil, disobedient to parents,

            Rom 1:31 foolish, faithless, heartless, ruthless.

            Rom 1:32 Though they know God’s righteous decree that those who practice such things deserve to die, they not only do them but give approval to those who practice them.

          • bizbird6

            Those Biblical quotations are worthless!!

            You need to read the Bible in its original language, which Bart Ehrman and Earl Doherty can do, The language is important because language makes a BIG difference.

            The Bible in another language is NOT the same as English, especially in the original language of the Bible.

            Why??? When the Bible was translated into English, King James got the best poets and writers in the English language to write up the Bible in the most beautiful language possible. Since he was a King, he was able to make the English Bible into a piece of poet beauty!

            That is why you are INSPIRED when you read the Bible, because it was DELIBERATELY written so that whoever reads it WILL BE INSPIRED!

            However, the Bible in the original language was NOTHING like that. In the original, you will conflicting forms, conflicting
            styles, and conflicting messages.

            The conflicting styles indicate that there were many, many writers, not just one. And even worse, the names were phony. Different people with different styles would use the same names.

            Anyway, you need to read the Bible Experts, like Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Eary Doherty who can explain all these things much, much better than me. Why don’t you look up Bart Ehrman in Wiki which listed all his books?

          • Gary Seymour

            guess what, there will come a day for you when you face the infinite God of the universe and I promise you that you will remember each and every single word of the book you call worthless and you will weep uncontrollably because when you had the chance to bow the knee, you stiffened your neck and hardened your heart.

          • bizbird6

            Sorry, we just don’t agree!!!

          • Gary Seymour

            One day you will agree that what I told you was the truth; you see, the truth is the truth, whether you believe it or not, it’s still the truth. It has always been the truth and your disbelief will not change that fact. You were born a specific gender; now you can dress up like the other sex, but the truth is, you are still the sex that you were born as. And all the clothes, makeup, others telling you that you are now that other sex doesn’t change the truth of who you really are.
            Take gravity for instance; you can tell yourself that you are Wiley Coyote and if you step off of the top of a sheer cliff that you, like the cartoon character, will stand there for five seconds before plummeting to the ground. The truth is, that is false thinking, the reality of gravity is true whether or not you chose to believe it; you can’t alter or change it in any way, not by disbelief, or mind over matter, or by the books of this guy or that guy telling you that you can stand in mid air like Wiley Coyote for five seconds.
            And you can’t change the Truth of the Bible or the Truth of Jesus Christ and His resurrection. Truth is and always be the truth, no matter what. Still praying for you that you will come to the saving knowledge of Christ. You like to get facts and to read so maybe you can read this: http://www.leestrobel.com
            You present yourself as intelligent and someone who would look at all the facts and not just one side of the story. So in all fairness, I hope you will examine the web site presented above by a former Atheist who set out to prove the Bible, God, and Jesus Christ as fiction and bunk, not to be believed. I hope you are man enough to really check it out. Love in Christ.

          • Judy

            King James couldn’t speak Greek or Hebrew and that is why he had it translated into English. These men were so set on translating it absolutely correctly that f they got one thing on the page wrong, they threw it away and pinned another one.And, my minister is a Greek and Hebrew scholar and believes the NEW King James version is the most accurate. So, if there was a question of what a word meant then and now we would be shown the correct way as usual. But the main thing is the central message of the Bible, how to live with God eternally, was always there.

          • bizbird6

            Why are you Christians always defending God?

            Isn’t God suppose to be omnipotent? He is strong enough to speak and defend himself isn’t he? Why does he need to you weak mortal beings to always speak for him? Why is he so silent?

            Doesn’t the fact that he is so silent shows that maybe he does NOT exist and maybe NEVER existed at all?

            Doesn’t this SILENCE speak LOUDER than all your screaming and shouting? 0

          • Gary Seymour

            We’re not defending Him, we’re trying to warn dummies like you who seem to be to stupid or too ignorant or both to see the Truth. You are truly a fool and by all human standards should be dismissed and cast to the wayside, but Christ died and rose again for fools like you. One day you will understand, either before you die to your salvation or after you die to your horror.

          • Gary Seymour

            Anybody with half a brain, by instinct defends someone they love, even if they are capable of defending themselves. That’s what love does. If you knew that Love you would too.

          • bizbird6

            I know Christianity extremely, extremely well!

            I went to a Christian school for almost 12 years and we studied Christ and the Bible almost everyday for years and years and years.

            That is why I knew Christianity was totally false, especially when I learned about Science and the marvelous discoveries of Science!

            And I am not the only one. There are many, many other Ex-Christians that experienced the same things as me.

            Not only did I know Christ and the Bible, also read about other EX-Christians who also learned about what I learned and did very detailed research about the Bible and found that the Bible is totally worthless!

            The main point is that you know about Christ and the Bible, but you don’t know about other things that we Ex-Christian learned later.

            By the way, Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Earl Doherty were all Ex-Christian that now know better. Bart Ehrman was born and raised an Evangelical Christian and Bible believer who dedicated his whole life to studying the Bible, only to find finally that it is totally worthless.

            You need to abandon Christianity and throw that worthless Bible into the nearest trash bin!

          • Gary Seymour

            Obviously you only know religion; you have no knowledge of relationship. All you know is the man made traditions and failures that try to work their way to God and they are all dead ends.

            You can have all the knowledge in the world; you can be another Einstein, but if the head knowledge doesn’t become heart knowledge then you’re just a dead man walking with no hope of anything as far as you can tell beyond the last breath of your life.

            All your knowledge failed to teach you that you are an eternal being and you will live forever. The only question left for you to ponder and think about is where are you going to spend eternity after you take that last breath?

            You will still have all your senses, all of your feelings, right down to the very last nerve and thought. But sadly, unless you run from religion and embrace relationship with Christ, YOU WILL die in your sin and you will spend eternity in hell.

            The Pharisee’s had tons and tons of head knowledge and Jesus said that they were full of dead man’s bones, white washed tombs, looking good on the outside, but inside like filthy rags.

            Based on every one of your posts and replies, you sir are a Pharisee. This is what the Apostle said of people like you:

            2Ti_3:7 always learning and never able to arrive at a knowledge of the truth.

          • bizbird6

            Relationships are subjective!! Anyone can have an imaginary friend and call it “God”, but the important thing to remember that it is imaginary only and NOT real.

          • Gary Seymour

            I have people to reach with the love of Christ and unfortunately, you’re not one of them. You have rejected Christ and now you have to pay the penalty for that rejection. Have a good life, at least until you breath your last breath here on earth, but it won’t be the end. I’n not sorry for you any longer, just sad

          • bizbird6

            Again, Millions are abandoning Christ and the Bible and so should you. Come on, join us!!! Don’t be afraid, it is NOT that hard!!!

          • Gary Seymour

            Oh foolish, pathetic little man, you’re waisting your time with me. See ya, wouldn’t want to be ya.

            2Ti 1:12 But I am not ashamed, for I know whom I have believed, and I am convinced that he is able to guard until that Day what has been entrusted to me.

          • Gary Seymour
          • Gary Seymour

            1Co 1:12 What I mean is that each one of you says, “I follow Paul,” or “I follow Apollos,” or “I follow Cephas,” or “I follow Christ.”

            1Co 1:13 Is Christ divided? Was Paul crucified for you? Or were you baptized in the name of Paul?

            1Co 1:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you except Crispus and Gaius,

            1Co 1:15 so that no one may say that you were baptized in my name.

            1Co 1:16 (I did baptize also the household of Stephanas. Beyond that, I do not know whether I baptized anyone else.)

            1Co 1:17 For Christ did not send me to baptize but to preach the gospel, and not with words of eloquent wisdom, lest the cross of Christ be emptied of its power.

            1Co 1:18 For the word of the cross is folly to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

            1Co 1:19 For it is written, “I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and the discernment of the discerning I will thwart.”

            1Co 1:20 Where is the one who is wise? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made foolish the wisdom of the world?

            1Co 1:21 For since, in the wisdom of God, the world did not know God through wisdom, it pleased God through the folly of what we preach to save those who believe.

            1Co 1:22 For Jews demand signs and Greeks seek wisdom,

            1Co 1:23 but we preach Christ crucified, a stumbling block to Jews and folly to Gentiles,

            1Co 1:24 but to those who are called, both Jews and Greeks, Christ the power of God and the wisdom of God.

            1Co 1:25 For the foolishness of God is wiser than men, and the weakness of God is stronger than men.

            1Co 1:26 For consider your calling, brothers: not many of you were wise according to worldly standards, not many were powerful, not many were of noble birth.

            1Co 1:27 But God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise; God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong;

            1Co 1:28 God chose what is low and despised in the world, even things that are not, to bring to nothing things that are,

            1Co 1:29 so that no human being might boast in the presence of God.

            1Co 1:30 And because of him you are in Christ Jesus, who became to us wisdom from God, righteousness and sanctification and redemption,

            1Co 1:31 so that, as it is written, “Let the one who boasts, boast in the Lord.”

            There you go again, looking to a man; don’t look to me, I am nothing. You must look to Christ. Looking to me won’t save you. I have no power for anything but to be a frail, mistake ridden man in need of a Savior, just like you. Follow me as I follow Christ. I boast in Christ alone. I’m always available if you want to start that love relationship with Christ. I’m praying for you

          • Gary Seymour

            Maybe the day will come when I can call you by your name and not just bizbird6. You know mine; I won’t hide it. I am not ashamed of who I am in Christ or my name. Jesus loves you and so do I

          • bizbird6

            FORGET God and Christ!!!! Christ NEVER existed and even if he did, he is long dead and buried!!!

            Throw away that junk Bible and everything to do with it.

            Forget anything that is older than 100 years and let us focus on Science and today and modern times!

            Join the rest of the world that is also giving up on Religion. This is what the rest of the world is doing. You already saw those religious numbers coming out of Sweden, England, and France that I emailed earlier.

            Let us move on today!!!! The rest of the world is doing it and so should you!

          • Gary Seymour

            Act 7:51 “You stiff-necked people, uncircumcised in heart and ears, you always resist the Holy Spirit. As your fathers did, so do you.

          • Gary Seymour

            And yes, give up on religion; it’s obvious you will never have a relationship with Christ, but you do well to run from religion. But the day will come for you when you will face Christ. So now I leave you and bid you adieu. and farewell; your eternity awaits you.

            Luk_9:5 And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them.

          • bizbird6

            You NEVER had a relationship with Christ either.

            You use Christ as your IMAGINARY friend! This is nothing new! Millions of people also have imaginary friends. It makes you feel less lonely.

            However, most people outgrew imaginary friends when they grow up.

            However, in your case, you NEVER outgrew that imaginary relationship. The important thing to remember is that it IS ONLY AN IMAGINARY thing and NOT REAL!

          • Gary Seymour

            Ha ha ha, that’s a good one, you should get on SSI or disability; you definitely have mental difficulties. As one of the many illegal aliens would say to you with their limited English skills as they stand behind or in front of you at the ballot box as you both vote for Obama in 2016, You are a STUPIDO man, Your ranting is a perfect display of ignorance at its finest. It has been a pleasure debating with you, if for no other reason than to show all my Christian friends what a person going to hell looks and acts like. Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha, you’re the funniest little man I have ever met. well, the joke is on you, ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!!!!!!

          • bizbird6

            Which countries are among the Happiest?

            If you look down the list, you will find that those are HAPPIEST are also the most ATHEISTIC!!!

            Some interesting facts:

            This shows the most “happy” countries in the world in which Denmark (80% atheists) is on top. The religious countries are way down below. Of the top 10, 7 are in the most atheistic/agnostic countries.

            1. Denmark

            2. Switzerland

            3. Austria

            4. Iceland

            5. The Bahamas

            6. Finland

            7 Sweden

            8. Bhutan

            9. Brunei

            10. Canada

            Participants in the various studies were asked questions related to happiness and satisfaction with life. The meta-analysis is based on the findings of over 100 different studies around the world, which questioned 80,000 people worldwide. For this study data has also been analyzed in relation to health, wealth and access to education.

          • Gary Seymour

            What a silly little man; you make excuses even as you walk into the gates of hell. You’re too funny! You’ll see one day little man

          • bizbird6

            Throwing insults will change the issue?

          • Gary Seymour

            no, you’re just as ignorant as before little man

          • Gary Seymour

            they’re only insults to you; to everyone else with the good common sense that God gave them, THEY’RE TRUTH

          • bizbird6

            You sound really BITTER, throwing Insults like that! Ok, I won’t aggravate you more. I’ll say GOOD-BYE!

          • Gary Seymour

            You don’t aggravate me; really, I feel sorry for you. You’re going to come to the end of your life and find out that everything I told you about Jesus Christ, Christianity and from the Bible was true. And forevermore throughout eternity as you are weeping and gnashing your teeth in hell, separated from the God who sent His only Son to die for you, knowing that someone tried to keep you out of the hell you are now in, cared enough to have this debate with you. There’s still time to join us. Just throw up a prayer to God and ask Him to reveal Himself to you if He is real. If He is not what I say then there will be no answer, but if you sincerely ask God, he will reveal Himself to you so that you will believe. And when that day comes, if it comes, you write me and tell me and I will rejoice with you. Love in Christ.

          • bizbird6

            Most generous countries when it comes to giving aid to poor countries (percent of GDP) – 8 out of top 10 are the most Atheistic :

            Sweden – 1.12%

            Norway – 1.06%

            Luxembourg – 1.04%

            Denmark – 0.88%

            Netherlands – 0.82%

            Belgium – 0.55%

            Finland – 0.54%

            Ireland – 0.54%

            United Kingdom – 0.52%

            France- 0.47%

            Spain – 0.46%

            Switzerland – 0.45%

            Germany – 0.35%

            Canada – 0.30%

            Austria – 0.30%

            Australia – 0.29%

            New Zealand – 0.28%

            Portugal – 0.23%

            United States – 0.21%

            Greece – 0.19%

            Japan – 0.18%

            Italy – 0.16%

            South Korea – 0.10%

            In the American debates they argue that USA
            gives to much aid but they give much less than other rich countries. Remember
            that USA is placed 15 when counting the wealth of a country (GDP per capita)

          • Gary Seymour

            Hey everyone, take a look at this pathetic, silly little man; he tries to appear wise in his own mind, but really he is just a little boy trying to prove he is right even though he is dead wrong. And he brings all of this so called external proof into his absolutely wrong stand. Look, 100 sheep have leaped over the edge of the cliff and only the bottom 25 actually died, the rest are okay, so it must be okay to join them.” What a dummy. You just go right ahead and follow them little man. You are without excuse and will never be able to say, “I didn’t know, no one ever told me.” I told you little man, Go debate with one of the other little people in one of those little people countries you spoke of. See ya little man; one day you will bow the knee to the King of kings and the Lord of lords, Jesus Christ.

          • bizbird6

            You can laugh all you want! But your Belief is BOGUS!!

            By the way, I NEVER voted for Obama! I am a Financial Conservative and a DIE HARD Republican! Many of my Conservatives Republican friends are junking Christianity too, not just me. You should too!

            NOT ALL CONSERVATIVE REPUBLICANS are Christian.

            You should also look up Bart Ehrman, Bishop John Spong, Earl Doheny, Victor Stenger, Dan Barker, John Allen Paulos, Jerry Coyne, Sam Harris, Steven Pinker, Michael Newdow, Julia Sweeney.

            They all wrote a lot of books that will impart a lot of good wisdom! They are all listed in Wiki Encyclopedia on the Internet!

          • Gary Seymour

            no one with your mentality is a Conservative, sorry. You’re laughable at best. You’ll see when your day comes; you will never prove to me or to anyone else with more than 1 percent of a brain, that what you say is truth, you see a part truth is a whole lie. You’re wasting your time with me little man. But in reality, you’re hoping some other unsuspecting dummy like you, will join into the conversation and then you can say “see, Joe Blow thinks i”m right.” Well, you and Joe blow go and jump off that cliff together and see who survives the fall. You’ll never be a big man, because a big man knows when he us wrong but a little man doesn’t know when to face the truth; he just keeps trying to convince others, and especially himself, that he is right. Keep believing little man; one day you will find out. I know for certain and one day you will too. Good bye little man

          • bizbird6

            Calling names does NOT change the Issue!! The only way is to abandon Christianity and the Bible. Millions have already done it, and so can you!!

          • Gary Seymour

            Goodbye lost soul; sadly, you;re just going to have to find out the hard way.

          • Judy

            He wasn’t defending God but he was explaining God’s love, His mercy and His complete justice for man. The Bible tells us to represent Jesus/God on earth for now. And to say that God is silent is false. It’s hard to explain but when a person gives his life to God, the Holy Spirit indwells you and you begin to know God for real as you study the Bible. Thing is, I have been where you are (unbeliever), but you have not been where I am, so you really can’t argue with Christianity as you know nothing, personally, about it.

          • bizbird6

            I know Christianity extremely, extremely well!

            I went to a Christian school for almost 12 years and we studied Christ and the Bible almost everyday for years and years and years.

            That is why I knew Christianity was totally false, especially when I learned about Science and the marvelous discoveries of Science!

            And I am not the only one. There are many, many other Ex-Christians that experienced the same things as me.

            Not only did I know Christ and the Bible, also read about other EX-Christians who also learned about what I learned and did very detailed research about the Bible and found that the Bible is totally worthless!

          • Gary Seymour

            Eze 33:7 “So you, son of man, I have made a watchman for the house of Israel. Whenever you hear a word from my mouth, you shall give them warning from me.

            Eze 33:8 If I say to the wicked, O wicked one, you shall surely die, and you do not speak to warn the wicked to turn from his way, that wicked person shall die in his iniquity, but his blood I will require at your hand.

            Eze 33:9 But if you warn the wicked to turn from his way, and he does not turn from his way, that person shall die in his iniquity, but you will have delivered your soul.

          • Judy

            Science didn’t give us those things, the people that created/discovered them did. And God gave them the brains to do it. When you say there is no God/Jesus you are making man the supreme beings on earth. If that’s true, God help us all! And I mean that literally. God created everything so there will be similarities in the things He created. Duh.

          • bizbird6

            Mankind is the present Supreme beings of this Earth, until at least we discover better beings.

            However, if Aliens from other Worlds or other Universes are discovered and found superior, then that is another story.

          • bizbird6

            How come those scientific types tend to reject God, Christ, and the Bible??

            Man IS THE SUPREME CREATURE on this Earth NOW!!!

            Unless Aliens from other worlds are discovered and came to Earth.

    • Judy

      600 errors were found in the original King James. They have been corrected in the New King James. The only reason we had the 1st KJ is because King James couldn’t read or speak Hebrew and Greek. The corrections were found in the Dead Sea scrolls. I believe the NKJ is probably the most accurate of all the translations. But even the errors found were not concerning the basic message of the Bible. And that was how you can live with God for eternity. How you can receive salvation. How the Holy Spirit can come to you and indwell your very heart, life and soul. Most of those, if not all, can be found in John 3.

  • bizbird6

    Rather than kill all those Children from Noah’s Flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, Egyptian First Born, Canaan, etc., there are millions of alternatives that an Omnipotent Being can choose to do.

    Rather than just Kill them ALL (like Genghis Khan, Attila, Stalin, or Hitler), Omnipotent God can adopt those children and put them into good families so that they can be raised as “Good” people instead.

    God can even choose to send good missionaries so as to CONVERT those “wicked” people so that they can ALL be spared and continue to be decent people.

    Again, God is suppose to be OMNIPOTENT, which mean that he can do ANYTHING!!!!

    Also, how about those “Egyptian First Born”? They are NOT wicked at all or guilty of anything? Their only crime is that their Leader (Pharaoh) was stubborn.

    So you deserve to be killed also because the elected President of the USA is no good also? So you deserve to die because of the actions of the US President? Come on now, use your head for once!!

    This is the behavior of an “All Wise”, All Loving”, “All Just” God???? 1

  • bizbird6

    God DOES NOT answer prayers!!!!!

    Why?

    Well, look at the 5,000,000 Jews that died during World War 2. Do you think that they did not pray for deliverance from certain death?

    Of, course they ALL did, everyone of them. You would too if you were in their place.

    Yet, did God save them?

    The answer is “NO”.

    So, see, if God did NOT answer the prayers of 5,000,000 Jews asking to be saved, what makes you think that he will answer your prayers?

    Do you have 5,000,000 proofs that God DOES answer prayers?

    What proofs do you have that God DOES answer prayers?

    • Judy

      You’re dealing with a false premise here. Jesus was totally God and totally man while He walked the earth. Reading and writing was something He knew already. And people taught their children individually and probably in classes as well. Btw, God said, if My people will turn from their evil ways, turn to Him, He would save them. He was talking to the Jews at the time, but we are ALL wicked. We must accept Jesus as our Savior to be saved. Ad when you do that, the Bible will be so much clearer. I hope you do this soon.

      • bizbird6

        Did you get the article that I posted earlier about Christianity declining all over the world? The number of Non-believers in Sweden is over 65%. Sweden is especially important because it is the trend setter for the US. In addition, England and France is declining also. Read below:

        Christianity DECLINING all over the World.

        Both England and France may have very few Christians left soon. Just think, just a century ago, 95% of the population were Christians and now it may be headed below 50% or even less. It may even disappear by the end of the century or sooner. This is true almost all over Europe. America may follow also. Anyway, read below:

        Christianity: A Dying Religion in England and France

        TUESDAY, 03 SEPTEMBER 13 11:13 AM PDT

        The Catholic Bishop of Shrewsbury recently warned that
        Christians may soon become strangers in their own land. Rt Rev Mark Davies shared this message with more than 1000 Catholics during a five-day prayer fest that was organized in Norfolk.

        After recent data from the government revealed that Christians might emerge as a minority in Britain, Davies urged those in the audience to take a clear stand for their faith.

        According to the data shared by the bishop, most Britons would not refer to themselves as Christians by 2020 and close to 4000 churches are likely to shut down by the same year if the congregation continues to diminish at the existing rate. Davies is known to be one of the most outspoken critics of the British Government’s plans to legalize gay marriage.

        The Catholic Church in France too seems to be on its last legs.
        According to recent reports, more than a third of France’s general population and about two-thirds of France’s youth identify themselves with no religion. The same report suggests that only one in twenty people attend Mass regularly in the country.

        Father Innocent Feugna is an African minister and known for his work in northern France. He stated that his congregation is aging and gradually dying out too. Feugna pointed out that not only are church-goers growing old, but church officials are aging too.

        Since the average priest in France is 75 years old, foreigners are often imported when religious services need to be conducted. According to the deacon, the youth of France has different aspirations and their interests lie elsewhere.

        Douglas Yates, professor at the American Graduate School in Paris and assistant professor of political science at the American University of Paris has the same take on the changing scenario. According to him, Africans are
        replacing the native priests in France as they grow older. This trend is common in rural areas.

        As France has become more secular over the years, the Church has become eye-to-eye with atheists and agnostics. Yates substantiates the growing fear by saying, if the existing trend is to continue, the Catholic
        Church will indeed become a minority religion.

        • Judy

          Another false premise. You keep writing that ‘Christians’ were disappearing while constantly bringing up Catholics. Born again Christians that have studied the Bible, believe the RCC is the harlot described in Revelation. Our church had missionaries in France and so we know Christians are scarce there. Some even believe the pope is the anti-Christ. I don’t. But as far Christianity declining, yep we know that as well, since it is talked about in Matthew 7:13, where it says; “Enter by the narrow gate; forthe gate is WIDE, and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and many are those who enter by it.”

          • Judy

            Plus, verse 14 says, “For the gate is SMALL,, the was narrow that leads to life, and FEW are those who find it.”
            What’s also great about Jesus/God is that you can repent and asked Jesus into your heart, life and soul up until you take your last breath. God is love, but He is also perfectly just. You are never going to understand the Bible until you become a born again Christian as described in John 3.

          • bizbird6

            The Bible is junk and needed to be trash ASAP and in the nearest trash can!!!

          • bizbird6

            “Born Again Christians” are “Dead Again Loonies”. They are “Religious Fanatics” that is not worth anything.

            God is a MONSTER who is guilty of so much EVIL!!!

          • bizbird6

            If God is so perfectly just and if he is love then why did he murders so many INNOCENTS”

            Please stop ignoring my question? Please answer me?

            God NOT only murdered the “WICKED”, but he also murdered INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS of the NOAH FLOOD, the INNOCENT Children and INFANTS of the Sodom and Gomorrah, and the INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANT of the Canaanites. Also God murdered the INNOCENT EGYPTIAN FIRST BORN.

            Even if those that God murdered are wicked (which I TOTALLY DOUBTED), the the INNOCENT CHILDREN OF THOSE “WICKED” DOES NOT DESERVE TO DIE.

            IMMAGINE, a SIX year old child being KILLED BY God, OR a YEAR OLD CHILD BEING KILLED by GOD, or a 2 MONTHS OLD INFANT being killed by God.

            What justification do you have of ALL GOOD and ALL Just God murdering INNOCENT?

            I refuse to go another step until you ANSWER MY QUESTIONS!!! You keep evading my questions and keep on trying to change the subject!!!

          • bizbird6

            Catholics ARE Christians!!! If you look at “Christians” in the the Dictionary, Catholics fit the definition COMPLETELY!

            You are claiming that you know the definitions better than the Dictionary? Baloney!!

            And Christians are leaving the Christian Religion in a Flood. Sweden and England are NOT Catholic. They are Evangelical Christians (like you!) and NOT Catholics.

            The Bible is JUNK!!! If you read Bart Ehrman, , Earl Doherty, Bishop Spong, you will throw that Bible in the closest trash bin. They all say that the Bible is full of Misquotes, Forgeries, and LIES.

            Get out of your narrow mindedness. Look at other alternative viewpoints. The world is abandoning Christianity. Join us all now!

    • Larry Stauth

      lol, really.. is that the BEST you got?

      Tell me, who ever said they were not delivered?

      Do you understand the term “free will”? God is not a taxi service, a gift machine or anything else, at YOUR will..

      Let’s start with the basics… Who did Jesus take the message of salvation? Who was given God’s perfect Law and plenty of road maps that pointed to Jesus? The Hebrews.

      Who hung Jesus on the cross? The Hebrews.

      What people have taken the Law to change it to fit THEIR own wills? The Hebrews.

      Then factor this into your equation. For someone who is destined for salvation… Which would be deliverance, being in heaven or left to suffer in this life?

      Given the fact that EVERYONE dies.. what difference does it make that they died on a Tuesday, versus a Friday? The fact of WHERE they were the day after is actually the point..

      If they were of the decedents of Abraham, they would have been without pain or defect, in total peace and without want NOR desire!!

      I call that deliverance!!!

      But maybe God should have interfered in the choices of the Nazi’s?

      You also forget, God can influence the ability of others, if they make certain choices… like the fact that the Allied Forced, by a sheer miracle, got their hands on the Nazi radio code.

      D-Day was also an error, they landed miles away from the target area. Had they actually landed at the target area, things would have been far more disastrous.

      Take, by example, God’s “deliverance” of the Hebrew from Egypt… God did not swoop down and take them out… that would interfere with the free will to choose to leave. Instead, God sent Moses and Aaron… Moses didn’t want to go. Moses also had a speech impediment and having grown up in the house of Pharaoh, knew to fear his adopted cousin… But He went. Speaking FOR God… God demonstrated who He was.. and it took the death of the first born sons, just as Pharaoh had ordered, God fulfilling the will of Pharaoh, with the exception.. death by-passed those that bore the mark of “lambs blood” on the door frame.

      Note: Jesus was called the Lamb of God, and the First born son, and His blood was shed to save… Oddly enough.. the Moses time began Passover and Jesus hung on the cross, the first born son, on Passover.

      Mathematically speaking, the chances of both events happening on the exact same day has been computed into the 1 in 100 Billion.

      The fact that the Romans AND Hebrews, both recorded the death, also validates it did, in fact, happen.

      God’s purpose is NOT to save people from themselves, but guide people in saving themselves.

      The Ten Commandments and the Law were guides.. God’s way of telling people that “If you do this… you will have a better chance in life”.

      As for 5,000 proofs that God does answer prayers… as a matter of fact, I do.. in fact, you too can Google it and find many people attesting to it.

      I would bother posting, but I am quite certain you would still scoff at them, and find fault..

      Or just find something else… heck, you still can’t explain the detailed list of Scientific facts.. when you can explain that.. we will worry about the 5,000.

  • bizbird6

    Why are you Christians always defending God?

    Isn’t God suppose to be omnipotent? He is strong enough to speak and defend himself isn’t he? Why does he need to you weak mortal beings to always speak for him? Why is he so silent?

    Doesn’t the fact that he is so silent shows that maybe he does NOT exist and maybe NEVER existed at all?

    Doesn’t this SILENCE speak LOUDER than all your screaming and shouting?8

    • Larry Stauth

      lol, nobody “defends” God.. as for Silence, how many times does He have to speak, before He is heard?

      You still do not get it… God spoke and it was written down. But obviously you have run out of excuses, so now your on to trying to discount it with more nonsense and desires to create a defensive posture.

      Too bad, once again, you prove you know NOTHING on the subject!

      God is noisy as thunder, His presence is obvious… BUT, why would He bother with people like you. After all, He sent His Son, who bore NO SIN, and died in YOUR place. Yes, He died FOR you. He spoke and you rejected him for your own folly. You have said “I don’t need you” “I don’t want you”…

      God is about Free Will, not interfering in your ability to choose… If you want Him, honestly want Him.. He will be there, but while you reject him… He will hide himself from you…

      And that is the words He spoke!

      Besides… you do realize you are the one fighting for excuses. Every single one has been answered, and you STILL keep coming back.

      You did realize this was NOT a forum full of Atheists? If you walk into a church and said the garbage you expressed here, you should not expect anything less.

      People will defend their FAITH… God created this world, and is more than capable of handling himself. You just have no clue when He is right in front of you.

      • bizbird6

        If mankind has Free Will, how come innocents are killed by God?

        I am talking about the INNOCENT Children and Infants of Noah’s Ark, the INNOCENT Children and Infants of Sodom and Gomorrah, the INNOCENT Children and Infants of the Canaanites? They have done nothing wrong, Evil, or wicked to deserve what God did to them.

        How about the Innocent Egyptian First Born (Moses) who were killed just because the Pharaoh was stubborn? Is it fair that you and your family are killed by God because of the misdeeds of President Obama?

        Egypt did NOT even even have a Democratic government, yet God blamed the Innocent First Born in Egypt for the Evils of the Pharaoh? Obama was elected by the Electorate in America, so the American people does bear some responsibility for the misdeeds of Obama.

        But Egypt in the time of Moses? The people of Egypt had absolutely no say in the ascendancy of the Pharaoh, yet God punished the First Born of Egypt???

        What Justice? What free Will?? God punished BOTH the Guilty AND the INNOCENT!!!

        • Larry Stauth

          Name one “killed by God”.

          In regards to Noah… it took how long for Noah and his 2 sons to build the Ark? Do you think he did it in stealth?

          As 2 of every kind of animal was gathered, did the people NOT notice?

          It also says the people mocked Noah for his work… so they knew and chose to make fun of him.

          Much like you… you sit and mock Him and those He has sent out… and when it’s too late, you are suddenly going to be innocent? It’s going to be God’s fault you chose to be wicked in your ways?

          But what can we determine about God… what is the first thing God did AFTERWARDS? Well, says first, He wept… Then He made a promise to NEVER allow that to happen.

          But how many of those people did God actually kill? He provided a boat, they didn’t want in, THEY chose to drown.

          Pharaoh ordered the deaths, Death killed the First Born, NOT God… God was the shield that protected the innocent, who chose to have the blood placed on the door.

          First, Moses came into the House of Pharaoh because he ordered all the first born killed, Moses’ mother, wishing to spare him, set him a drift in the river.

          How many times did Moses warn ALL the people in Egypt? How many warning did God give? How many plagues? Any one of those “Innocent” could have taken heed of the warning, but again, like you, they mocked the warning… and when the truth came out… it was too late.
          God didn’t punish ANYONE! They chose to ignore the warnings… If a person is told “don’t drink poison or you will die”, you cannot hold someone else accountable because they chose to drink it anyways…

          Sorry.. Try again.. BTW.. Death is a RESULT of Adam’s Sin. It is NOT of God… You can thank a arrogant, Jealous and vain Angel for Death…

          • bizbird6

            You are rewriting the Bible!!! What you said was NOT in the Bible!

            God is OMNIPOTENT! Which means that God can do anything!!! I can think of ten Million ways that God can deliver and WARN those inhabitants of the POWER of God!

            God can Warn the people of Noah Ark of the Power of God by all sorts of ways, like turning the sky to Pink or sending lighting to wreak fear into the inhabitants. God can have the Angels capture the Pharaoh and force the Pharaoh to submit.

            Again, I remind you that God is Omnipotent, which means that he can do ANYTHING. Murdering thousands and Millions of INNOCENTS should be the last resort!
            .
            God told Moses to put a marking on top of the doors so that the Angel of Death can tell which family is Jewish and which is Egyptian. So obviously God made a distinction between the Jews and the Egyptian!!!

            You said that Moses tried WARN the people what was coming???

            So Egypt was a Democracy so that the people had a voice to what the Pharaoh would choose to do???

            So there was a BIG Election or Vote so that the Egyptian people actually had a voice in the decisions of the Pharaoh???

            So God was right to punish the Egyptian people for the sins of the Pharaoh??? What happened to FREE WILL???

            You must be totally out of your head or dreaming!!!!

          • Larry Stauth

            How about you actually research the bible…

            And then tell me where it says that God killed anyone, or “Sent out the Angel of Death”.

            In fact, Moses told Pharaoh of what would be the final plague… Just because God says it will happen, does not mean He did it, just means He allowed it. And yes, He allows bad stuff to happen, because stupid people, like you, continue to think you know better, and he is going to let you make those choices to fail.

            God is Omnipotent, but He is not contradictory. You can not be light and shadow, you cannot be love and hatred…

            So… turning a Nile to blood was not enough to turn Pharaoh?

            I again remind you, that God KNOWS the heart of man, just like he knew that Pharaoh’s Heart would be hardened. Or the people of Noah’s time would not listen.

            He knew that Judas would betray Jesus, this is how He was able to foretell of those events. But not just tell, but demonstrate, like Moses with the water from the rock, the first time it was to be struck, after that Moses only needed to speak to the rock. Of course, Moses got it wrong and struck the rock the second time.

            The fact is.. God CAN do anything.. He doesn’t because of the covenant of Free Will…

            Obviously, you are stuck on stupid, because you keep going round and round on the same stuff…

            Considering you know better than God, on what is right or wrong… that is called arrogance.

            You don’t even have the facts straight… Moses was to put a mark on the door for any that believed.. there were no “Jewish” at that time… these were just decedents of Joseph, who were decedents of Israel, who was a decedent of Abraham.

            Jews, or more commonly Jewish, are decedents of Judah, one of the tribes let out of slavery by Moses.

            God has the right to punish ALL who sin. He punished the Hebrews for their insolence…

            What is worst… HE PUNISHED HIS OWN SON FOR ALL THE WORLD!!

            What did Jesus do to be whipped with a cat of nine tails? What did Jesus do to be beat up and badgered by Romans? What did Jesus do to have the Jewish leaders and whole community demand His death on the cross?

            The Egyptians worshiped idols, they forced the Israelites into slavery, and then, WHEN GOD WARNED THEN OVER AND OVER… they ignored Him.

            All of us deserve death, even Scripture tells us that Paul understood that…

            “We ALL fall short of the Glory of God”.. but BY Grace we are saved…

            Life is a gift…

            But since you are stuck on stupid, and obviously arrogant and vain… I am going to let you figure that out in your own time…

            Since you have stolen too much of mine… I will pray for you, in hopes you mature enough to really seek out the truth, and not opinions that justify your selfish desires.

          • bizbird6

            You can talk all you want, but the fact is that the Worlds is rejecting your Religion (NOT just me!).

            Christianity DECLINING all over the World.

            Both England and France may have very few Christians left soon. Just think, just a century ago, 95% of the population were Christians and now it may be headed be;low 50% or even less.
            It may even disappear by the end of the century or sooner. This is true almost all over Europe. America may follow also. Anyway, read below:

            Christianity: A Dying Religion in England and France

            TUESDAY, 03 SEPTEMBER 13 11:13 AM PDT

            The Catholic Bishop of Shrewsbury recently warned that
            Christians may soon become strangers in their own land. Rt Rev Mark Davies shared this message with more than 1000 Catholics during a five-day prayer fest that was organized in Norfolk.

            After recent data from the government revealed that Christians might emerge as a minority in Britain, Davies urged those in the audience to take a clear stand for their faith.

            According to the data shared by the bishop, most Britons would not refer to themselves as Christians by 2020 and close to 4000 churches are likely to shut down by the same year if the congregation continues to diminish at the existing rate. Davies is known to be one of the most outspoken critics of the British Government’s plans to legalize gay marriage.

            The Catholic Church in France too seems to be on its last legs.
            According to recent reports, more than a third of France’s general population and about two-thirds of France’s youth identify themselves with no religion. The same report suggests that only one in twenty people attend Mass regularly in the country.

            Father Innocent Feugna is an African minister and known for his work in northern France. He stated that his congregation is aging and gradually dying out too. Feugna pointed out that not only are church-goers growing old, but church officials are aging too.

            Since the average priest in France is 75 years old, foreigners are often imported when religious services need to be conducted. According to the deacon, the youth of France has different aspirations and their interests lie elsewhere.

            Douglas Yates, professor at the American Graduate School in Paris and assistant professor of political science at the American University of Paris has the same take on the changing scenario. According to him, Africans are
            replacing the native priests in France as they grow older. This trend is common in rural areas.

            As France has become more secular over the years, the Church has become eye-to-eye with atheists and agnostics. Yates substantiates the growing fear by saying, if the existing trend is to continue, the Catholic
            Church will indeed become a minority religion.

          • bizbird6

            Assassinate the Pharaoh???? You must be dreaming. Why don’t you assassinate Obama???? Quite a few Presidents have been assassinated in the USA too?

            God DID PUNISH the Egyptians! He sent the Angel of God to kill the Egyptian First Born, REMEMBER???

            Maybe God should punish you and your family for refusing to assassinating Obama too, like you are trying to justify God punishing the Egyptian First Born!!!

            You must be Brain dead to forget all those things!!

          • bizbird6

            Instead of killing INNOCENT First Born, why doesn’t God just just kill the Pharaoh instead!

            Or kidnap the Pharaoh and force the Pharaoh to do the will of God. Isn’t that easier than killing thousands of INNOCENTS First Born?

          • sandraleesmith46

            That’s NOT rewriting anything! You allege you spent all those years in a Christian school “learning” the Bible, and yet you remain IGNORANT of God’s Word and ways! God is NOT WILLING that any should die, meaning that is NOT what He wants; BUT He gave us free will to CHOOSE to accept His salvation, and the way to do so. In Noah’s day it was an Ark, a large ship, in fact. In Moses’ day, it was by raising, sacrificing a lamb, and splashing its blood on the door posts and lintels of the houses. Now it’s by faith in the completed work of Calvary, There’s always a way for those who choose to accept it. He won’t even override your free will choice to save your life, much as it saddens Him every time one such as you chooses death and the aftermath thereof. There has NEVER been a judgment without a warning, even the one under which this nation now sits; but there are MANY who refuse to heed the warning, and that’s a fatal mistake, always.

            Do you really think the Egyptian people were any more “innocent” of Pharaoh’s acts than we are of O’s? NOT! THEY wanted those slaves too, so they didn’t have to do the hard labor.

            Just curious; what is it you think God did, or didn’t, do for/to you that you’re SO full of rage toward Him and those of us who do believe Him? That amount of rage comes from WITHIN you over some “slight” or “hurt” however imaginary it actually may be, not because you “discovered the wonders of science”. That’s FAR too personal.

          • bizbird6

            So you think that it is fair for God to punish YOU for the “Policies” of President Obama? It is the same as those poor Egyptian victims of God. And it is even worse. President Obama was elected in a Democratic forum, so the electorate does hold some responsibility for his policies, at least.

            However, Egypt was NEVER Democratic in those days, so the population has really no say at all on the Policies of the Pharaoh. And like any Society on Earth, there was always an divergent of opinions of allowing the Jews to leave Rgypt, yet God punished everyone, regardless of their opinion. This is the behavior of a “All Just and All Loving God”???

            If God punished you and your family because of the policies of Obama, you will continue to defend God?? If you do, you are a total fool!!!

            I am doing what I enjoy most, I enjoy discussing and talking about my favorite subject, Religion. And I found that I am not the only persons feeling as I do about the Christian Religion. There are many, many Ex-Christians in the same position as me. In fact, here are a list of such CONTEMPORARY non-believers. We were ALL Christians once, and now we are taking the opposite position:

            Bart Ehrman, Bishop John Spong, Earl Doherty, Victor Stenger, Dan Barker, John Allen Paulos, Jerry Coyne, Sam Harris, Steven Pinker, Michael Newdow, Julia Sweeney.

            All of them are listed in Wiki Encyclopedia and all of them have written many books about their experiences so that others may gain. Their books were all written at least within the last 10 years or so. You can look up any of them in Wiki.

            I omitted those that are dead or have been inactive.

            I hope that you will learn from our experiences and totally abandon your Christian Belief and dump that phony Bible of yours. I hope then that you will join us!

          • sandraleesmith46

            First, there is NO mention of “fair” anywhere in the Word; so “fair” especially in the “modern” lib concept thereof, is irrelevant, to a discussion of what God is doing or not doing.
            Second, God isn’t “punishing” anyone! Not with Obamacare, or even O himself. The NATION brought O and his pals in Congress on itself as a whole, which is not to say all the individuals are “guilty” thereof, but as I’ve said before, the free will choices of some DO hurt others, and God allows the free will choices. It’s what we who are caught in it do about and with it that matters.
            Now as to the “democratic” forum of the election: there hasn’t been an honest truly “democratic” election in this nation in a long while. The fraud and rampant cheating are well documented, and SO is the law the Dems rammed into place back in the ’90s, when they had control of both houses, that PREVENTS challenging any election results where it “might affect a minority’s vote”, in other words they can cheat and get away with it and there’s nothing that we can legally DO about it. And when a precinct has MORE votes than the number of registered voters possible in it, that is fraud. But since the Dems also control the voting machines, those who program and maintain them, and those who count them since all are owned by Soros companies and OFF shore, again no way to interfere or fix what is clearly broken. BUT that doesn’t mean God isn’t taking notice, or that He’s not going to act. His patience is running out…
            Regarding Egypt, how many of those pharaohs were “removed” by assassins? Quite a few; mostly for political reasons of human greed, but not all. the people did have that option as do we, and it’s coming to a time when it may get exercised here as well.
            Once again: GOD is not the one doing the “punishing”; that’s the consequences of SIN, by one or more individuals, as it is here, and was in Israel, Egypt, and everywhere else. And those consequences spill over onto others. But it’s HUMAN, not Divine.
            Obamacare and his other policies ARE punishing me, and my family, but that’s OBAMA not God, and that’s precisely where I lay the blame: where it BELONGS. If God forces His will, then none are or can be free. That’s enslavement.

          • bizbird6

            You do NOT READ the Bible or the FACTS.

            You dream up your own LIES!!

            I know what the Bible says and it is NOT what you say!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            Ask any of the other Christians posting on this thread if that’s a lie or God’s truth You choose. NOT pew warmers but genuine believers however, must be consulted.

          • RageFury

            Choice. It all comes down to Choice. Accept God or not, it is always your Choice. That is what burns me up when Christians try to legislate “God’s word”. When they do that they attempt to remove Choice by Government Force, eg the point of a Gun. For one of the more recent Federal issues Christians butted into, see DOMA.

            My wife is Christian and she doesn’t shove her views down my throat, so I feel other Christians should be more like her. Right or wrong, I don’t much care.
            Nothing personal, just venting with a couple beers :)
            Of course if bizbird6 actually payed any attention he/she would have seen that Choice was key. It is your Choice to believe or not and it always will be.

          • sandraleesmith46

            You can’t legislate beliefs or morality, but you CAN legislate behavior, as an outward act. And when humans are behaving in an unhealthy manner, others seek to modify that; in some cases they’re right to, in most they’re not. Legislating against murder, theft and the like is reasonable in order for a society to function, but legislating about foods or beverages or other bad habits not so much except where they infringe on the safety and well-being of other. Again, if the humans won’t police themselves, then an extrinsic force is needed for that purpose in order for a society to function. That’s been recognized since the ancient times. Some laws are inane, and others not necessary, but some are essential, to avoid anarchical chaos being the rule.
            On the issue of DOMA, you have it backwards. Marriage between a man and a woman is instituted by GOD, a religious rite, in which the Feds are now interfering; one that governments have recognized, again, as useful to the building and maintaining of a healthy society, but now the Feds are trying to make rules that have NO place in that. That rule of marriage is nearly as old as humanity itself, and any time a government has interfered in it, chaos and the breakdown of that society has been the result.
            You want to drink yourself blotto, be my guest, so LONG as you DON’T take it “on the road”; I did EMS for too many years to be tolerant of that, on the grounds that too many innocent people get hurt and killed when people do so. Has nothing to do with religion, just respect for human life. And venting is okay too; I don’t take that personal.

          • RageFury

            I don’t disagree with the first bit. That is not my issue. Believe it or not I to think murder, theft and the like is wrong and I to think we should have laws against it. I don’t need Religion to tell me this as victims exist for these crimes.

            Feds got it wrong when they first butted into marriage long before DOMA. I understand why they did it, but every issue can be handled via an alternate method. If the Feds had kept out of Marriage, this really wouldn’t be an issue since the Churches could sort it out and follow their beliefs specific to their Religions, in their respective States as they saw fit. However the Feds are involved and Marriage License recognition is now an issue. Don’t get me wrong here, I fully support Marriage being a 10th Amendment issue. Then people have at the very least, the ability to go to a State that aligns with their needs on the issue. Best thing you can do is get the Fed Gov out of Marriage period.
            If specific Churches want to disallow their Priests from Conducting certain Marriages because it violates their Religion, then fine by me, that should be their Choice. If specific Churches want to leave the matter in the hands of the individual Priests, that is fine by me as well. Using Government Force to mandate the issue either way, well It goes against Liberty and forces specific Religious beliefs on others who may not share said Religious beliefs.

            That said, Marriage predates Christianity. One such place was ancient Mesopotamia. Yes Same Sex Unions blessed by prayer (eg Marriage) did exist before Christianity. Of course Same Sex Marriage also existed along side of Christianity until 342AD. At which point, Government of the time interfered and executed people over it.
            You see, Christians do not have a monopoly on Religion or Marriage. Thus using a specific Religion’s beliefs as a basis to take Choice away from a couple to Marry via a willing Priest or the like, is inherently wrong. There are in fact Priests and Churches, here in the States even now, willing to conduct these Marriages. As such it should be their place and their Choice to conduct them as they see fit. It is not up to the majority, be they Christian or otherwise, to prevent it. What you were doing via DOMA and every other Marriage related law, is making rules via Government Force and interfering.

          • sandraleesmith46

            I agree; the entire issue of marriage should never have been taken out of the hands of the religions. I understand why civil governments recognize and support marriage as the basic structure of a civilized society, which is fine; and the purpose of marriage is protection of the future through the protection of and provision for the progeny, which again is in the interests of the civil government as well. But neither the religions nor the civil government has the right, or sound reason to dictate to the other the “rules” of marriage, and when they started doing so, both were out of bounds.

            Marriage goes as far back, almost as humanity itself. I don’t know of any society, no matter how primitive or far back in history, that didn’t recognize marriage and family units.
            What happened in 342 relates to Constantine declaring Christianity the state religion of the Empire,and taking the laws of God literally. Executing was what God ordained with respect to certain behaviors, which connects to the teaching found in the NT about the “leaven of the Pharisees” and to what Solomon wrote about in Ecclesiastes as well. Sin, which most psychologists would label as unhealthy behaviors and thinking patterns, except that many of them have now been so contaminated by it as well, is infectious, and destructive. You obviously get that things that hurt others such as murder or rape or theft are wrong and harmful to others, which is what makes them wrong. But self-destructive behaviors are also “catching” and harmful, often beyond the individual engaging in them.

            Alcoholism is a self-destructive behavior. {stay with me for a bit; I KNOW what the social teaching is!}. Any one can pick up a drink; some don’t know when to stop, or have the will power to make themselves stop. And yes, it is will-power, as with any addiction. Once a person knows he has a problem in controlling a behavior, and they DO know, usually long before it’s admitted even to the self consciously, then he has the choice to NOT pick up that first drink that will lead to the out-of-control unhealthy behavior. Bad as that is, the behavior hurts family, friends, co-workers/employers/employees, and often strangers if he chooses to, in an intoxicated state, drive, or otherwise operate hazardous machinery,etc. That is the nature of sin. God was being like a good surgeon and excising that which would do harm to the body as a whole, by removing the infected parts so that the rest of the body didn’t succumb to that infection, hence the “harsh” rules about execution of certain sinners.
            Balancing that against the loving and merciful, is often a stumbling point for unbelievers. But when you view it as an infection, and a body it does make a bit more sense. God, on the other hand, isn’t willing {doesn’t want} anyone to die like that; and we are all sinners, so the difference is in behaviors and thinking. God knows we’ll all stumble and sin; the question is whether we choose to make a habit of that, or do we strive to avoid doing so, and repent of the sins we do inadvertently commit.And do we trust His work on the cross for us, or do we seek to “earn” salvation by our own merits {which is hot humanly possible, because we ARE sinners by our very nature}.
            Thing is that some of the things going on in “churches” today, are WAY out of line with God’s Word. And the marriage issue is but one of them. On the one side there’s a government and a group of people alike demanding something to which they have no right, and on the other, there are the “churches” NOT acting in the manner in which God expects of them, and going along with these intrusions which, in turn, is hurting those of us seeking to rightly follow God’s Word. It’ s a mess, is what it is, and I suspect there’s only going to be one outcome of it; which many WON’T like when it happens.

          • bizbird6

            Absolutely BALONEY!!!

            Mating occurred in our world ever since LIFE began. And “God” has NOTHING to do with it!!!

            You are so NARROW MINDED that I feel like vomiting!

          • bizbird6

            Then why does God SHOVE his viewpoint down the throats of those who disagree with him??

            Is God giving Humanity a good Example???

            So, God’s behavior teaches Mankind to murder those that disagree with him or her too?

          • RageFury

            I am thinking you have never seen God shove anything down anyone’s throat.
            Likewise I am thinking you never saw God teach anyone to murder another, for any reason.
            But hey, if you actually see God do any of that, feel free to video tape it and share it with the rest of us…

            Either way, don’t ask me, ask this God you speak of. A mere mortal like myself, has know way of knowing what motivates a God to do anything…

          • bizbird6

            God DOES SHOVE down your throat!!!

            He is saying, “Do as I say or I am sending you to Hell!

            If that is NOT shoving something down someones throat, I don’t know what is!!!

          • RageFury

            Show me this God saying what you believe this God said. If you cannot, then please do shut up with your nonsense.

          • Judy

            God is capable of making everyone do exactly what He wants us to do. BUT, God does not want puppets. He does want us to choose Him or hell. He knows which way each of us will go of course, but He will never make us. Imagine a huge arch and on it it says Come unto me all who believe. When you choose to go under that arch and look back it has God saying, I knew you would come.

          • bizbird6

            You are absolutely talking “Baloney”! Suppose a mugger comes to you in the street and say, “give me all your money or I’ll shoot you”. Then he says, “However, I want you to choose and NOT be a puppet”. He, of course, points that GUN right at your face!

            Is this any different from God, who says, do what I want or I’ll send you to Hell! It is the same!!!

            To me, God is a mugger that is a HYPOCRITE!! He acts like he want to give us a choice, but is he?? Does a Mugger that points a gun at your face gives you a choice?

            At least that mugger isn’t a hypocrite. He is just a criminal and don’t try to pretend that he is better than he is, unlike God!.

          • Judy

            God gives us life. God gives us food. God gives us beautiful weather. God gives us mountains to climb, streams to wade in and cool off. He gives us brains so we can build homes out of the trees He gives us. He created this entire world full of possibilities. He does ingrain in us the ability to know right from wrong. He gives us the ability to love others and do good things. He gives doctors the desire to help heal people. He gives people the brains to develop things to help us live more comfortably. He created everything through His Son Jesus. He had His only Son die for all of the evil in this world and the only thing He asks of us is to accept and love His Son Jesus Who DIED for each of us.
            Really, bizbird, is that really too much to asks? I don’t think so. But, you keep going your way if that is what YOU choose to do with YOUR free will.

          • bizbird6

            God gave us NOTHING!!!

            The world and ourselves gave us everything. God does NOT exist!!! Frankly, I don’t even think Christ existed

            (Read Earl Doherty’s book ‘The Jesus Puzzle which claimed Jesus NEVER existed. Also read Bart Ehrman who is a Bible expert and wrote over 20 books on the Bible. Ehrman and shows in his books that the Bible is full of Misquotes, Forgeries, and Lies! You can look up both of them in the Wiki Internet Encyclopedia)
            .
            God NEVER gave us FREE WILL!

            The Christian belief is that Adam and Eve disobeyed God therefore committed Original Sin, which required Christ dying on the cross to free us from this Sin.

            However, Mankind NEVER elected Adam and Eve to represent them. So if Mankind had Free Will then there would be no Original Sin at all, and Christ NEVER needed to die at all.

            Frankly, I think the Bible is a Fraud and is TOTALLY Wrong. Adam and Eve NEVER existed, so Christ NEVER needed to die at all. In fact, I don’t think that Christ ever existed either!.

          • Judy

            Well, it took me awhile to get what you were doing on here. My bad. I thought you were an intelligent person that really wanted people to understand why you are an atheist and maybe read and learn from what others have said on here…to you. But I realize you don’t have the reading comprehension that is needed to discuss Christianity intelligently. I am not making fun of you, it really does pain me to see that you can’t understand any of what you are being told. You just keep repeating the same old mantra. I know God is real. I know Jesus is God and that He came down to our level because He loved us.
            Btw, there are books written by people saying that Jesus really existed. I have read many books before coming to the truth that Jesus is the true Messiah that doubted all of the Bible. But once accepting Jesus I have read the Bible and understand that God is very real and that is our book of instructions on how to live.
            UNLESS A PERSON IS A BORN AGAIN CHRISTIAN, HE CAN NEVER BE A ‘BIBLE EXPERT’! Helloooo, what part of that do you not get?
            If you won’t even read and understand what I see, you are wasting my time.
            Have a nice day.

          • bizbird6

            So, only a person who thinks like you can be called as an expert!!

            What an EGOMANIAC you are. You sound as BAD AND EVIL as God!

            People HAVE to agree with you or they are NO GOOD!

          • bizbird6

            I know the Bible as well as you can!!!

            In fact, a lot of people know the Bible as well as you can!

            BUT, unlike you they don’t believe in it!!!

            Read about these persons on Wiki!! They are all listed there:

            You should also look up Bishop John Spong, Earl Doheny, Victor Stenger, Dan Barker, John Allen Paulos, Jerry Coyne, Sam Harris, Steven Pinker, Michael Newdow, Julia Sweeney, etc., etc., etc. I can go on and on, but I don’t have the time now. Anyway, they all wrote many books to help mankind to do better.

            You DEFINITELY need to read their many books.

          • bizbird6

            I call these “Born Again Christians” as “Dead Again LOONIES”!

          • bizbird6

            How we talk intelligently when you constanly ignore my questions?

            I asked you this more than once!

            Please answer and stop changing the subject!!

            God NOT only murdered the “WICKED”, but he also murdered INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS of the NOAH FLOOD, the INNOCENT Children and INFANTS of the Sodom and Gomorrah, and the INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANT of the Canaanites. Also God murdered the INNOCENT EGYPTIAN FIRST BORN.

            Even if those that God murdered are wicked (which I TOTALLY DOUBTED), the the INNOCENT CHILDREN OF THOSE “WICKED” DOES NOT DESERVE TO DIE.

            IMMAGINE, a SIX year old child being KILLED BY God, OR a YEAR OLD CHILD BEING KILLED by GOD, or a 2 MONTHS OLD INFANT being killed by God.

            What justification do you have of ALL GOOD and ALL Just God murdering INNOCENTS?

            I refuse to go another step until you ANSWER MY QUESTIONS!!! You keep evading my questions and keep on trying to change the subject!!!

            4

          • sandraleesmith46

            God doesn’t do that, and you know very well He doesn’t because if He did, you wouldn’t be FREE to protest His will, as you very obviously are and do! You’d be an automaton slave to His will! NO human is that ever! It’s SATAN that does that and seeks to spread his power and control over all. And God doesn’t teach people to murder anyone; again that’s Satan, not God. God’s law prohibits murder!

          • bizbird6

            Then who killed

            1. the INNOCENT CHILDREN AND INFANTS of Sodom?
            2. the INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS of Noah’s Ark? 3. the INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS of Canaan
            4. the INNOCENT CHILDREN AND INFANTS of Egypt’s
            FIRST BORN?

            What don’t you answer my questions? Why do you keep evading my questions? What are you afraid of?

            Are you afraid of the TRUTH, that your God is an EVIL MONSTER?

          • bizbird6

            If you read your OWN BIble, you will read that it is God that murdered all those INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS, NOT SATAN!!!

            Satan is NOT EVEN MENTIONED in ALL those MURDERS!! Why don’t you read your own Bible. Why do you LIE about what is in the Bible!

          • bizbird6

            God’s law may forbid murder, but that did not stop God from murdering thousands and maybe even Millions of Children and INFANTS himself.

            Again, according to the Bible, God killed thousands and maybe Millions in in Sodom, in Noah Ark, in Canaan, or the First Born in Egypt in Egypt.

            God is a liar and hypocrite. He is saying don’t murder, but he does it himself freely. And NOT Only he murdering people, but he is murdering INNOCENT Children and Infants and by the thousands and maybe Millions!

          • bizbird6

            No wonder people are abandoning Christianity in DROVES!

            Christians LIE, LIE, and LIE……………even in regards to their own Bible!

          • bizbird6

            You are absolutely talking “Baloney”! Suppose a mugger comes to you in the street and say, “give me all your money or I’ll shoot you”. Then he says, “However, I want you to choose and NOT be a puppet”. He, of course, points that GUN right at your face!

            Is this any different from God, who says, do what I want or I’ll send you to Hell! It is the same!!!

            To me, God is a mugger that is a HYPOCRITE!! He acts like he want to give us a choice, but is he?? Does a Mugger that points a gun at your face gives you a choice?

            At least that mugger isn’t a hypocrite. He is just a plain criminal and don’t try to pretend that he is better than he is, unlike God!.1

          • RageFury

            A mugger is not an Omnipotent God. You create a Strawman argument based on fallacy and a belief I do not share.

          • bizbird6

            Yes, but God is as bad and EVIL as a mugger!!!! That is the main point!!!!

          • RageFury

            Your point is based on fallacy, I believe I covered this. Essentially you have no more proof that God is evil, than I do that God does not exist.
            Understand?

          • bizbird6

            Yes, I DO!!!

            I am using your OWN Bible which you claimed is the entire Truthful word of God!!!

            God murdered thousands and maybe Millions of INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS who have done ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong.

            He did it in Noah’s Flood, in Sodom and Gomorrah, in the Canaanites, and it the Egyptian First Born.

            And even worse, he did not need to do it because he is OMNIPOTENT! He could have adopted them and let them be raised by good families. Yet Evil God decided to murder them anyway and in cold blood!

            God is an EVIL MONSTER and anyone that worship such an EVIL MONSTER is so WRONG!!!!

            Besides, Mankind does NOT NEED a God. Mankind can stand on their own two feet and DO MUCH BETTER.

            Look at those countries that are overwhelmingly Atheistic, like Sweden, Denmark, Norway, Finland, Japan, Singapore, Taiwan, etc., etc.

            These countries are extremely successful and have extremely low crime rates.

            The whole world can follow the examples of those countries!

          • RageFury

            My bible? What Bible might that be? I am Agnostic bub, I have no Bible. I have never claimed any Bible to be the truthful word of any God. Nor will I.

            I may be familiar with some of of the Christian Religion, such as it is our choice to follow it or not. Which I don’t. It is definitely not MY religion. See, your points are based on fallacy, nothing more.

            Now if you have decisive proof a God is responsible for all these issues as you claim, then please by all means put that proof forward. You will be famous for having definitive proof of a God’s existence . If not, then you have no reason to talk with me. I don’t give two craps about this. None.

            I don’t care about other Countries and their religions. I don’t care if mankind needs a God or not. I don;t care what the whole world does or does not do in regards to Religion. All I care about is Me and my family and our freedom to worship whatever religion we choose. My wife is the Christian and I follow my own thing, which is decisively not any form Christianity. All I do is defend Christians their right to the free exercise thereof. Nothing more, as nothing more interests me.

          • bizbird6

            My Apologies to misjudging you, but you were defending the “Christian God”, so I thought you have the same beliefs as the other Christian Believers.

            However, I still say that the Christian God is NOT giving mankind a choice and when he is threatening Mankind with Hell and murdering INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS in the Christian Bible (rather than “your” Bible).

            The Christian Bible DOES PROVE that God is EVIL and a MONSTER. You just have to read the account in the Bible that I mentioned earlier on Noah’s Ark, Sodom, Canaanites, and Egypt ‘s First Born.

            If a Human person killed as many human beings, that person would be called an Evil Monster. God, whom Christian pray to, should be a God that is “All Loving”, “All Good”, and “all Just”, but unfortunately, he is NOT. .

          • bizbird6

            What choice did those INNOCENT Children and INFANTS have?

            Those CHILDREN and INFANTS NEVER chose any wrong doing, but God killed them anyway!!!

            Is this a behavior of an ALL JUST God?

          • RageFury

            Quite sure you don’t have any proof God killed anyone. Feel free to produce any proof you think you have.

          • bizbird6

            Choice? What Choice?

            How can a 6 year old Child Choose to be wicked?
            Can a 3 year old Child choose to be wicked?
            Can a 1 year old INFANT CHOOSE to be Wicked?

            Yet why did God kill them?

            Satan’s got nothing to do with it. It is the EVIL God that did all of the EVIL murdering and killing !!!

          • RageFury

            Proof bub. You have none. Run along.

          • bizbird6

            I have proof!!! Lots of it!

            But you have to know the Bible!!

            But it sound like both you and your wife does NOT know the Bible?

            I have emailed with several females. What is your wife’s email name?

          • RageFury

            My wife has nothing to do with this. We do not debate Religion at home since we each agreed that our beliefs were our own and not up for debate as long as we remained Husband and wife, thus far for 15 years we are quite happy this way…

            The issue here is I don’t share your belief. I don’t give to crap about your Bible. Your Bible is not my Bible and it IS a written text, written by men. It does not serve as proof of God to me or anyone else that does not follow your Religion. Likewise the Qur’an in no way proves to me the Islamic Deity is real… I am an equal opportunity disbeliever. Of each of the major Faiths…

            Anybody can pen a book and call it a Bible. Any group of people can co-author a book and call it a Bible. You need a bit more than old dusty book, written and revised by men for proof…

            Now if you have something a bit more substantial, then by all means, lets have a look at it.

          • bizbird6

            Wonderful!!!

            You share my beliefs TOTALLY!

            I don’t believe in ANY Bible EITHER!!!

            However, your wife does seem to, which is why I disagree with her!

            So, there is therefore nothing to argue or disagree between us (you and me!) !!!

          • RageFury

            However, your wife does seem to, which is why I disagree with her!

            I disagree with her too, but alas, I gave my word not to debate it with her lol.

            Good luck to you.

          • bizbird6

            What Choice?

            How can an UNDERAGE Child or INFANT be held responsible for any wrong doing?

            Again, how can an UNDERAGE 3 year old CHILD or UNDERAGE 1 year old INFANT be held responsible for any wickedness?

            Even the Human governments does not punish the UNDERAGE 1 year old INFANT for crime. Yet how come it is FAIR AND JUST for God TO DO THIS?

            Why do you keep evading my question?

          • RageFury

            I evade nothing, prove to everyone God killed anyone. The burden of proof is yours, not mine.

          • bizbird6

            Instead of weeping, God should have just spared them, and not only the wicked, but also the INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS of these “wicked”.

            Instead of murdering the “wicked”, OMNIPOTENT God (Omnipotent means he can do anything) could have tried to use logic and persuasion for the “wicked” to change their ways.. Instead, EVIL God decided that it is easier just to murder them and their INNOCENT CHILDREN AND INFANTS!

            So, you advocate MURDERING those that don’t agree with you?? This is what God is doing!!!! He murders those who refuse to accept God. Would you murder those who refuse to accept you too??

          • bizbird6

            By the way, how many of those poor 5,000,000 victims of Nazi Genocide can you name??

      • bizbird6

        If he is indeed in front of YOU!! Then again tell me what he looks like?

        Can you video tape him???

      • bizbird6

        I am saying again and again, if God is SPEAKING, then Audio tape his voice so that we can ALL hear his voice!

        If God is really in front of you, then Video tape him, so that we can all see what he looks like!

        If you can not, then you are LYING!!!!

      • bizbird6

        This is NOT a Church!!! This is the Internet where people are free to discuss anything!

      • bizbird6

        “God is noisy as thunder, His presence is obvious…”???

        I am saying again and again, if God is SPEAKING to you, then Audio tape his voice so that we can ALL hear his voice!

        If God is really in front of you, then Video tape him, so that we can all see what he looks like!

        If you can not, then you are LYING!!!!

        • Judy

          After Jesus died God commanded the people that believe in Him have the right to speak on His behalf. It’s not that God/Jesus won’t speak , it’s that for a time, He has allowed believers to speak for Him if it is based on what He says and does in the Bible. He doesn’t speak to unbelievers. The Holy Spirit will speak to our hearts, drawing us to Himself, and may do so many times. He may be calling you, but you really need to be quiet to be able to hear Him.

          • bizbird6

            I’ll tell you something that may shock you and other
            Believers. God does NOT talk to you either! You may think he talk to you, but in reality he does NOT.

            Why? Because you are using God as an imaginary friend or companion! Instead of calling this imaginary “Fred” or “Sam” or whatever, you call him “God”.

            That is why you think that you have a “Relationship” with God, but the reality is that this is purely imaginary. Sure it makes you feel less lonely, but it is still NOT real!!

          • Judy

            That is unbelievably sad. I am 70 years old and have been a born again Christian for over half of those years. I have seen so many answered prayers, there is no way anyone can convince me there is no God. My 39 year old son died of a massive heart attack on May 15, 2010. My husband of 45 years died 2 days later. The next day a friend I have known for 50 years died. The two older guys were ill for quite some time so their deaths were expected. My son’s was not. I had studied the Bible deeply for over 30 years and I knew what to expect. You don’t receive God’s comforting grace until you need it and I am a first hand witness to that. Jesus wrapped me in His comforting love and I have been in that ‘bubble’ for over 3 1/2 years. So, honey, please don’t try to convince me there is no God. You ain’t got a clue! But, I will pray for you, even tho you will not understand a word I have written. It is 7:58 pm Sunday Dec 8, 2013 and I am going to pray for you as soon as I post this. God loves you and so do I.

          • bizbird6

            You are deceiving yourself completely!!!!!!!!!

            When a prayer is “answered”, the we are so happy that God has responded to us. We feel so grateful and we “Remembered it for years” and maybe even a “lifetime”.

            However, when a prayer is NOT answered, then we start making excuses for God. We say things like “God in his infinite wisdom decided that it was time for such and such to go and meet his Savior”. “So I will accept it”.

            So what ever happens, “the God argument wins out”!!!

            You had so many of your people died, so it is obvious that “god” has NOT answer your prayers or other wise they’ll be ALL alive and kicking and in excellent health!

            See, that is why God does NOT exist. because his believers does not face reality in a objective mind.

            Suppose now, you let an Scientist with an Objective mind examine this? Will he reach the same conclusions as you? I think NOT!!!

  • bizbird6

    This article is completely mislabeled!

    I read NOTHING about where Ted Turner “turned to Christianity” or “God”.

    To me, Ted Turner is a GREAT person, who has accomplished a thousand time more in his lifetime that those Christian critics who has not done anything note worthy .

    • Larry Stauth

      Try reading… the center is “Excerpt from CNN Article”

      What does the last line of the quoted article read????

      “Do I get into heaven?”

      Guess what.. Atheists don’t go to Heaven.. they going the ground…

      As for your assumptions… You have no clue the people replying. You also make the assumptions Mr. Turner will be remembered in 50 years…

      Heck, most people can’t even get the facts straight on famous people from 20 years ago…

      There is NOTHING Mr. Turner has done, that cannot be undone by the next guy.

      But, you assume that those responding have done nothing… Yet, I can guarantee, there are teachers that have responded, who influence the people like Mr. Turner.

      There are also Vets, who risked their lives to ensure you maintain the right to assume they have done nothing, which is a GREATER deed than all of Mr. Turner’s combined…

      Ted Turner has only risked his money, to take advantage of others, to obtain things worthless to a body in a coffin.

      In 50 years, even you will be a distant memory… Heck, I am willing to bet you do not even know the details of your own family from more than 3 generations back.

      And not talking name, DOB or silly stuff like that… talking detailed knowledge of the person, their likes, dislikes…

      Of course, I can’t say that, because my family has their own museum, dedicated to keeping those memories…. You’re welcome to Google the last name… it’s in Kansas…

      As for me.. unlike you, I am not ashamed of who I am, so I don’t hide behind a fake name. You can actually Google my name and find that I work as Photo Journalist for a Southern Oregon Newspaper. And I do have many friends and admires of my work…

      But I don’t SEEK anything, form anyone EXCEPT God! Because when I die… it’s only his approval that matters.

      This world can forget me, all they want… I am not so vain to worry about what the world remembers.

      • bizbird6

        Ted Turner was just asking questions, like all of us do. He was NOT stating any position at all!

        You Christian are always looking to things that favor your own viewpoint!!

        Even when they don’t exist!!

  • bizbird6

    Those Biblical quotations are worthless!!

    You need to read the Bible in its original language, which is what Bart Ehrman and Earl Doherty can do, The language is important because language makes a BIG difference.

    The Bible in another language is NOT the same as English, especially in the ORIGINAL language of the Bible.

    Why??? When the Bible was translated into English, King James got the best poets and writers in the English language to write up the Bible in the most beautiful language possible. Since he was a King, he was able to make the English Bible into a piece of poet beauty!

    That is why you are INSPIRED when you read the Bible, because it was DELIBERATELY written so that whoever reads it WILL BE INSPIRED!

    However, the Bible in the original language was NOTHING like that. In the original, you will conflicting forms, conflicting styles, and conflicting messages.

    The conflicting styles indicate that there were many, many writers, not just one. And even worse, the names were phony. Different people with different styles would use the same names.

    Anyway, you need to read the Bible Experts, like Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Earl Doherty who can explain all these things much, much better than me. Why don’t you look up Bart Ehrman in Wiki which listed all his books?

    • Larry Stauth

      I have read it… It’s called a concordance. Shows you the Original Greek.. and those Quotations are spot on.

      And please, I know, by specifics which books were written in Hebrew and I know which books were written in Greek… You are not talking to some chump here.

      King James? King James had NOTHING to do with the writing of the King James Translations… In fact, it wasn’t even called the King James version until AFTER King James’ death… in honor of Him.

      I also do not follow one translation or another. And the absolute word, as spoken. It’s also why Seminary School takes longer than most physicians are in Medical School… because they are required to study and understand ALL the languages used. And I can validate every quotation with a whole list of individuals who are capable of quoting, in the original languages.

      And get this through you thick skull, Bart Ehrman is NOT a Bible Expert… He is a “New Testament scholar” And just like Spong, their writing are more about sensationalism and the conformity of religion post Jesus.

      Heck, why not reference Joseph Atwill.. He’s a nutjob too, more bent on confusing the masses, in order to gain attention.

      Keep in mind, not all the claim to be Christians are really so. Judas walked with Jesus and betrayed him.. The Hebrews saw God part the Red Sea and still they turned away from him when they were restless.

      How about you try reading the writings of Billy Graham, who began studying scripture before those you mentioned were born. So trusted, he was known as the Pastor to the Presidents…

      Try reading the writings of Ray Comfort, Mark Greston, James P. Stobaugh, Charles H. Spurgeon, Shana Schutte, Carroll Roberson, David McGee, Cheryl Arnold, David Fiorazo, Alexander Keith, Dr. John F. Ashton, Roger Oakland, John Foxe, Don Landis, Henry Morris, Ken Ham & Bodie Hodge…

      Just for starters… I could honestly spend all week posting the True Scholars, who studied the original text…

      Oh, and btw… those quotes came courtesy of Living Waters, Ray Comfort and his book…

      http://books.google.com/books/about/Scientific_Facts_in_the_Bible.html?id=AMMImQEACAAJ

      And he references your issue of original text and even gives the original translation…

      • bizbird6

        How can a “believer of the Bible” be so wrong!!! It takes a “Nonbeliever” to set things right. This is from Wiki in Regards to King James Version of the Bible:

        “James gave the translators instructions intended to guarantee that the new version would conform to the ecclesiology and reflect the episcopalstructure of the Church of England and its belief in an ordained clergy.[8]The translation was done by 47 scholars, all of
        whom were members of the Church of England.[9] In common with most other translations of the period, the New Testament was translated from Greek, the Old Testament was translated from Hebrew text, while the Apocrypha were translated from the Greek and Latin………”

        James had everything to do with the Bible.

        • sandraleesmith46

          That’s ONE VERSION or translation; NOT all of them. And to see so much hatred spewing, you must have asked for something that you believe God “failed” you on somehow. How pathetically sad for you and all those around you that you feel compelled to place your faith in something built on such shifting sands as science. All those years in “religious” school and you never ONCE actually met Jesus, never ONCE opened your heart to Him….. We KNEW there’d be a “great falling away”, and it’s happening just as predicted. More it means another predicted event is that much nearer to happening. Ever see what happens along a shore line right before a tsunami hits? Well, that’s kind of what’s happening with THE Church right now….

          • bizbird6

            God DID failed me and he failed millions of people around the world. As I mentioned before, he failed 5 Millions Jews when they prayed to him and asked to be saved from Nazi genocide. Yet, God ignored them and let them die.

            I am shocked that you can be so indifferent to that.

            Also, how about the thousand and Millions of Innocents of genocide that God inflicted on the victims of Noah’s Floods, especially the Innocent children and Infants.

            And the Innocent victims of the Sodom and Gomorrah, especially the Innocent children and Infants. Also the Innocent Egyptian First Born. Or the Innocents of Canaanites, especially the Children and Infants!

            God have done TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE things that only EVIL MONSTER can do! How can you continue to worship him?

            Please do what Millions in the world today are doing, ABANDONING the Christian Religion and throw that Phony Bible into the closest trash bin. Then Join the rest of us.

          • sandraleesmith46

            You do NOT even want to go into why the flood happened; because the same conditions exist RIGHT NOW around the world, but especially in this nation, conditions you clearly have no understanding regarding. As for the Jews of the holocaust, I don’t know the conditions of their hearts, and neither do you, but God did, and still does, of every living creature. What I DO know is that a significant portion of the Jewish population had been seduced by secular humanism, and had abandoned their faith, which in God’s eyes is sin, and the wages of sin still haven’t changed. God didn’t “fail” them, they failed Him, and themselves. And as I have said more than once, free will means that sometimes the choices of one hurt others. Hitler and Himmler and a number of others made the choices that hurt all those people, but so did the ones who carried them out, make free will choices to comply and do such egregious acts. That wasn’t God. And every one of those responsible will have to answer to Him for those choices.

            At the time of the flood and in Sodom, Gomorrah and the other plains cities that were destroyed at the time, there were no “innocent” people, just as there are no “innocent” people living now. Not you, not me,not anyone. Babies and young children are SEEN as innocent by God before the age of consent, and He will take them as such. But He isn’t killing them, even when they die as the result of some plague, cataclysm or whatever, that’s the choices of people around them that are doing that or the natural occurrences of nature.

            To “intervene” in the Nazis actions would have been to cross their free will choices, and either all are free or NONE are. I’m NOT indifferent, I just have a different understanding than you do, probably because I’ve had the experience of being the one hurt by the choices of others, and had to learn WHY that was allowed to happen. That understanding did NOT come easily.

            The Egyptian first born were “condemned” by Pharaoh, not God. Even Cecil B DeMille got that right when he remade the Ten Commandments and had Moses declare it in the dialogue. Whatever it is you believe God let you down about, you’re mistaken. And you’re making bad choices as a result; choices that will lead to your own destruction, BY your own choices. Whatever it was, however horrific, it may have been, God didn’t let you down, you and others around you did that. Parents, neighbors, teachers, priests, whomever, but not God. He doesn’t always answer prayers the way we want, but that’s not letting you down. Sometimes the answer is no, and sometimes it’s different than we expect,or takes time to accomplish, or both. But He sees what’s best for all and acts in accordance with His knowledge and plans, not our wants.
            And being a natural “caretaker”, I’m not “indifferent” to the deaths of people. Not the Jews murdered in the Holocaust, not the millions of babies murdered in their mothers’ wombs, not the slaughters of Christians over in the ME, or any of the other seemingly senseless deaths. I simply lay the responsibility for those deaths where they belong; with the humans believing Satan’s lies who are the real ones responsible for those deaths. Time grows very short. You know ABOUT God, but I don’t believe you have ever KNOWN HIM! You really should give that a try. BTW, you won’t convert me.

          • bizbird6

            Why didn’t God just kill the Pharaoh HIMSELF, rather than kill thousands of Innocent Egyptian First Born just to teach ONE MAN a lesson.

            Isn’t that simpler to kill ONE man than kill thousands of Innocents and HOPE that ONE man will learn his lesson??

            The Pharaoh do have a lot of Body Guards, but Omnipotent God and his Angel surely can handle them very easily.

            Or is God so weak??? If so, he is NOT God, but a Phony.

            It is so obvious that it is a wonder why more people Don’t think about it!!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            You don’t comprehend what you read well, or don’t read what’s written, clearly. I already answered that'; and just because you don’t like the answer isn’t going to change it. GOD DID NOT KILL ANYONE, in Egypt or anywhere else! And since you obviously don’t want answers that don’t agree with your rage and hate, we’re done NOW!

          • bizbird6

            But God DID KILL thousands and maybe Millions! Are we reading the same Bible???

          • sandraleesmith46

            GOD has killed no one; their OWN SINS and choices brought their deaths upon themselves, or the sins and free will choices of other humans did so, in which case, if they were right with God, they’re SAVED for eternity,

          • bizbird6

            Who killed those thousands and Millions then?

            Who put in 40 days of rain to drown those thousands and Millions for Noah? Who hailed those thousand at Sodom and Gomorrah?

            Who sent the Angel of death to kill those First Born in Egypt?

            Who wiped out those Canaanites?

            If not God, then Who??

          • bizbird6

            If God did not killed all those people who did?

            You don’t read your own Bible. The Bible SAID GOD KILLED ALL those People!!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            Noah was out in the desert building an ark, a HUGE ship almost the size of the Titanic, for YEARS! You think no one NOTICED? They laughed and mocked him and arrogantly CHOSE to NOT get on that ship; THEIR choices killed them, NOT GOD! Just as YOUR arrogant choice will almost certainly wind up killing YOU! I do read the Bible, and UNDERSTAND It in the context of its wholeness through the Holy Spirit; you may read it until you’re blue in the face, but until you have the Holy Spirit in your heart you will NEVER understand it. The Bible doesn’t say GOD killed them, it says He sent a flood; but HE also provided a way out; which they REFUSED! Ergo THEY killed themselves!
            Just as in Egypt there was a WAY OUT, but the Egyptians didn’t listen either, and Pharaoh decreed the death of the first born son, not God; that was Pharaoh’s choice. for all he meant it for the Hebrews not his own people.
            Canaanites again paid the penalty for their own choices and sins; God is JUST as well as merciful. and there are consequences to our choices; period! You don’t like that, too bad, DON’T keep carping on what isn’t true because you can’t read the truth in front of you!

          • bizbird6

            Absolutely Baloney!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            I KNEW it! COWARD! You’re afraid to ask any of the others, because deep inside you KNOW I’m right!

          • bizbird6

            The Bible is already a Phony! And you made it even more Phony!

            God is a MURDERER AND A MONSTER. You can twist things around all you want. You can not change that!!

            God NOT only murdered the “WICKED”, but he also murdered INNOCENT CHILDREN of the NOAH FLOOD, the INNOCENT Children of the Sodom and Gomorrah, and the INNOCENT CHILDREN of the Canaanites. Also God murdered the INNOCENT EGYPTIAN FIRST BORN.

            Even if those that God murdered are wicked (which I TOTALLY DOUBTED), the the INNOCENT CHILDREN OF THOSE “WICKED” DOES NOT DESERVE TO DIE.

            IMMAGINE, a SIX year old child being KILLED BY God, OR a YEAR OLD CHILD BEING KILLED by GOD, or a 2 MONTHS OLD INFANT being killed by God.

            I feel sick and vomiting every time I think about it!!!!

          • Judy

            I dare you to set down and quietly and sincerely ask God to show you the Truth. You have to be sincerely asking Him as He can see your heart. He will be delighted to show you if you really want to know. I think you are on this site begging for someone to show you the truth about God/Jesus/the Bible but you are shouting so loud you cant hear God speaking to your heart.No one will know but you.

          • bizbird6

            How about the 5,000,000 victims of the Nazi concentration camps? Didn’t they ask for God’s help also? Why did God ignore them and let them die?

            Why didn’t God tell THEM the “Truth” or answer THEIRr prayers? I bet they BEG God even harder than me OR you can even begin to beg, but all in vain. If God ignore the prayers of 5,000,000,so why should he show you the “truth”?

            I think that you are barking up the wrong tree. God does NOT answer prayer. There are 5,000,000 proofs of that!

          • bizbird6

            Sins and choices killed NO ONE, but the God of your Bible did, and he killed THOUSANDS AND MILLIONS!!!

          • Judy

            Yes, Godrained down fire and brimstones down on Sodom, but they were warned and warned. God will only permit so much evil to prevail. He knew if that city survived, the evil the people did would spread. God is love and mercy but He also is perfectly just.

          • bizbird6

            But how about the INNOCENT CHILDREN AND INFANTS of SODOM??

            DO these INNOCENT CHILDREN AND INFANTS NEED TO BE KILLED BY GOD as well???

            You seem to have as LITTLE CONSCIENCE as MONSTER God. You sound almost as EVIL as MONSTER God!!!!

          • bizbird6

            What are you talking about?? Didn’t I tell you that I went to a Christian school and we read about Christ and the Bible almost everyday???

            God killed thousands and Millions, in Noah floods, in Sodom and Gomorrah, with the Egyptian First Born, and he helped the Israelite killed thousands of Canaanites.

            Are we talking about the same Bible? I know as much about the Bible as you do. You must be high on drugs or something.

          • sandraleesmith46

            That’s the lib answer for everyone who disagrees; THEY {the one(‘s) disagreeing} are psycho or on drugs; so TYPICAL! Never examine yourself for YOUR error. I don’t care how many years you sat in a “Christian” school or read the Bible; until and unless YOU personally KNOW Jesus as your Lord and Savior, YOUR Redeemer from YOUR sins, and then receive the indwelling of His Holy Spirit, you will NEVER understand God or the Bible, because it’s intended that way! So, even if we sat side by side reading from the exact same Book, YOU could never understand it in the same way as God intends it to BE understood. Your INTELLECT will always be in your way.

          • Judy

            It is heartbreaking to God that you say these things. He is waiting for you to come to His Son. That’s all He asks of us; accept Jesus as the true Messiah. Do you know why God destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah? It had become a cesspool of homosexuality. The people had become so evil, it was too late for the. Yes, God had warned them over and over as well. Only Lot and his family were righteous so they were saved. Then his wife looked back, which God had said would show that she wanted to go back. She loved that city. So she became a pillar of salt. When the three angels came to tell Lot to leave, homosexual men came and asked for those angels. Lot told them they could have his daughters, but not the men. And that is how much God hated that lifestyle, that He would prefer rape over homosexuality. That is pretty much how the Roman Empire crashed; depravity of that particular sin and others.

          • bizbird6

            Maybe Mankind is NOT PERFECT, but in this world NOTHING is PERFECT anyway. We can all strive to be better than we are.

            HOWEVER, God is WORSE!!!!!!!! Other than Genghis Khan, Attila, Hitler, and Stalin, only God had done MORE EVIL. God has killed more people than the worst of Mankind.

            I don’t want to list again and again those poor INNOCENT MURDERED CHILDREN and INFANTS that God has MURDERED in Noah’s Flood, in Sodom and Gomorrah, in Canaan, and in Moses’s Egypt.

            God is a MASS MURDERER that has NO Conscience!!!

            And God is an EGOMANIAC. Just think, suppose you murdered Millions just because you don’t like someone’s LIFESTYLE?

            So, You say that it is alright for you to murder THOUSAND and MILLIONS of Homosexuals just because you don’t like the way they are and the way that they live???

            You sound as EVIL and as much as a BIGOT as God is!!!

            That is where Hitler and Stalin learned to do their EVIL deeds. We MUST get rid of the EVIL God and his FALSE Bible………………..and ASAP!!!!!!

            Follow the EXAMPLE of those people in Sweden, England, and France, who are leaving the phony Christian Religion in DROVES!!!

          • bizbird6

            You rather condemn Millions than condemn God!!! The truth is that the Millions are INNOCENT, but GOD is an EVIL MONSTER!!!

            To you, anything is better than calling God is Evil! Fortunately, the world does NOT agree with you, so Millions are abandoning Christianity in droves!

            There was NEVER Original SIN at all in the first place!! Adam and Eve does NOT represent us!! We never voted for Adam and Eve to represent us. Was there an Election where we ALL voted for Adam ans Eve to represent us?

            Since there was NEVER an Original sin, it was NEVER necessary for Christ to die for us. That is why Christ either Never Existed or is dead and buried long ago.

            See, this is the BIG FLAW in Christian Belief!!!

            Christianity claimed FREE WILL, but we were NEVER given FREE Will. Adam and Eve may have committed the SIN, but NOT us Humans. Blaming us for Adam and Eves’ sin violated FREE WILL!

            (Actually, I don’t even believe that Adam and Eve ever existed at all and the ENTIRE Bible is Bogus!)

          • bizbird6

            I DISAGREE TOTALLY!!

            The people are GOOD!! It is GOD that is EVIL!!!!

            The sooner that the people abandon God and strive for the heights of their idealism, the sooner mankind will reach closer to his or her potential.

          • sandraleesmith46

            People are NOT “inherently good”! What you label as “good” is LEARNED behavior and without a Godly moral base, that doesn’t happen! So the sooner God is abandoned the sooner all veneer of civilization will vanish, as we see happening around us DAILY! That is , those of us who are paying attention to the situation in the world.

          • bizbird6

            Maybe Mankind is NOT PERFECT, but in this world NOTHING is PERFECT anyway. We can all strive to be better than we are.

            HOWEVER, God is WORSE!!!!!!!! Other than Genghis Khan, Attila, Hitler, and Stalin, only God had done MORE EVIL. God has killed more people than the worse of Mankind.

            I don’t want to list again and again those poor INNOCENT MURDERED CHILDREN and INFANTS that God has MURDERED in Noah’s Flood, in Sodom and Gomorrah, in Canaan, and in Moses’s Egypt.

            God is a MASS MURDERER that has NO Conscience!!!

            That is where Hitler and Stalin learned to do their EVIL deeds. We MUST get rid of the EVIL God and his FALSE Bible….and ASAP!!!!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            WOW, the HATE! GOD did NONE of the things you claim and blame Him for; HUMANS did that, mostly on their own volition! In the rare instances when they WERE acting on His instruction, it was in judgment of another group of those who were under penalty for their own prior bad acts. Humans are, by nature, more easily bent to evil than to good, And that you spew such hatred tells me you KNOW the truth, and are endeavoring to convince yourself otherwise, because you feel God betrayed you in some way. What a terrible shame for you; but until YOU deal with YOUR problems no one can help you, and I would prefer to hear no more of your hatred spewing in my face. The people in all 3of the nations you name have fallen prey to ISLAM, and if you want that, GO to where it’s wanted. We in the US DO NOT WANT It!

          • bizbird6

            There is NO hate at all, JUST DISDAIN and PITY for you
            poor Christians for worshiping such a EVIL and MONSTER of a GOD!

            Happily, the World is abandoning the Christian Religion in DROVES.

            I am surprise that you are still trying to defend the indefensible.

            If I have to judge between Christianity and Islam, I would consider Islam much truer Religion than Christianity. Do you want to know why?

            I’ll tell you if you want to know, but I think that you don’t want to, because you are afraid of the TERRIBLE truth that I may reveal!!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            You spew hate and rage out of every pore and orifice, with every single post. And that comes from anger born or some “hurt” however imagined it may have been; for which I feel sorry for you, but I’m done trying to help you see REASON and rationality; you have chosen your path AND your own fate; amen {so be it}.

          • bizbird6

            You are so RIGHT!!!

            God DID failed me and he failed millions of people around
            the world. As I mentioned before, he failed 5 Millions Jews when they prayed to him and asked to be saved from Nazi genocide. Yet, God ignored them and let them die.

            I am shocked that you can be so indifferent to that.

            Also, how about the thousand and Millions of Innocents of
            genocide that God inflicted on the victims of Noah’s Floods, especially the Innocent children and Infants.

            And the Innocent victims of the Sodom and Gomorrah,
            especially the Innocent children and Infants. Also the Innocent Egyptian First Born. Or the Innocents of Canaanites, especially the Children and Infants!

            God have done TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE things that only EVIL MONSTER can do! How can you continue to worship him?

            Please do what Millions in the world today are doing, ABANDONING the Christian Religion and throw that Phony Bible into the closest trash bin. Then Join the rest of us.

          • sandraleesmith46

            That’s a very CHILDISH attitude; God never “failed” you; you failed Him, if anyone failed anyone else. I have told you repeatedly, those were NOT “innocents”, NONE was innocent, we are ALL SINNERS from our births; and the babies and young children were imputed innocence and taken to paradise, according to God’s ways, a far better fate than what awaited them in this world as it was when they died. The amount of rage spewing constantly from you, toward God tells me you not ONLY believe He IS, but that you fear Him greatly. I would heartily suggest you repent of your sins and get your heart right with Him before it’s too late and you earn yourself a slot where you CLAIM erroneously He sent those babies. God has done NO EVIL, He’s not capable of doing evil; and you haven’t yet learned to discern Him from Satan.
            Those millions who have known and then turned away and are denying Him, HE will also deny, and I can assure you, the place where they’re going, I do NOT choose to go. If you think you’re the ONLY one who ever felt angry over something that didn’t go YOUR way with God, guess again. Grow up and admit your error and get straight or be quiet, because obviously YOU do believe in Him despite your denials.

          • bizbird6

            God is EVIL, while Mankind and GOOD!

            I am sorry that we can NOT agree!!

            There is nothing more to say.

            Good-luck and hope you the best!!!

          • bizbird6

            You are so HEARTLESS and INHUMANE. Those lives of THOUSANDS and MILLIONS MEAN NOTHING to You.
            You care only for your selfish AGENDA!!

            See.this is another reason that MILLIONS AND MILLIONS ARE ABANDONING CHRISTIANITY.

            Those Millions see through the EVIL AND SELFISH IDEALS of your Religion!!!

            I wasn’t going to write you anymore since we just don’t agree, but I just had to write one last time, because I was so shocked, disgusted, appalled, and by your selfishness and depravity.

          • sandraleesmith46

            Selfishness and depravity is what you’re expressing in your rants against God Whom you so hate out of some childish pique! Do you have any idea what an infectious disease does to a population, when it runs free unchecked? SIN is an infectious disease, and it’s running amok in this nation right now, yet you’re feigning concern for millions of dead that were dead long before you were even a twinkle, and spewing hate and rage against a righteous God Who DARED to judge them GUILTY for their sins, and allow the sentence of their own choices to be completed on them. GROW UP and think like an adult! Oh, wait, that’s your problem; you’re not capable of that….You’re STUCK in that raging child mode, because you can’t see beyond your own ego. Whatever it is you THINK God failed you over, which is in YOUR head, not reality, you undoubtedly either failed to hear the “no’, or fail to grasp that whatever you asked for wasn’t part of His plan for your life, or would have crossed someone else’ free will and therefore HE couldn’t do that. Neither God nor I wanted any of those people to die; THEY made their choices,and sometimes the choices of the parents HURT their kids badly, but it’s THEIR choices not GOD’S that did so! They were warned and refused to HEED the warnings, and if you doubt that, look at the reports of how many fail to heed warnings about storms or other natural hazards and stay in dangerous areas and DIE because they made WRONG choices. Weather is an act of nature, which is no respecter of persons, has neither hate nor love for any, etc. People BLAME God for acts of nature, again wrongly. You want nothing but to hate and rage, so take it else where. If you wanted to HEAR truth, you would have done so long since. Have a nice eternity with your pal Satan, who is the real author of those catastrophes and deaths, since you reject God.

          • bizbird6

            I keep wanted to end this conversation since this is getting us no where!

            Anyway, why don’t you just debate this with your husband, since both your husband and I think alike!!

            WE BOTH BELIEVE IN THE SAME THINGS

            Good bye and good luck!!

          • sandraleesmith46

            No husband, but even if I was married, he’d be a believer too, or we wouldn’t be married. I simply refuted your dishonesty with yourself and others. If you were truly a non-believer, your rage would make no sense; but you do believe and that’s the root of that rage. You believe and didn’t get your way, so you’re mad at God!

          • bizbird6

            Mankind does NOT NEED GOD and Christianity as a MORAL BASE!!!!

            Why? Let me prove it to you!!!! AGAIN LET ME PROVE IT TO YOU!!

            Non Religious countries do much better and are successful

            Post 1: Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:26 pm

            I will argue that non-religious democratic countries are the best places to live in the world. I will concentrate on Scandinavia that is all democratic and very non-religious. Many Americans argue that if America will be less religious then everything will fall down and the society will be lost.

            As you will see in my post I have one theme……If God exists (which I don’t believe) he sure does hate religious countries.

            Here are the richest countries in the world in GDP (gross domestic product) per person for 2011:

            Ranking, Country on US Dollars”

            1 Luxembourg 122,272

            2 Qatar 97,967

            3 Norway 96,591

            4 Switzerland 84,983

            5 Australia 66,984

            6 United Arab Emirates 66,625

            7 Denmark 63,003

            8 Sweden 61,098

            9 Netherlands 51,410

            10 Canada 51,147

            11 Singapore 50,714

            12 Austria 50,504

            13 Finland 50,090

            14 Ireland 48,517

            15 United States 48,147

            16 Belgium 48,110

            17 Kuwait 46,461

            18 Japan 45,774

            19 Germany 44,558

            20 France 44,401

            1. Out of the top 20 countries in the list above, 14 belong to the top 25 most atheists countries in the world. Among the countries that are not part of the top 25 non-religious country is of course USA.

            Here are the top 4 non-religious countries in the world:

            1. Sweden – up to 85% atheists – Sweden is leading the world in aid to “poor” countries when looking at giving aid in percent of GDP, Sweden is ranked number one in the world in IT technology, has the most women in the equivalent to the Unites States congress plus many other positive
            ranks.

            2. Denmark – 80% atheist or agnostics. Basically has the same numbers as Sweden with the most aid to poor countries in percentage of GDP. Leader in
            “happiest country” in the world.

            3. Norway – 72% Atheists or agnostics. Once again Norway is really similar to Sweden and Denmark in all the stats about freedom, technology and that the people are satisfied with their life.

            4. Finland – 70% Atheists or agnostics. Has the highest school results of the western world in test results for math, reading (The test is called PISA)

            Other countries in the top 25 most atheistic countries include:

            Japan 65% atheists – Good economy histrionically and has created many high tech things.

            South Korea – 52% Atheists This country is growing and growing and will soon have the same GDP per capital as most western nations.

          • Judy

            God spoke to the people through Moses and said they must repent. He said it decade after decade but the Jews were stubborn and wanted a king. If you’ve read the OT you know that didn’t work out too well for them. But, God, in His great mercy, kept warning them and warning them. They did not repent so future generations have suffered much. God is still trying to get through to the Jews, His Chosen People, to turn to God and accept Jesus as their Savior. There are an awful lot of Jews that have come to Jesus. Jews for Jesus is one group that helps them in their new life as a believer in Jesus as their Messiah. As far as children being killed in the flood, etc. God knew every single person that died, He knew their heart and who would be saved and who would not be saved.

          • bizbird6

            The people NOT have to repent because they have DONE NOTHING wrong!!! Let me repeat myself, the PEOPLE HAVE DONE NOTHING WRONG!!!

            There is NO SUCH THING as SIN. It is only the Christian Religion that INVENTED SIN!!!

            IT IS EVIL GOD WHO IS A MONSTER and who KILLED THOUSAND AND MILLIONS OF INNOCENT CHILDREN AND INFANTS in the Bible.

            It is also the EVIL God that ignored the prayers of 5 MILLIONS Victims of Nazi Genocide in World War II.

            That is why we must forget the Christian God and move on!!

        • Judy

          Did you know that anyone can go on Wikipedia and change the posts? I don’t think they can be considered a reliable source, especially on all things Christian.

          • bizbird6

            If the Wiki is so easy to change, then why don’t you “Christians” go in and change it or correct it? If you are so sure that the Wiki is so wrong, then you surely can change it!

            Actually, the WIKI is very, very, accurate!!! Why? Because the entire reading public in the whole, whole world is reading, judging, and if Wiki is wrong, correcting.

            Very few literature is perused/examined that carefully, that publicly, and that critically.

            If someone writes a book, the book gets hidden away in some unknown corner of some library, and even if it is extremely inaccurate, it is never discovered. And even if someone happen to read it and discover it, there is very little that he can do about it. He can send a correction letter to the publisher, but is the publisher going to spend a lot of money to republish the book? Most likely not!

            The Wiki Encyclopedia, however, is just the opposite. If the Wiki is incorrect, the whole world will discover it very quickly. And it is so easy to correct it! It does NOT require a fortune to make corrections.

            I mean, how can you hide it?? It is all so open and so public?? 1

          • Judy

            Wiki doesn’t have a very good reputation is what I was saying to you. I live in a small town of about 25,000. Wiki lists the town as having 9,000 residents. I did correct it and it is still saying we only have 9,000. Just one example of why they are such a joke to true researchers.
            Plus, there is no such thing as a Bible expert if they aren’t believers in Jesus Christ. The New Testament is written to Christians and Jesus spoke in parables so the unbeliever, like yourself, cannot understand it. That’s why I keep telling you you have to be saved to ‘get it’. We are not an exclusive club, ALL who believe can be with God for eternity if they accept the salvation that is already there.

          • bizbird6

            You need to get out of that TINY place of yours and venture out to those Big cities. Small places fester NARROW MINDEDNESS and BIGOTRY!!!

            If you do that, you’ll find that Christianity and the Bible is totally FALSE!!!

          • bizbird6

            Mankind does NOT NEED GOD and Christianity as a MORAL BASE!!!!

            Why?

            Let me prove it to you!!!! AGAIN, LET ME PROVE IT TO YOU!!

            Non Religious countries do much better and are successful

            Post 1: Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:26 pm

            I will argue that non-religious democratic countries are the best places to live in the world. I will concentrate on Scandinavia that is all democratic and very non-religious. Many Americans argue that if America will be less religious then everything will fall down and the society will be lost.

            As you will see in my post I have one theme……If God exists (which I don’t believe) he sure does hate religious countries.

            Here are the richest countries in the world in GDP (gross domestic product) per person for 2011:

            Ranking, Country on US Dollars”

            1 Luxembourg 122,272

            2 Qatar 97,967

            3 Norway 96,591

            4 Switzerland 84,983

            5 Australia 66,984

            6 United Arab Emirates 66,625

            7 Denmark 63,003

            8 Sweden 61,098

            9 Netherlands 51,410

            10 Canada 51,147

            11 Singapore 50,714

            12 Austria 50,504

            13 Finland 50,090

            14 Ireland 48,517

            15 United States 48,147

            16 Belgium 48,110

            17 Kuwait 46,461

            18 Japan 45,774

            19 Germany 44,558

            20 France 44,401

            1. Out of the top 20 countries in the list above, 14 belong to the top 25 most atheists countries in the world. Among the countries that are not part of the top 25 non-religious country is of course USA.

            Here are the top 4 non-religious countries in the world:

            1. Sweden – up to 85% atheists – Sweden is leading the world in aid to “poor” countries when looking at giving aid in percent of GDP, Sweden is ranked number one in the world in IT technology, has the most women in the equivalent to the Unites States congress plus many other positive
            ranks.

            2. Denmark – 80% atheist or agnostics. Basically has the same numbers as Sweden with the most aid to poor countries in percentage of GDP. Leader in
            “happiest country” in the world.

            3. Norway – 72% Atheists or agnostics. Once again Norway is really similar to Sweden and Denmark in all the stats about freedom, technology and that the people are satisfied with their life.

            4. Finland – 70% Atheists or agnostics. Has the highest school results of the western world in test results for math, reading (The test is called PISA)

            Other countries in the top 25 most atheistic countries include:

            Japan 65% atheists – Good economy histrionically and has created many high tech things.

            South Korea – 52% Atheists This country is growing and growing and will soon have the same GDP per capital as most western nations. 1

          • bizbird6

            I was a Believer, until I KNEW BETTER!!!

            And I was NOT the only one. Here is a list of other Ex-Christian:

            You should also look them up in Wiki or whatever these persons: Bart Ehrman, Bishop John Spong, Earl Doheny, Victor Stenger, Dan Barker, John Allen Paulos, Jerry Coyne, Sam Harris, Steven Pinker, Michael Newdow, Julia Sweeney.

            We were ALL Christians once until we found that Christianity to be false. They have ALL written books to impart their experiences to others, like you!

            I have many, many more names, but don’t want to overwhelm you.

          • bizbird6

            If the mistake of 9,000 vs. 25,000 is still there, did you follow up afterwards?

            I tried to correct an incorrect address with my Insurance company once too, and it took many attempts before it was actually changed and corrected.

            Wiki can not just change that quickly every time some one mails or email in an input . it must also investigate.also to confirm the correction. And do you realize how many corrections they must get every month? Millions and Millions.

            Their staff is not unlimited either so they must prioritize what gets correct first. IF they get a lot of complaints, then they prioritize accordingly. How many people in the world are concerned about whether your town’s population is
            9000 or 25000 do you think?

            Anyway, It is still much better than anything else that we have.

            If you think you can do better, you are welcome to start your own “Wiki” too. If you succeed, you will be Millions and Millions of dollars ahead. You will be a RICH person!

        • Judy

          True believers know they are not wrong when quoting the Christian God of the Bible. God tells us to reach the world with His message of salvation. I have been where you are but you have never been where I am. It’s hard to describe what we experience when we are saved by grace. You just know it’s real. I have been a believe for over 35 years and God has never let me down.

          • bizbird6

            You are TOTALLY DELUSIONAL!

            You are imagining things.

            There is NO God, NO Christ, and the bible is a Fraud!

      • bizbird6

        Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

        According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

        Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief
        and social well-being was published in the Journal of Religion & Society.
        Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

        Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior,
        Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage pregnancy than societies where many people profess belief in God.

        Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people – Japan is one of the least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates
        of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

        (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both mothers and children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

        Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty
        percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced that there is a deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do twice as badly as the others. Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000 people a year.

        At the other end of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of evolution (many believe it had a helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five times greater than in Europe and ten times higher than in Japan.

        All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and
        antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

        At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals a different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will respect social customs and laws.

        All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.
        Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or
        “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do not share their
        sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”,
        they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their
        priority becomes not the world they live in but themselves.

        The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior. Hence gun laws which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings who deserve protection, but as potential aggressors who deserve to
        die. And hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

        As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of unwanted pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit society as a whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them
        that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I
        say”. The result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections.

        Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.
        Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal logic, no matter how absurd to outside observers.

        The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public discussion. Look no further than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime time television.

        Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere. As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory Paul’s study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you should tell them that God does not exist.”

        I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that God would be an atheist,

        i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies
        become secular.

        http://www.humaniststudies.org

        • Larry Stauth

          http://www.mapsofworld.com/world-top-ten/countries-with-highest-reported-crime-rates.html

          Sorry, but inconclusive and biased comments only prove your ignorance. Please, stop.. you are not doing anything but proving nothing with garbage.

          If there is not at least collaborating evidence, it is only circumstantial, not facts.

          That holds true in Science, Law and intelligence.

          Just because YOU believe it, does not make it true, no different than just because someone believes there is a God, is not true…

          • bizbird6

            Religious People Branded As Less Intelligent Than
            Atheists In Provocative New Study

            The Huffington Post | By Macrina Cooper-White
            Posted: 08/14/2013 3:48 pm EDT | Updated: 08/15/2013
            11:47 am EDT 9

            That’s the provocative conclusion of a new review of 63 studies of intelligence and religion that span the past century. The meta-analysis showed that in 53 of the studies, conducted between 1928 to 2012, there was an inverse relation between religiosity — having religious beliefs, or performing religious rituals — and intelligence. That is, on average, non-believers scored higher than religious people on intelligence tests.

            What might explain the effect?

            Scientists behind studies included in the review most often suggested that “religious beliefs are irrational, not anchored in science, not
            testable and, therefore, unappealing to intelligent people who ‘know better.’”

            But the researchers who conducted the new meta-analysis say the answer is a bit more complicated. They suspect intelligent people might have less of a “need” for religion.

            “Intelligence may also lead to greater self-control ability,
            self-esteem, perceived control over life events, and supportive relationships,
            obviating some of the benefits that religion sometimes provides,” study
            co-author Jordan Silberman, a graduate student of neuroeconomics at the
            University of Rochester, told The Huffington Post in an email.

            So if you’re a believer, does this mean you’re a dope?

            “I’m sure there are intelligent religious people and unintelligent atheists out there,” Silberman said in the email. “The findings pertain to the average intelligence of religious and non-religious people, but they don’t necessarily apply to any single
            person. Knowing that a person is religious would not lead me to bet any money
            on whether or not the person is intelligent.”

            The researchers acknowledge the limitations of the meta-analysis. It did not look at type of religion, for example, or at the role culture might play in the interaction between religiosity and intelligence.

            In addition, The Independent pointed out that the researchers used a narrow definition of intelligence. In the paper, intelligence is defined as “the ability to reason, plan, solve problems, think abstractly, comprehend complex ideas, learn quickly, and learn from experience.” This excludes other forms of intelligence, like creative and emotional intelligence.

            The meta-analysis was published in Personality and Social Psychology Review.

            Quick Poll

            What do you think about the study’s bold claim?

            I’m a total believer in the study –it makes a lot of sense.

            56.22%

            I have no faith in the study’s findings — believers are just as smart as non-believers.

            15.81%

            It’s just researchers playing with statistics — it doesn’t apply to individual people.

            28 %

          • bizbird6

            In what way is it NOT true??

            There are TONS of Collaborating Evidence! And it is NOT “Circumstantial!

            It is the TRUTH, the WHOLE TRUTH, and NOTHING but the WHOLE TRUTH!

            The only thing that is NOT true is the phony Bible!

    • Judy

      Bible verses are worthless???? Yep, you’ve NEVER even read the Bible. God says Scripture given out will NEVER return void. I daresay, thousands have come to the Lord by just a Bible verse or two.

      • bizbird6

        You ignore my Questions!!

        God NOT only murdered the “WICKED”, but he also murdered INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS of the NOAH FLOOD, the INNOCENT Children and INFANTS of the Sodom and Gomorrah, and the INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANT of the Canaanites. Also God murdered the INNOCENT EGYPTIAN FIRST BORN.

        Even if those that God murdered are wicked (which I TOTALLY DOUBTED), the the INNOCENT CHILDREN OF THOSE “WICKED” DOES NOT DESERVE TO DIE.

        IMMAGINE, a SIX year old child being KILLED BY God, OR a YEAR OLD CHILD BEING KILLED by GOD, or a 2 MONTHS OLD INFANT being killed by God.

        What justification do you have of ALL GOOD and ALL Just God murdering INNOCENT?

        I refuse to go another step until you ANSWER MY QUESTIONS!!! You keep evading my questions and keep on trying to change the subject!!!

        1

  • bizbird6

    Christianity is declining all over the world:

    The Country that is of specific interest is Sweden, because the USA tend for follow the Norms of Sweden is in a few decades. If you see, 65% of the population no longer belong to any religion. Compare that to the number about 100 years ago when some 90% to 95% of Sweden’s populations were Christians.

    Data from Wiki Encyclopedia:

    Irreligious
    & Atheist

    See also: Irreligion by country

    Countries with the greatest proportion of people without religion (including Agnostics and Atheists) from Irreligion by country (as of 2007):

    1.
    Japan 64–88% (76%)[122]

    2.
    Sweden 46–85% (65.5%)

    3.
    Vietnam 44%–81% (62.5%)

    4.
    Denmark 43–80% (61.5%)

    5.
    Macau 60.9%[60]

    6.
    Czech
    Republic 54–61%
    (57.5%)

    7.
    Hong
    Kong 57%[51]

    8.
    France 43–64%[123] (53.5%)

    9.
    Norway 31–72% (51.5%)

    10.
    Estonia 49%

    11.
    Netherlands 39–55% (47%)

    12.
    Finland 28–60% (44%)

    13.
    United
    Kingdom 31–52%
    (41.5%)[123] (25% England and Wales)[124]

    14.
    South
    Korea 30–52%
    (41%)

    15.
    Germany 25[125]-55%[126] (40%)

    16.
    Hungary 32–46% (39%)

    17.
    Belgium 42–43% (38.75%)

    18.
    New Zealand 34.7%[127]

    19.
    Bulgaria 34–40% (37%)

    20.
    Slovenia 35–38% (36.5%)

    21.
    Russia[128] 13–48% (30.5%)

  • bizbird6

    This is from Huffington Post and is another evidence Christianity is declining all over the world.

    Hard Evidence: Is Christianity Dying in Britain?

    Posted on November 30, 2013 by Trite Static

    Like an Old Testament prophet telling the Israelites that they
    were doomed, Lord Carey has been warning Anglicans for years of
    their possible annihilation. The Church is “one generation away from
    extinction,” he declares. The reality is less dramatic, but the story is not
    altogether wrong.

    Young adults in Britain are far less likely than their parents
    and grandparents to have a religious identity. The Church of England in
    particular has been squeezed hard by the trend away from religion. This is well
    illustrated by the graphic below which shows religious affiliation by year of
    birth. In the oldest group polled, one in two identified as members of the
    Church of England – among the youngest that figure falls to one in 20.

    Source: British Social Attitudes survey 1983-2010, pooled. Based on work by Siobhan McAndrew for British Religion in Numbers. 55

    • Judy

      It’s very hard to take a person seriously when they quote the ‘Huffington Puffington’ Post. Seriously.
      Unsaved people that are leaving the churches and Catholics that are leaving their churches have NOTHING to do with Christians and Christianity.
      Btw, I did a bit of research on Earl J. Doherty. What a joke. He has only a bachelor’s degree in Ancient History and Classical Languages, no completed advanced degrees in anything. My minister , Dr. Doug McIntosh, is a Greek and Hebrew Scholar.
      Doherty only has a basic knowledge of Hebrew and Greek, plus some Latin, which is a dead language you know.
      Like I said before NO ONE can be a Bible expert UNLESS they are saved by the grace of God. Duh.

      • bizbird6

        But Doherty has studied the Bible with an impartial and Scientific eye. In addition, the Bible was written in Greek and Hebrew, so this is more than enough!

        Have you actually read Doherty’s books? I bet you haven’t, have you? You judged based only on his degrees.

        Why don’t you read Bart Ehrman also. Bart has MANY, MANY Degrees, and these degree were from the right places too! He has written over 20 books on the Bible. Look him up in the Internet and Wiki. and then read his books. You will be amazed about what you will find.

      • bizbird6

        What is God doesn’t exist? How can you test it to find the TRUTH?

      • bizbird6

        Huffington Post is a good Reliable Newspaper!

        You discount anything that report negatively about what you think.

        I trust Huffington Post a Millions times more than you and your Minister.

      • bizbird6

        I would junk Christianity, Christ, and the Bible ENTIRELY!!!!

        You should NOT take a 2,000 year old document and virtually build your whole life over it. You form your whole Moral Belief, your whole life’s directions, and use that for your own Religion.

        Myself, I would just junk anything older that a few hundred of years and form my moral belief on CONTEMPORARY Science, Contemporary thinking, and CONTEMPORARY Values.

        In terms of Bart Ehrman, since the USA still has Christianity as a majority Religious Belief, a writer can make a LOT more money selling books that support the Christian Belief than oppose it.

        My Ehrman spend his entire LIFE writing about the Bible and written over 20 books on the Bible and it is only RECENTLY that his books has become popular. His earlier books got him virtually NOTHING.

        If you want to make your living writing books on the Bible, supporting an unpopular idea is NOT the way to go about it.

        Most writers about God, Christianity, and the Bible NEVER had to write some 20 books or so before making a splash in the literary world!

        Also I admire Mr. Ehrman for one other very IMPORTANT point. If you read his BIO, he was Born, Raised, and EDUCATED a Christian. And NOT only just the Christian Religion, but as a BORN AGAIN, EVANGELICAL Christian!

        So it must have taken him a lot of courage to finally renounce his lifelong belief and become an Agnostic.
        Think of all his LIFELONG Friends that probably broke with him because of his unpopular move,

        I just wonder if other persons can show the same courage. Can YOU show the same courage?

  • bizbird6

    Christianity DECLINING!!!!!!
    Here is another indication that Christianity is declining all over the World.

    Both England and France may have very few Christians left soon. Just think, just a century ago, 95% of the population were Christians. This is true almost all over Europe. America may follow also. Anyway, read below:

    Christianity: A Dying Religion in England and France

    TUESDAY, 03 SEPTEMBER 13 11:13 AM PDT

    The Catholic Bishop of Shrewsbury recently warned that
    Christians may soon become strangers in their own land. Rt Rev Mark Davies
    shared this message with more than 1000 Catholics during a five-day prayer fest
    that was organized in Norfolk.

    After recent data from the government revealed that Christians might emerge as a minority in Britain, Davies urged those in the audience to take a clear stand for their faith.

    According to the data shared by the bishop, most Britons would not refer to themselves as Christians by 2020 and close to 4000 churches are likely to shut down by the same year if the congregation continues to diminish at the existing rate. Davies is known to be one of the most outspoken critics of the British Government’s plans to legalize gay marriage.

    The Catholic Church in France too seems to be on its last legs.
    According to recent reports, more than a third of France’s general population and about two-thirds of France’s youth identify themselves with no religion. The same report suggests that only one in twenty people attend Mass regularly in the country.

    Father Innocent Feugna is an African minister and known for his work in northern France. He stated that his congregation is aging and gradually dying out too. Feugna pointed out that not only are church-goers growing old, but church officials are aging too.

    Since the average priest in France is 75 years old, foreigners are often imported when religious services need to be conducted. According to the deacon, the youth of France has different aspirations and their interests lie elsewhere.

    Douglas Yates, professor at the American Graduate School in Paris
    and assistant professor of political science at the American University of Paris
    has the same take on the changing scenario. According to him, Africans are
    replacing the native priests in France as they grow older. This trend is common
    in rural areas.

    As France has become more secular over the years, the Church
    has become eye-to-eye with atheists and agnostics. Yates substantiates the
    growing fear by saying, if the existing trend is to continue, the Catholic
    Church will indeed become a minority religion.

    • Judy

      Again you are talking about the Catholic churches declining; yes. But that nothing to do with Christians. Actually it’s sort of good news to Christians because we know the RCC is NOT Christian. There may be Christians in the RCC but the church itself is not of God. They will be part of the anti-Christ agenda. Actual born again Christians are growing in numbers not declining. A famous Christian writer says he believes the RCC was the biggest victory for satan. So really it’s good that they are losing members. Hopefully, they will convert to the real Christian church that is described in the New Testament.

      • bizbird6

        Sweden and England are NOT Catholic. They are Evangelical Christians, like you! And their Christian numbers are decreasing in a Flood. They are leaving the Christian Church in droves!

        • Judy

          Oh honey, if they were devout believers in God like me, they would not be leaving the faith. That’s just silly. Maybe they are pew-warmers or go to church to look good for their neighbors. True Christians know the truth and the truth has set us free.

          • bizbird6

            Yes, but they WERE Believers, but NOW they know BETTER!!!

          • bizbird6

            They WERE TRUE Believers, but NOT they know Better

            You should too!

      • bizbird6

        Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

        According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

        Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief and social well-being was published in the Journal of
        Religion & Society.

        Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

        Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior, Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage pregnancy than societies where many people profess belief in God.

        Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people – Japan is one of the least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

        (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both mothers and
        children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

        Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced that there is a
        deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do
        twice as badly as the others.
        Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000 people a year.

        At the other end of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of evolution (many believe it had a
        helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five
        times greater than in Europe and ten
        times higher than in Japan.

        All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

        At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals a different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will respect social customs and laws.

        All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.

        Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do
        not share their sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”, they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their priority becomes
        not the world they live in but themselves.

        The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior. Hence gun laws
        which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings who deserve protection, but as potential
        aggressors who deserve to die. And hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

        As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of unwanted
        pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit society as a whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I say”. The result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections.

        Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.

        Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal logic, no matter
        how absurd to outside observers.

        The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public discussion. Look no further
        than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime time television.

        Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere. As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory Paul’s study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you should tell them that God does not exist.”

        I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that God would be an atheist,

        i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies become secular. 4

        http://www.humaniststudies.org

      • bizbird6

        Did the Universe ever had a “Beginning”?

        Christians always argue that the reason that there is a God is that the Universe had a “Beginning” and that you needed a God to CREATE the Universe!

        Well, this article below says OTHERWISE, that the Universe is probably ETERNAL:

        Universe Measured With Near-Perfect Accuracy: Scientists Say It’s Probably Infinite, Flat, And Eternal

        By Ben Wolford on January 9, 2014 3:29 PM EST

        Scientists announced Thursday that they’ve pretty much figured out the universe, unlocking potential clues to mysterious “dark energy;” bolstering theories that the universe is flat, eternal, and infinite; and mapping 1.3 million galaxies down to about 1 percent accuracy.
        All of this from an experiment that isn’t even done collecting data yet. It’s supposed to keep going until June.

        “We’ve done the analysis now because we have 90 percent of [the experiment's] final data, and we’re tremendously excited by the results,” says Martin White, chair of the survey team and physicist at the
        University of California, Berkeley. They announced the findings Thursday and have submitted their paper for publication with the journal Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society. The team has good reason to be excited: no one has ever mapped the universe so accurately. As team leader David Schlegel put it, “I now know the size of the universe better than I know the size of my house.”

        They did it using a high-powered telescope at the Apache Point Observatory in New Mexico, which, for almost five years, has been hunting deep space for galaxies. Some of them are more than 6 billion light-years away and, therefore, at least as many years old (FYI, a light-year is a distance, equal to about 5.9 trillion miles). They say it may be the largest collection of redshift galaxies (galaxies moving away from us) ever compiled.

        By comparison, the new Hubble photo of deep space, said to capture the farthest reaches yet, only shows galaxies 3.5 billion light-years from earth.

        With that information, the physicists looked for clusters of galaxies called Baryon acoustic oscillations, or baryons, which arrange themselves in circles around a central cluster. They’re basically caused by pressure ripples from
        when the universe was formed about 13.4 billion years ago, which cooled and froze. In this case, they proved useful because the radius of each cluster is always the same. In effect, they are a 500-million-light-years-long measuring tape.

        The scientists translated the data into a 3-D map of the
        universe. What they discovered is that the universe is “flat” — not in the two-dimensional sense, but in the physicist jargon sense. That is, its shape adheres to principles of basic fourth-grade geometry: A triangle’s angles add up to 180 degrees, and that kind of thing. Here’s the cool part about that: “One of the reasons we care is that a flat universe has implications for whether the universe is infinite,”

        Schlegel says in the news release. “That means — while we can’t say with certainty that it will never come to an end — it’s likely the universe extends forever in space and will go on FOREVER in TIME. Our results are consistent with an infinite universe.”

        That said, there will always be dissenting voices. These physicists in Denmark say the universe could die at any moment, and that this outcome is more likely that
        previously thought. “Maybe the collapse has already started somewhere in the universe, and right now it is eating its way into the rest of the universe,” they said. “Maybe a collapse is starting right now, right here. Or maybe it will start far away from here in a billion years. We do not know.”

        8

  • bamared2222

    There were many people in churches. There is a world of difference between church members and Christians. There will be fewer Christians now because when people must stand up and confess their faith in a time of persecution, many church members will run for the back door!

    • bizbird6

      Yes, but there are hardly any Christians left either!

      The church is empty!!

      Christians have disappeared completely and there are only Non-Believers left!

      • Judy

        What churches are you talking about? Catholics? Baptist? I see crusades all over the et where thousands upon thousands are coming forward and accepting Jesus (God) as their Lord and Savior. Billy Graham hd thousands in his. In countries where the people are not free are not going to put it online that they are believers now. They know they could be killed. Go to persecution.com or martyrs.com and see for yourself. But, the bottom line is billions (like Islam) won’t be going to heaven. God is NOT sending them to hell; they are sending themselves by not accepting Jesus as their Savior.

        • bizbird6

          So you are smarter than all of us? You know better than all of us? How? What makes you more right than the rest of the world? What you see is just a small closet of the world!.

          You should see the whole picture!! And the whole picture is a declining Christianity where people are leaving in droves!

          You need to read those Bible Experts, like Bart Ehrman, Earl Doherty, and Bishiop Spong who sees the Bible is a completely false and Phony. Look up those three Bible Experts in Wiki and then read their wonderful books which will open your eyes!

          • Judy

            People answer you specially and you just ignore it and post the same thing over and over. Born again Christians are NOT leaving the faith! Catholics are but they’re NOT Christians according to the Christian Bible.
            I told you earlier the Bible verses that say WIDE is the gate to destruction (no belief in Jesus) and NARROW is the gate to life with God. When people answer your questions and you ignore them and type out the same junk over again, it kind of makes you look foolish.
            I never said I was smarter than anyone else. I am merely telling you the truth as I KNOW it. God let’s His children (believers in him) know they are on the right track when we pray to God and ask Jesus to come and take control of our lives, hearts and souls. I have said before, Christianity is NOT an exclusive club! It is open to ANYONE that sincerely accepts Jesus.

          • bizbird6

            Yes, but I and Thousands and Millions of people are NOT accepting Christianity. The reason is that we know that that God, and Jesus is Phony and , and the Bible is “junk”.

          • bizbird6

            You ignore my Questions!!

            God NOT only murdered the “WICKED”, but he also murdered INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS of the NOAH FLOOD, the INNOCENT Children and INFANTS of the Sodom and Gomorrah, and the INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANT of the Canaanites. Also God murdered the INNOCENT EGYPTIAN FIRST BORN.

            Even if those that God murdered are wicked (which I TOTALLY DOUBTED), the the INNOCENT CHILDREN OF THOSE “WICKED” DOES NOT DESERVE TO DIE.

            IMMAGINE, a SIX year old child being KILLED BY God, OR a YEAR OLD CHILD BEING KILLED by GOD, or a 2 MONTHS OLD INFANT being killed by God.

            What justification do you have of ALL GOOD and ALL Just God murdering INNOCENT?

            I refuse to go another step until you ANSWER MY QUESTIONS!!! You keep evading my questions and keep on trying to change the subject!!!

        • bizbird6

          By the way, if you read Earl Doherty, you will read that Christ NEVER existed!!

          In fact I challenge and dare you to read Earl Doherty’s “The Jesus Puzzle”. You can read about him in Wiki.

          Earl J. Doherty (born 1941)[1] is a Canadian author of The Jesus Puzzle (1999), Challenging the Verdict (2001), and Jesus: Neither God Nor Man (2009). Doherty argues for a version of the Christ myth theory, the thesis that Jesus did not exist as an historical figure.

        • bizbird6

          I read that Islam says that Christians who refuse to abandon their Christian faith and convert to Islam will go DIRECTLY to Hell!

          Wouldn’t it be funny if you find yourself in Hell someday after all?

          What proof do you have the Christianity is True and Islam is FALSE? Most Muslims say the opposite!

          • Judy

            I have the Qu’ran. They teach that when a muslin believer meets and unbeliever, he is to do one of three things. He is to convert him to Islam, tax him or KILL HIM. And THAT’S how I know they are from satan.
            The proof to me that there is a God (and only One) and that Jesus is absolutely the real deal. I have been a born again, devout, Christian for over half of my life. Studied dozens of Christian authors, studied the Bible in depth and have a minister that is a Greek and Hebrew Scholar. God has proved Himself to me too many times to count. I’d be glad to tell you some of the things if you really want to know.

          • bizbird6

            Yes, but Christian God is NO BETTER!!!

            Look at how the Christian God KILLED THOUSANDS AND MILLIONS, both WICKED and INNOCENT, in Noah’s Flood, in Sodom, in Canaan, and the Egyptian First Born.

            I am curious sometimes which God has KILLED MORE, the CHRISTIAN God or the Islamic God?

            And the WORST thing is that both Gods are HYPOCRITES!!

            Both claimed to be a Religion of “LOVE”, yet they MURDERED each other and others by the THOUSANDS and maybe MILLIONS!

        • bizbird6

          Here is another person that you should look up in Wiki and also read his many books!

          John Shelby Spong

          Retired American Bishop of the Episcopal Church

          Gospel of John: What Everyone Should Know About The Fourth Gospel

          Posted: 06/11/2013 12:09pm

          Almost any poll of regular church goers will reveal that their favorite book in the New Testament is the Gospel of John. It is the book that is most often used at Christian funerals. It includes such well known and oft-quoted texts as: “God so
          loved the world that he gave his only son that whoever believes in him should
          not perish but have everlasting life.” It boasts the shortest verse in the
          Bible: “Jesus wept,” which serves the needs of many cross word puzzle
          creators. Its prologue was used for centuries in Catholic liturgies as
          “the last gospel” at the mass. It includes characters like Doubting
          Thomas, whose very name has entered our public discourse.

          Yet, I suspect that if these devotees of John’s Gospel were introduced to the world of Johannine scholarship, they would be both shocked and angered by contemporary insights into this treasured book. It is to place much of this scholarship into the public arena that I have written the book, “The Fourth Gospel: Tales of a Jewish Mystic.”

          Among the conclusions that I have reached in my intensive five-year-long study
          of John’s Gospel are these:

          1) There is no way that the Fourth Gospel was written by John Zebedee or by any of the disciples of Jesus. The author of this book is not a single individual, but is at least three different writers/editors, who did their layered work over a period of 25
          to 30 years.

          2) There is probably not a single word attributed to Jesus in this book that the Jesus of history actually spoke. This includes all the “I Am” sayings and all of the
          “Farewell Discourses.”

          3) Not one of the signs (the Fourth Gospel’s word for miracles) recorded in this book was, in all probability, something that actually happened. This means that Jesus never changed water into wine, fed a multitude with five loaves and two fish or raised Lazarus from the dead.

          4) Many of the characters who appear in the pages of the Fourth Gospel are literary creations of its author and were never intended to be understood as real people, who actually lived in history. This includes Nathaniel, who is introduced with great fanfare in chapter one and is treated in John’s Gospel as one of
          “the Twelve,” as well as the enigmatic character called by the Fourth
          Gospel “the disciple whom Jesus loved,” who is introduced in Chapter
          13 and who stars in this narrative from then on up to and including the
          resurrection event. Between those two “bookend” characters, we run
          into such well-known figures as Nicodemus, the Samaritan woman by the well, the
          man crippled for 38 years and the man born blind, none of whom has ever been
          mentioned before in any written Christian source and each of whom in all
          probability is nothing more than the literary creation of the author.

          5) John’s Gospel seems to ridicule anyone who might read this book as a work of literal history. For example, Jesus says to Nicodemus: “You must be born again.”
          Nicodemus, the literalist, says: “Born again? I am a grown man! How can I
          crawl back into my mother’s womb and be born again?”
          Jesus says to the Samaritan woman: “If you know the gift of God, and who it is that is saying to you ‘Give me a drink,’ you would have asked him and he would give you living water.” The Samaritan woman, a literalist, responds: “Man, you
          don’t even have a bucket!”

          6) The Gospel also exaggerates its details, once more I believe, to counter any attempt to read it literally. For example, Jesus does not just turn water into wine, he turns it into 150 gallons of wine! Jesus does not just give sight to a blind man, he gives sight to a man born blind! Jesus does not just raise a person from the dead, he raises one who has been dead and even buried for four days, one who is still bound in grave clothes and one who, according to the King James translation “already stinketh” with the odor of decaying flesh!

          Finally this book will challenge the way the Fourth Gospel has been used in Christian history as the guarantor of what came to be called Christian orthodoxy or creedal Christianity. The Council of Nicea in 325 C.E. leaned on the Fourth Gospel as literal history in order to formulate the creeds and ultimately to undergird uch doctrines as the Incarnation and the Holy Trinity.

          The texts used to support that creedal development, my studies have led me to affirm, have nothing to do with an external God entering humanity in the person of Jesus, but are rather attempts to describe the experience of the human breaking the boundaries of consciousness and entering into the transformation available inside a sense of a mystical oneness with God. If that is so, then the Fourth Gospel has the potential to become the primary biblical source upon the basis of which Christianity can be changed dramatically to speak with radical freshness to the 21st century.

          Christianity is not about the divine becoming human so much as it is about the human becoming divine. That is a paradigm shift of the first order.

          These are the conclusions to which my study of John’s Gospel has led me, and they are the conclusions that I explore and document in this book “The Fourth Gospel: Tales of a Jewish Mystic.”1

        • bizbird6

          ..

    • bizbird6

      Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

      According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

      Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief and social well-being was published in the Journal of
      Religion & Society.

      Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

      Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior, Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage pregnancy than societies where many people profess belief in God.

      Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people – Japan is one of the least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

      (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both mothers and
      children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

      Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced that there is a
      deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do
      twice as badly as the others.
      Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000 people a year.

      At the other end of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of evolution (many believe it had a
      helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five
      times greater than in Europe and ten
      times higher than in Japan.

      All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

      At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals a different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will respect social customs and laws.

      All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.

      Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do
      not share their sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”, they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their priority becomes
      not the world they live in but themselves.

      The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior. Hence gun laws
      which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings who deserve protection, but as potential
      aggressors who deserve to die. And hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

      As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of unwanted
      pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit society as a whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I say”. The result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections.

      Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.

      Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal logic, no matter
      how absurd to outside observers.

      The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public discussion. Look no further
      than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime time television.

      Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere. As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory Paul’s study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you should tell them that God does not exist.”

      I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that God would be an atheist,

      i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies become secular. 8

      http://www.humaniststudies.org

      • Mark Daniel Johansen

        That’s an excellent point. Societies where the government was officially atheist have all been models of human rights. Consider France under Robespierre, perhaps the first atheist society in history. Aside from the Big Terror and the Little Terror and the guillotine, it was an almost perfect society. In the 20th century we had Stalin’s Soviet Union and Mao’s China. Idealic societies of peace and freedom. And who can forget Pol Pot’s Cambodia? As long as you weren’t a Christian or an intellectual or middle class, you probably wouldn’t have been starved to death in a labor camp. In the 21st century we have North Korea. I imagine it must be tough on the North Korean government to keep out all those people banging on the doors trying to get in to that Utopia.

        • bizbird6

          How do you North Korea Kim is Atheistic? What do you or most people know about the private life of Kim?

          Many people once called Hitler and Stalin atheistic but when we studied their lives in detail, we find they ARE VERY RELIGIOUS but in their own way! They are in NO WAY Raised or Professed Atheistic!

          For example Stalin wanted to be a priest when he was a child and Hitler was a life long Catholic!

        • bizbird6

          Hitler
          said he was a catholic and he was never excommunicated from the Catholic Church.
          Some Hitler quotes:

          “I am now as before a Catholic and will always remain so.”— Adolf
          Hitler, to Gen. Gerhard Engel, 1941

          “I believe today that my conduct is in accordance with the will of the
          Almighty Creator.”— Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf, p. 46

          “I am convinced that I am acting as the agent of our Almighty Creator. By
          fighting the Jews, I am doing the Lord’s work.”— Adolf Hitler, ibid. p. 65

          “This human world of ours would be inconceivable without the practical
          existence of a religious belief.”— Adolf Hitler, ibid. p 152

          You can’t call Hitler not a Christian, because that’s not your call.

          “If all the Christians who have called other Christians ‘not really a
          Christian’ were to vanish, there’d be no Christians left.” – Anonymous.

        • bizbird6

          Robespierre and Stalin, by the way , were BOTH raised as Christians, but their Christian upbringing did them no good!

          The WORST upbringing is to raise them as good Christians, and they’ll end up as Stalin or Hitler!!!

          If you want to raise people to end as good people, you raise them to be GOOD ATHEIST!

          END of STORY!!!

          • Mark Daniel Johansen

            So if a Christian does something evil, this is the fault of Christianity. If an atheist does something evil, this is the fault of Christianity. Because, what, the person heard Christian ideas somewhere along the line, so even though he completely rejected those ideas, maybe even actively fought against them, somehow Christianity is still to blame. Sorry, no, that makes no sense.

          • bizbird6

            Sorry, but what you say is absolutely Baloney!!

            The people that we are talking about is not just someone that “heard Christian ideas somewhere along the line” at all! We are talking about people who were raised a
            Christian, who believed in Christianity enough to want to be a priest, and even ended up being a life long Christian. Christians accuse anyone that they don’t like as being Atheists!

            By the way, Robespierre was never an Atheist, not even for one day or one minute even! This is what Robespierre
            said: “God created the universe to proclaim His power. He
            created men to help each other, to love each other mutually, and to attain to happiness by the way of virtue.”

            The whole problem is that Christianity is a TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE Religion to use as a moral base!!!

            Why??

            Because the God that Christian worship was himself an EVIL MONSTER!

            Why?

            You heard about Noah’s Ark have you NOT? God sent 40 days of rain to commit Genocide and wipe out virtually the whole human race! And how did the Christians justify such an EVIL deed? Christians claimed that God was justified because Mankind was “Wicked”.

            But did God murdered only the “Wicked”? NO! NOT AT ALL. God killed Men, women, AND CHILDREN!!!

            That is right, God MURDERED INNOCENT CHILDREN!! The CHILD could be a 5 year old CHILD, a 3 year old CHILD, or even a 1 YEAR OLD INFANT!!

            How could children be guilty of WICKEDNESS? You have to at least reach the age of consent to be guilty of anything.

            There is probably NOT one country in the whole world that would convict a one year old child guilty of anything.

            Yet God acted as JUDGE , JURY, and EXECUTIONER in murdering THOUSANDS and maybe even MILLIONS of INNOCENT CHILDREN in the story of Noah’s ARK!

            And that is NOT just an ISOLATED case. God did the same in Sodom and Gomorrah, where he murdered thousands of INNOCENT CHILDREN there also.

            Also among the Canaanites, INNOCENT CHILDREN were victims too!

            And You heard of the “First born Egyptians” (of Moses), which God murdered thousands and thousands just to teach the stubborn Egyptian Pharaoh a Lesson?
            So what were these “First Born Egyptians” guilty of? They did absolutely nothing to deserved to be killed by God!

            If God really wanted to play it “Wise”, all he had to do was to kill the stubborn Pharaoh, not a lot of INNOCENTS who
            has no say at all in the ancient dictatorial Egyptian government.

            Or he could have just sent his Angels to kidnap the Pharaoh and forced the Pharaoh to obey the will of God! (Of course, the Pharaoh had Bodyguards, but the Angels of Omnipotent God couldn’t overcome them?)

            See, those are the reasons that Christianity is WRONG,
            WRONG, WRONG!!! And they based their moral standards on the WRONG God! They worshiped the WRONG GOD!

            The God Christians worshiped was worse than Hitler, Stalin, Attila, or Genghis Khan.

  • bizbird6

    However, if you Christians feel lonely about being alone, then just abandon your Christian Nonsense and join us Non-Believers.

    We’ll all have lots of fun together!!

  • bizbird6

    Mankind does NOT NEED GOD and Christianity as a MORAL BASE!!!!

    Why?

    Let me prove it to you!!!! AGAIN, LET ME PROVE IT TO YOU!!

    Non Religious countries do much better and are successful

    Post 1: Tue Jun 26, 2012 3:26 pm

    I will argue that non-religious democratic countries are the best places to live in the world. I will concentrate on Scandinavia that is all democratic and very non-religious. Many Americans argue that if America will be less religious then everything will fall down and the society will be lost.

    As you will see in my post I have one theme……If God exists (which I don’t believe) he sure does hate religious countries.

    Here are the richest countries in the world in GDP (gross domestic product) per person for 2011:

    Ranking, Country on US Dollars”

    1 Luxembourg 122,272

    2 Qatar 97,967

    3 Norway 96,591

    4 Switzerland 84,983

    5 Australia 66,984

    6 United Arab Emirates 66,625

    7 Denmark 63,003

    8 Sweden 61,098

    9 Netherlands 51,410

    10 Canada 51,147

    11 Singapore 50,714

    12 Austria 50,504

    13 Finland 50,090

    14 Ireland 48,517

    15 United States 48,147

    16 Belgium 48,110

    17 Kuwait 46,461

    18 Japan 45,774

    19 Germany 44,558

    20 France 44,401

    1. Out of the top 20 countries in the list above, 14 belong to the top 25 most atheists countries in the world. Among the countries that are not part of the top 25 non-religious country is of course USA.

    Here are the top 4 non-religious countries in the world:

    1. Sweden – up to 85% atheists – Sweden is leading the world in aid to “poor” countries when looking at giving aid in percent of GDP, Sweden is ranked number one in the world in IT technology, has the most women in the equivalent to the Unites States congress plus many other positive
    ranks.

    2. Denmark – 80% atheist or agnostics. Basically has the same numbers as Sweden with the most aid to poor countries in percentage of GDP. Leader in
    “happiest country” in the world.

    3. Norway – 72% Atheists or agnostics. Once again Norway is really similar to Sweden and Denmark in all the stats about freedom, technology and that the people are satisfied with their life.

    4. Finland – 70% Atheists or agnostics. Has the highest school results of the western world in test results for math, reading (The test is called PISA)

    Other countries in the top 25 most atheistic countries include:

    Japan 65% atheists – Good economy histrionically and has created many high tech things.

    South Korea – 52% Atheists This country is growing and growing and will soon have the same GDP per capital as most western nations.

    • Judy

      You are basing your belief that there is no God because countries that pretty much deny God do well financially? The Bible NEVER said that only countries that believe in Him will prosper. Some of the most evil people 9in the world were wealthy! Duh. Hitler, Saddam Hussein, and George Soros come to mind. But there are many listed in the Old Testament; kings that were evil and rich. And how did they all end up? In hell. Pretty sick that you hold money to be the thing most cherished. Are you familiar with Sodom and Gomorrah? How about the Roman Empire? Even the Vatican is very wealthy, but isn’t Christian.

      • bizbird6

        It is NOT only that these Nations are wealthy, but they are low in crime and high in education.

        And they are very generous too! They are among the highest charity donation rate in the world.

        They are just good people!

        That is why they don’t need Christianity which just corrupts everything.

      • bizbird6

        Most generous countries when it comes to giving aid to poor countries (percent of GDP) – 8 out of top 10 are the most Atheistic :

        Sweden – 1.12%

        Norway – 1.06%

        Luxembourg – 1.04%

        Denmark – 0.88%

        Netherlands – 0.82%

        Belgium – 0.55%

        Finland – 0.54%

        Ireland – 0.54%

        United Kingdom – 0.52%

        France- 0.47%

        Spain – 0.46%

        Switzerland – 0.45%

        Germany – 0.35%

        Canada – 0.30%

        Austria – 0.30%

        Australia – 0.29%

        New Zealand – 0.28%

        Portugal – 0.23%

        United States – 0.21%

        Greece – 0.19%

        Japan – 0.18%

        Italy – 0.16%

        South Korea – 0.10%

        In the American debates they argue that USA
        gives to much aid but they give much less than other rich countries. Remember
        that USA is placed 15 when counting the wealth of a country (GDP per capita)

        • tina v

          Biz bird, hey, you know this country was founded on Christianity from all those countries you mentioned came over here to escape persecution and practice their religion freely. You should read lee strobel’s book. He used to be atheist and in trying to convince his wife that Jesus did not exist, ended up proving himself wrong.

          • bizbird6

            Since you are “SuperDave” and a Christian, why don’t you answer this question:

            God committed GENOCIDE in Noah’s ARK, he murdered NOT only MEN, Women, but CHILDREN and INFANTS. Christians claimed to justify God’s action by saying that Mankind deserved to be killed because mankind was “WICKED”.

            But how about the CHILDREN and INFANTS? Were they “Wicked” also?
            How many countries would convict a CHILD that has NOT yet reached the age of reason? Yet Why did God MURDERED that CHILD ANYWAY?

            Just think, a 6 year old CHILD murdered by God for Wickedness? Or a 3 year old CHILD, or a ONE year OLD BABY? ALL MURDERED by God because of “WICKEDNESS”??

            And that is just the tip of the Iceberg!!

            How about the CHILDREN and BABIES of SODOM? OR the CHILDREN and BABIES of CANAAN?

            And even WORSE, how about God MURDERING the INNOCENT FIRST BORN of MOSES’s Egypt? What Evil did these INNOCENTS FIRST BORN do to be deserving of being MURDERED by the EVIL GOD?

            None at all, God just wanted to teach the Stubborn Pharaoh a lesson!

            But wasn’t there better and more humane way to get the job done?
            Couldn’t God have just killed the Stubborn Pharaoh instead of thousands of INNOCENTS FIRST BORN?

            Another more humane alternative was just to kidnap the pharaoh and force the Pharaoh to change his mind! (Of course the Pharaoh had Body Guards, but Omnipotent God and the Angels could NOT overcome those?)

            The ironic thing is that ANCIENT Egypt of Moses time was NOT even a DEMOCRACY! The people had no real say in the decisions of the Pharaoh!
            So, why punish the INNOCENT Egyptian people?

            The people there was probably like the people today in any country, full of divergent opinions on every issue! So, no way was Gods Murderous action on the INNOCENT Egyptian people justified!

            So Christian GOD is a BLOOD THIRSTY EVIL MONSTER???

          • bizbird6

            The entire Western World is based on Roman-Greek Civilization, including Western Democracy!!!

            However, does that mean that we have to worship ZEUS??

            Of course, NOT!!!

            I say, let us accept whatever Christian roots or contributions that it has to offer, but REJECT COMPLETELY the CHRISTIAN GOD, which is an EVIL MONSTER that has murdered THOUSANDS AND MILLIONS.

            Christian Apologists are all flawed because they lack two main virtually IMPORTANT components, the knowledge of the Bible in its ORIGINAL Language and significant interests in Science!!!

      • bizbird6

        This is from “Transparency International”.

        Least corrupt countries in the world. The most Atheistic countries on top (9 out of these 10 countries are most atheistic)

        1. New Zealand

        1. Denmark

        1. Finland

        4. Sweden

        5. Singapore

        6. Norway

        7. Netherlands

        8. Australia

        8. Switzerland

        10. Canada

      • bizbird6

        Which Countries are among the SMARTEST in the World???

        If you look down the list, you will find that most of them are ATHEISTIC Countries!

        The Smartest Countries in the World?

        By Michael Schreiber | Credit.com – 3 hours ago

        The United States may have the lion’s share of the cash, but when it comes to brains, we don’t even crack the top 10, according to one recent report. In a ranking of the countries with the highest IQs conducted by StatisticsBrain.com, the United States placed 19th with an average IQ of 98, tied with Norway, Mongolia and — gasp — France (which perhaps explains that country’s reported love of Jerry Lewis). The top spot goes to Hong Kong, while 10th place is shared by two European countries, Sweden and Switzerland, which evidently many people think are one and the same.

        Intelligence Around the Globe

        According to the study, here are the

        top 10 smartest countries in the world:

        # 10: Sweden and Switzerland

        (two-way tie), average IQ: 101

        #6: Netherlands, Italy, Germany and

        Austria (four-way tie), average IQ: 102

        #5: Singapore, average IQ: 103

        #4: Taiwan, average IQ: 104

        #3: Japan, average IQ: 105

        #2: South Korea, average IQ: 106

        #1: Hong Kong, average IQ: 107

        [We decided that it’s not worth sharing the “dumbest” countries in the world, mainly because some consider IQ to be flawed as an objective measure of intelligence, and would therefore be arguably ill-suited to this application.

      • bizbird6

        Which countries are among the Happiest?

        If you look down the list, you will find that those are also the most ATHEISTIC!!!

        Some interesting facts:

        This shows the most “happy” countries in the world in which Denmark (80% atheists) is on top. The religious countries are way down below. Of the top 10, 7 are in the most atheistic/agnostic countries.

        1. Denmark

        2. Switzerland

        3. Austria

        4. Iceland

        5. The Bahamas

        6. Finland

        7 Sweden

        8. Bhutan

        9. Brunei

        10. Canada

        Participants in the various studies were asked questions related to happiness and satisfaction with life. The meta-analysis is
        based on the findings of over 100 different studies around the world, which questioned 80,000 people worldwide. For this study data has also been analyzed in relation to health, wealth and access to education.

      • bizbird6

        Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

        According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

        Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief
        and social well-being was published in the Journal of Religion & Society.
        Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

        Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior,
        Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage pregnancy than societies where many people profess belief in God.

        Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people – Japan is one of the least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates
        of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

        (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both mothers and children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

        Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty
        percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced that there is a deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do twice as badly as the others. Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000 people a year.

        At the other end of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of evolution (many believe it had a helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five times greater than in Europe and ten times higher than in Japan.

        All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and
        antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

        At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals a different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will respect social customs and laws.

        All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.
        Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or
        “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do not share their
        sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”,
        they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their
        priority becomes not the world they live in but themselves.

        The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior. Hence gun laws which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings who deserve protection, but as potential aggressors who deserve to
        die. And hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

        As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of unwanted pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit society as a whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them
        that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I
        say”. The result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections.

        Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.
        Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal logic, no matter how absurd to outside observers.

        The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public discussion. Look no further than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime time television.

        Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere. As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory Paul’s study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you should tell them that God does not exist.”

        I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that God would be an atheist,

        i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies
        become secular.

        http://www.humaniststudies.org

  • bizbird6

    Yes, I can prove that God is an EVIL MONSTER!!!

    I am using the Christianity’s own OWN Bible which is claimed is the entire Truthful word of God!!!

    God murdered thousands and maybe Millions of INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS who have done ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong.

    God Murdered INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS in Noah’s Flood, in Sodom and Gomorrah, in the Canaanites, and in the Egyptian First Born.

    And even worse, God did not need to do it because he is OMNIPOTENT! He could have adopted them and let them be raised by good families. Yet Evil God decided to murder them anyway and in cold blood!

    God is an EVIL MONSTER and anyone that worship such an EVIL MONSTER is so WRONG!!!!

    Besides, Mankind does NOT NEED a God. Mankind can stand on their own two feet and DO MUCH BETTER.

    Look at those countries that are overwhelmingly Atheistic, like Sweden, Denmark, Norway, Finland, Japan, Singapore, Taiwan, etc., etc.

    These countries are extremely successful and have extremely low crime rates.

    The whole world can follow the examples of those countries!

    • Tarheel_Soldier

      Bizbird,
      You know, Paul was vehemently against Jesus Christ, too. In fact, he served as a prosecutor for the early Christians. He was responsible for the deaths of dozens of early Christian disciples spreading the gospel of Jesus Christ. He did all of that until he was blinded, and then allowed to see by Jesus. Once he “saw” the truth and glory of Jesus Christ, he devoted the rest of his life to spreading the gospel. As a result of his epiphany, Paul was responsible for writing most of the New Testament through his letters to his fellow disciples. I hope you have the same kind of epiphany in your life, Bizbird. And just so you know, God is not about hate. He is all about love. Why else would He send His only Son to Earth to save us from ourselves? We are redeemed through our belief and acceptance of Christ.

      • bizbird6

        You NEED to READ Bart Ehrman’s books. Bart Ehrman said that many of Paul’s writing were NOT even written by him at all, but by IMPOSTORS writing under his name.

        Bart Ehrman is a Bible Expert that wrote over 20 books about the Bible. You need to look up Bart Ehrman BIO on Wiki.

        He spent his whole life studying on the Bible. In the end the concluded the whole Bible is a Fraud, with “Misquotes”, “Forgeries”, and “LIES”!

        Go ahead look up Bart Ehrman!

        • Tarheel_Soldier

          Thanks, Bizbird, but I think I’ll pass. I firmly beieve in God and His holy Son, Jesus Christ. If you don’t well, that’s entirely up to you. I hope and pray that God finds a way to work a miracle for you so you can be redeemed before it’s too late. He still loves you. Subconsciously, I think all this God-hate you are projecting is your way of trying to find out more about Him.
          Also, think about this, it is very easy to discredit anything, especially things that we can’t see with our Earthly eyes, How easy is it to pick apart a 3,000 year old document and point out things you can find fault in, especially if you can profit from it. Think about Mr. Ehrman’s motivation in writing his books. What purpose does he have in discrediting God and our Savior Jesus Christ, and the Bible? It is a much harder thing to have real faith and believe in something you can’t see. I can’t explain to you how much peace I find putting my full trust and faith in God.
          You are free to believe whatever you want. That is God’s greatest gift to Man, Free will. You can choose to rebuke Him if you want, but you are the one who is suffering for it. Good luck in the future, May God Bless you in some way that brings you closer to Him.

          • bizbird6

            Thanks for your input, but, of course, I disagree with you ENTIRELY!! You said that I should NOT take a 3,000 year old document that seriously, but look at you, you are WORSE!!!!

            You take a 2,000 year old document and virtually build your whole life over it. You form your whole Moral Belief, your whole life’s directions, and use that for your own Religion.

            Myself, I would just junk anything older that a few hundred of years and form my moral belief on CONTEMPORARY Science, Contemporary thinking, and CONTEMPORARY Values.

            In terms of Bart Ehrman, since the USA still has Christianity as a majority Religious Belief, a writer can make a LOT more money selling books that support the Christian Belief than oppose it.

            My Ehrman spend his entire LIFE writing about the Bible and written over 20 books the Bible and it is only RECENTLY that his books has become popular. His earlier books got him virtually NOTHING.

            If you want to make your living writing books on the Bible, supporting an unpopular idea is NOT the way to go about it.

            Most writers about God, Christianity, and the Bible NEVER had to write some 20 books or so before making a splash in the literary world!

            Also I admire Mr. Ehrman for one other very IMPORTANT point. If you read his BIO, he was Born, Raised, and EDUCATED a Christian. And NOT only the Christian Religion, but as a BORN AGAIN, EVANGELICAL Christian!

            So it must have taken him a lot of courage to finally renounce his lifelong belief and become an Agnostic.
            Think of all his LIFELONG Friends that probably broke with him because of his unpopular move,

            I just wonder if other persons can show the same courage. Can YOU show the same courage? Of course, I don’t know you that well, so I can NOT say.

          • bizbird6

            You need to read Earl Doherty. He claim that Christ NEVER
            existed!!

            From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:

            Earl Doherty

            http://www.jesuspuzzle.com

            Earl J. Doherty (born 1941)[1] is a Canadian author of The Jesus

            Puzzle (1999), Challenging the Verdict (2001), and Jesus: Neither

            God Nor Man (2009).

            Doherty
            argues for a version of the Christ myth theory, the thesis that Jesus did not
            exist as an historical figure.

          • bizbird6

            Predominantly Atheist
            Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

            According To
            Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

            Several weeks
            ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief and social well-being was published in the Journal of
            Religion & Society.

            Comparing 18
            prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author Gregory S Paul
            quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

            Drawing on a wide
            range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in God and
            acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior, Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of
            violence and teenage pregnancy than societies where many
            people profess belief in God.

            Top of the class,
            in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over eighty percent
            accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people
            – Japan is one of the least
            crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

            (Teenage
            pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with
            deprivation among both mothers and
            children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

            Next in line are
            the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in
            three are convinced that there is a
            deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do
            twice as badly as the others.
            Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000 people a year.

            At the other end
            of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of
            evolution (many believe it had a
            helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five
            times greater than in Europe and ten
            times higher than in Japan.

            All this
            information points to a strong correlation between faith and antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is
            good reason to suppose that
            religious belief does more harm than good.

            At first glance
            that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close
            inspection reveals a different
            story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely
            they will respect social customs and
            laws.

            All believers
            learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other
            responsibilities.

            Consciously or
            subconsciously, those who are “born again” or “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do
            not share their

            sect or their
            faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”, they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to
            reason. Their

            priority becomes
            not the world they live in but themselves.

            The more people
            prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of
            antisocial behavior. Hence gun laws
            which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings who deserve protection, but as potential
            aggressors who deserve to die. And
            hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

            As for sex… Faith
            encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In other countries, sex education includes contraception,
            reducing the risk of unwanted
            pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions
            that benefit society as a
            whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if
            you do what I say”. The
            result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted infections.

            Abstinence
            programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages
            unprejudiced analysis.

            Reasoning is subverted to
            rationalization that supports rather than questions assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that
            maintains an internal logic, no matter
            how absurd to outside observers.

            The
            constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate
            all public discussion. Look no further
            than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western nation would be
            dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime
            time television.

            Despite all its fine words, religion
            has brought in its wake little more than violence,
            prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere. As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his
            review of Gregory Paul’s study, “if you want
            people to behave as Christians advocate, you should tell them that God does not exist.”

            I might express that another way. The
            flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that God
            would be an atheist,

            i think this shatters the thinking
            that morality is lost when societies

            become secular.

            http://www.humaniststudies.org

          • tina v

            Biz bird, I hope you quit walking around in darkness. The only way for eternal life is through Jesus, son of God. Thanks for your respect.

          • bizbird6

            The Christian God is an EVIL MONSTER!!!

            I am using the Christianity’s own OWN Bible which is claimed is the entire Truthful word of God!!!

            God murdered thousands and maybe Millions of INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS who have done ABSOLUTELY nothing wrong.

            God Murdered INNOCENT CHILDREN and INFANTS in Noah’s Flood, in Sodom and Gomorrah, in the Canaanites, and in the Egyptian First Born.

            And even worse, God did not need to do it because he is OMNIPOTENT! He could have adopted them and let them be raised by good families. Yet Evil God decided to murder them anyway and in cold blood!

            God is an EVIL MONSTER and anyone that worship such an EVIL MONSTER is so WRONG!!!!

            Besides, Mankind does NOT NEED a God. Mankind can stand on their own two feet and DO MUCH BETTER.

          • bizbird6

            The Bible is worthless!!

            You need to read the Bible in its original language, which is what Bart Ehrman and Earl Doherty can do, The language is important because language makes a BIG difference.

            The Bible in another language is NOT the same as English, especially in the ORIGINAL language of the Bible.

            Why??? When the Bible was translated into English, King James got the best poets and writers in the English language to write up the Bible in the most beautiful language possible. Since he was a King, he was able to make the English Bible into a piece of poet beauty!

            That is why you are INSPIRED when you read the Bible, because it was DELIBERATELY written so that whoever reads it WILL BE INSPIRED!

            However, the Bible in the original language was NOTHING like that. In the original, you will conflicting forms, conflicting styles, and conflicting messages.

            The conflicting styles indicate that there were many, many writers, not just one. And even worse, the names were phony. Different people with different styles would use the same names.

            Anyway, you need to read the Bible Experts, like Bart Ehrman, Bishop Spong, Earl Doherty who can explain all these things much, much better than me. Why don’t you look up Bart Ehrman in Wiki which listed all his books?

          • amyl29

            those are the words of god.

          • tina v

            God destroyed whole cities because of their wicked and evil ways, that is why Jesus was born to absolve our sins, however, we are all sinners in the eyes of God, but if we just believe in him, you are more aware of your sins and as a believer, I try to do better and I just hope I get the chance to bring an atheist to Christ. Happy New Years to you and your family.

          • bizbird6

            Did the Universe ever had a “Beginning”?

            Christians always argue that the reason that there is a God is that the Universe had a “Beginning” and that you needed a God to CREATE the Universe!

            Well, this article below says OTHERWISE, that the Universe is probably ETERNAL:

            Universe Measured With Near-Perfect Accuracy: Scientists Say It’s Probably Infinite, Flat, And Eternal

            By Ben Wolford on January 9, 2014 3:29 PM EST

            Scientists announced Thursday that they’ve pretty much figured out the universe, unlocking potential clues to mysterious “dark energy;” bolstering theories that the universe is flat, eternal, and infinite; and mapping 1.3 million galaxies down to about 1 percent accuracy.
            All of this from an experiment that isn’t even done collecting data yet. It’s supposed to keep going until June.

            “We’ve done the analysis now because we have 90 percent of [the experiment's] final data, and we’re tremendously excited by the results,” says Martin White, chair of the survey team and physicist at the
            University of California, Berkeley. They announced the findings Thursday and have submitted their paper for publication with the journal Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society. The team has good reason to be excited: no one has ever mapped the universe so accurately. As team leader David Schlegel put it, “I now know the size of the universe better than I know the size of my house.”

            They did it using a high-powered telescope at the Apache Point Observatory in New Mexico, which, for almost five years, has been hunting deep space for galaxies. Some of them are more than 6 billion light-years away and, therefore, at least as many years old (FYI, a light-year is a distance, equal to about 5.9 trillion miles). They say it may be the largest collection of redshift galaxies (galaxies moving away from us) ever compiled.

            By comparison, the new Hubble photo of deep space, said to capture the farthest reaches yet, only shows galaxies 3.5 billion light-years from earth.

            With that information, the physicists looked for clusters of galaxies called Baryon acoustic oscillations, or baryons, which arrange themselves in circles around a central cluster. They’re basically caused by pressure ripples from
            when the universe was formed about 13.4 billion years ago, which cooled and froze. In this case, they proved useful because the radius of each cluster is always the same. In effect, they are a 500-million-light-years-long measuring tape.

            The scientists translated the data into a 3-D map of the
            universe. What they discovered is that the universe is “flat” — not in the two-dimensional sense, but in the physicist jargon sense. That is, its shape adheres to principles of basic fourth-grade geometry: A triangle’s angles add up to 180 degrees, and that kind of thing. Here’s the cool part about that: “One of the reasons we care is that a flat universe has implications for whether the universe is infinite,”

            Schlegel says in the news release. “That means — while we can’t say with certainty that it will never come to an end — it’s likely the universe extends forever in space and will go on FOREVER in TIME. Our results are consistent with an infinite universe.”

            That said, there will always be dissenting voices. These physicists in Denmark say the universe could die at any moment, and that this outcome is more likely that
            previously thought. “Maybe the collapse has already started somewhere in the universe, and right now it is eating its way into the rest of the universe,” they said. “Maybe a collapse is starting right now, right here. Or maybe it will start far away from here in a billion years. We do not know.”

          • amyl29

            they are lying and work for Lucifer. If they’re so smart they would know Lucifer is real and so is God. so therefore they must work for Lucifer and want to mislead the public so they can feel smarter or feel better than other ppl./want to be god agenda , has to be. guys like you buy it, you feel ‘smart’ don’t you? in reality you’re being fooled by these guys, not the bible

          • bizbird6

            You are SOOOOO_______________________WRONG!!!

            Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, but the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

            The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even more than
            1000 times longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

            And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTISTS would believe in the Bible, but they DON”T!!!

            Science, however, IS MARVELOUS, ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES!!

            Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

            You Bible, however, is a TOTAL FAKE!!!!

            I know the Bible EXTREMELY, EXTREMELY WELL!

            In fact, I was raised a Christian and went to Christian Schools for 12 years, so I certainly know the Bible.

            Since then, I also read books by Bible Experts like Bart D. Ehrman, Earl Doherty, and the Episcopal Bishop
            John Spong, all which claimed that the Bible is full of
            “Misquotations”, “Forgeries” and “Lies”.

            You folks should look them up on Wiki and then read their many books. All these persons studied and know the
            Bible EXTREMELY WELL. But, they all found the BIBLE is TOTALLY a FRAUD!!!

            Incidentally. Bart Ehrman in addition to being Born Christian also became a “Born Again Christian” , went to BIble College studied Christian Theology and has many degrees in CHristian Theology from the BEST Universities..

            Yet, at the end he found so many flaws in the bible that he was forced to reject the Bible and became an Agnostic. Bishop Spong was an Episcopal Bishop and he also later rejected the Bible.

            And these are just the tip of the Iceberg, and many, many more also agrees in the same thing, but these persons are a good start. This is why I rejected Christianity and the Bible. I and the people that I mentioned REJECTED the Bible out of KNOWLEDGE NOT ignorance.

            Your knowledge is LIMITED only to one side, the side that likes or FAVORS the Bible.

            You ALSO need to read about the OTHER VIEWPOINT!!!

            In LIfe, there are always two sides to every issue!!! You have not given yourself the chance to read the other viewpoint yet.

            Do me AND YOURSELF a FAVOR, look up up those persons that I mentioned in the Wiki INTERNET Encyclopedia. Read their BIo, and if at all possible, read some of their many, many books.

            Again their names are: Bart D. Ehrman, Earl J. Doherty, and the Retired Episcopal Bishop John Spong.

          • bizbird6

            You are SOOOOO_______________________WRONG!!!

            Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, but the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

            The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even more than
            1000 times longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

            And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTISTS would believe in the Bible, but they DON”T!!!

            Science, however, IS MARVELOUS, ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES!!

            Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

            You Bible, however, is a TOTAL FAKE!!!!

            I know the Bible EXTREMELY, EXTREMELY WELL!

            In fact, I was raised a Christian and went to Christian Schools for 12 years, so I certainly know the Bible.

            Since then, I also read books by Bible Experts like Bart D. Ehrman, Earl Doherty, and the Episcopal Bishop
            John Spong, all which claimed that the Bible is full of
            “Misquotations”, “Forgeries” and “Lies”.

            You folks should look them up on Wiki and then read their many books. All these persons studied and know the
            Bible EXTREMELY WELL. But, they all found the BIBLE is TOTALLY a FRAUD!!!

            Incidentally. Bart Ehrman in addition to being Born Christian also became a “Born Again Christian” , went to BIble College studied Christian Theology and has many degrees in CHristian Theology from the BEST Universities..

            Yet, at the end he found so many flaws in the bible that he was forced to reject the Bible and became an Agnostic. Bishop Spong was an Episcopal Bishop and he also later rejected the Bible.

            And these are just the tip of the Iceberg, and many, many more also agrees in the same thing, but these persons are a good start. This is why I rejected Christianity and the Bible. I and the people that I mentioned REJECTED the Bible out of KNOWLEDGE NOT ignorance.

            Your knowledge is LIMITED only to one side, the side that likes or FAVORS the Bible.

            You ALSO need to read about the OTHER VIEWPOINT!!!

            In LIfe, there are always two sides to every issue!!! You have not given yourself the chance to read the other viewpoint yet.

            Do me AND YOURSELF a FAVOR, look up up those persons that I mentioned in the Wiki INTERNET Encyclopedia. Read their BIo, and if at all possible, read some of their many, many books.

            Again their names are: Bart D. Ehrman, Earl J. Doherty, and the Retired Episcopal Bishop John Spong.

            ——————————————————

          • bizbird6

            The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

            SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

            Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

            The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

            The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

            Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
            with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
            isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

            Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

            – – Jordan Valinsky

            ——————-

        • amyl29

          bible is real- you guys are the frauds= im 100 percent sure , proof too

  • bizbird6

    This is from “Transparency International”

    Least corrupt countries in the world. The most Atheistic countries on top
    (9 out of these 10 countries are most atheistic)

    1. New Zealand

    1. Denmark

    1. Finland

    4. Sweden

    5. Singapore

    6. Norway

    7. Netherlands

    8. Australia

    8. Switzerland

    10. Canada

  • bizbird6

    Most generous countries when it comes to giving aid to poor countries (percent of GDP) – 8 out of top 10 are the most Atheistic :

    Sweden – 1.12%

    Norway – 1.06%

    Luxembourg – 1.04%

    Denmark – 0.88%

    Netherlands – 0.82%

    Belgium – 0.55%

    Finland – 0.54%

    Ireland – 0.54%

    United Kingdom – 0.52%

    France- 0.47%

    Spain – 0.46%

    Switzerland – 0.45%

    Germany – 0.35%

    Canada – 0.30%

    Austria – 0.30%

    Australia – 0.29%

    New Zealand – 0.28%

    Portugal – 0.23%

    United States – 0.21%

    Greece – 0.19%

    Japan – 0.18%

    Italy – 0.16%

    South Korea – 0.10%

    In the American debates they argue that USA
    gives to much aid but they give much less than other rich countries. Remember
    that USA is placed 15 when counting the wealth of a country (GDP per capita)

  • bizbird6

    You should read Bart Ehrman’s BIO in Wiki Encyclopedia..

    You should also look up Bishop John Spong, Earl Doheny, Victor Stenger, Dan Barker, John Allen Paulos, Jerry Coyne, Sam Harris, Steven Pinker, Michael Newdow, Julia Sweeney,

  • bizbird6

    Which Countries are among the SMARTEST in the World???
    If you look down the list, you will find that most of them are ATHEISTIC Countries!

    The Smartest Countries in the World?

    By Michael Schreiber | Credit.com – 3 hours ago

    The United States may have the lion’s share of the cash, but when it comes to brains, we don’t even crack the top 10, according to one recent report. In a ranking of the countries with the highest IQs conducted by StatisticsBrain.com, the United States placed 19th with an average IQ of 98, tied with Norway, Mongolia and — gasp — France (which perhaps explains that country’s reported love of Jerry Lewis). The top spot goes to Hong Kong, while 10th place is shared by two European countries, Sweden and Switzerland, which evidently many people think are one and the same.

    Intelligence Around the Globe

    According to the study, here are the
    top 10 smartest countries in the world:

    # 10: Sweden and Switzerland
    (two-way tie), average IQ: 101

    #6: Netherlands, Italy, Germany and
    Austria (four-way tie), average IQ: 102

    #5: Singapore, average IQ: 103

    #4: Taiwan, average IQ: 104

    #3: Japan, average IQ: 105

    #2: South Korea, average IQ: 106

    #1: Hong Kong, average IQ: 107

    [We decided that it’s not worth sharing the “dumbest” countries in the world, mainly because some consider IQ to be flawed as an objective measure of intelligence, and would therefore be arguably ill-suited to this application.

  • bizbird6

    Which countries are among the Happiest?

    If you look down the list, you will find that those are also the most ATHEISTIC!!!

    Some interesting facts:

    This shows the most “happy” countries in the world in which Denmark (80% atheists) is on top. The religious countries are way down below. Of the top 10, 7 are in the most atheistic/agnostic countries.

    1. Denmark

    2. Switzerland

    3. Austria

    4. Iceland

    5. The Bahamas

    6. Finland

    7 Sweden

    8. Bhutan

    9. Brunei

    10. Canada

    Participants in the various studies were asked questions related to happiness and satisfaction with life. The meta-analysis is based on the findings of over 100 different studies around the world, which questioned 80,000 people worldwide. For this study data has also been analyzed in relation to health, wealth and access to education. 1

    • Larry Stauth

      link to proof… just your word means nothing. You have already proven your dumber than a box of rocks and willing to ignore relevent facts for lies.

      For instance… While religion may currently play a minor role in the daily lives of Denmark, their existence is built on it and it still does have a presence.

      In other words.. they are NOT atheists. Faith is not measured in the amount of time a person spends in church or preaching or praying.. in fact, “Faith is given to each in his own measure”..

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Denmark

      http://denmark.dk/en/society/religion/

      • bizbird6

        People once believed in Zeus, now that belief is obsolete!

        Does Zeus still have a “presence”?

        The same thing true with Christianity. Christianity is getting be along side with the ancient belief in Zeus as well!

        It is NOT “just my word”. I NEVER said anything, I just forwarded you an article written by other researchers.

        • Larry Stauth

          Only a small group of people believed in Zeus, and there was never any proof of his existence.

          Christianity is based on the life of a proven existence. Such as the fact they found an army’s worth of chariots on the floor of the Red Sea, all together, next to the ONLY section of landmass under water that could be used as a bridge.

          And you haven’t forwarded any article, you have only copy/pasted the same unbiased individuals, with no validation and have been proven to be unsubstantiated.

          NOTE: Not one author you have mentioned have been validated as being accurate by independent sources, even the Agnostic and Aethists groups only approach their work with scrutiny, because they have been proven to be frauds.

          The fact that you regurgitate their lies and half baked thoughts and opinions, without one shred of ability to actually double check, is why you are a moron.

          Anyone can type anything.. does not mean it’s true. Heck I can type the words “The sky is green”… looking outside, I can see I would be wrong… but I typed it, so it must be true?

          So.. from this point on.. all responses to anything further will be unread, and only reply will be as follows:

          “Ignored. Go away troll”. You need to head to a forum with other like minded and stray away from things you really know nothing about..

          • bizbird6

            Absolutely nonsense!!

            <>

            There has NEVER been such a thing!!!!

            Where is your proof and source for that!!!! .

          • Larry Stauth
          • bizbird6

            I looked at these films of yours, in fact several times, just to make sure that I didn’t miss anything.

            But there is NOTHING in these films. There is NO “Army of Chariots” at all, just a lot of unknown junk. Also the landscape of “Sodom” could be anything and from any age, maybe a few thousands of years old, but more likely tens or hundreds of thousands years old.

            YOU Christian find things that you WANT to find, even when they don’t exist!.

            Why don’t you let an OBJECTIVE SCIENTIST look at the same things and see what he says.

          • Larry Stauth

            They aren’t MY films, idiot! I didn’t “find anything”…

            Please, do explain how wheel and axles got into the middle of the Red Sea… PLEASE… Because there are several Professional Atheists that would LOVE to be able to justify debunking the full documentary, that shows the full results of the discovery…

            If you even bothered to check, you would see they are part of a published Scientific Geologist study and have been published for years… Maybe you should actually try looking with an objective mind, instead of trying to find flaw.

            Oh wait.. you expected to see chariots from 7,000 years ago to be fully intact? Wow, you are not an idiot, that would be too gracious…

            As for “Objective”, you don’t know the meaning of the word.. The fact that is WAS published nearly a decade ago, it has been there for the whole world to review. You also realize that was a YouTube link… Objective or not, it’s there for anyone to review.

            As I said, you are WRONG, deal with it!!!

            Now,go away… Troll… before I embarrass you further.

            BTW, you do know your web history of posting is linked? And you IP address and location are quite visible, even if you choose to hide behind a fake name..

            At least I have the courage to face the world without hiding like a sissy girl.

          • bizbird6

            I did see one circular looking object that looks to me like some kind of table. And even it it were a chariot, so what? It is like finding a few automobiles at the bottom of a lake in the USA. However, I certainly didn’t see any “army of Chariots” in the film.

            Maybe the reason that the world didn’t debunk is that no one ever heard of this film (I sure NEVER heard of it!).

            Anyway, even if some people did saw it, so what? They did not know that Christians are trying to use it to claim that there is this an “Army of Chariots” and trying to prove that it is the remnants of Pharaoh’s army?.

            Instead of us arguing if this is this or this is that, there is a simpler way of proving the point!

            Why doesn’t Omnipotent God speak up in a loud voice, “I am God and I exist” and the “Bible is NOT a fake”!

            That would settle everything quick and simple, TRUE? Don’t you agree?

            But how come God does NOT? Isn’t God’s PERPETUAL SILENCE a DECISIVE proof that he does NOT exist?

          • Larry Stauth

            Dude.. really… you are an idiot… IT WAS AN SCIENTIFIC GEOLOGICAL RESEARCH PROJECT!!

            It was unveiled at a convention of experts.

            As for the rest.. I answered already.. you have question, try reading the Bible… most of your answer can be found in the Old Testament… easy to read, too… And funny thing is, it won’t make you a believer to read it…

            Now go away troll.. obviously you lack enough intelligence to know this is not a forum of people that are like minded…

            Are you really so stupid? How much lower can you show your IQ to be? How well do you like conservatives to laugh at your pathetic attempts?

            And pathetic is putting it mildly… how many posts, in this one article, and each and everyone a laughing stalk…

            You must make your family proud…

          • bizbird6

            I have a TON of more things to say!

            However, I will STOP sending you any more messages just because this is your preferences.

            I know that I am right, but I will STOP just to bow to your wishes!

          • amyl29

            hey bird, hate to break It to you but it’s real. I wouldn’t say it if If I didn’t know.
            all that fantastical stuff beyond the imagination and comprehension you refer to as fairytale like is true. those words are real, personally I have more respect for the ‘believers’, because they’re right.

          • bizbird6

            You are WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!!!!

            I don’t care if you read or don’t read them.

            I will continue to speak the TRUTH, the WHOLE TRUTH, and NOTHING BUT the TRUTH!!

          • Larry Stauth

            So, when shall we expect it, because I have proven you wrong, several times now…

            You keep proving yourself to be unintelligent and truly lacking in all merit.

            Your an idiot and I have laid out the proof, and STILL you troll…

            Must suck so bad to live in your skin, that you need to express things you obviously know nothing about.

            NOW GO AWAY TROLL!!!

          • bizbird6

            There is as much proof that Zeus exist as the Christian God!!!

            Both are FALSE!!!

          • bizbird6

            The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

            SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

            Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

            The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

            The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

            Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
            with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
            isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

            Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

            – – Jordan Valinsky

            ————————-

  • bizbird6

    Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

    According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

    Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief
    and social well-being was published in the Journal of Religion & Society.
    Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author
    Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

    Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief
    in God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior,
    Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage
    pregnancy than societies where many people profess belief in God.

    Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over
    eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that
    God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people – Japan is one
    of the least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates
    of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

    (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is
    usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both
    mothers and children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

    Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty
    percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced
    that there is a deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the
    Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do twice as badly as
    the others. Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000
    people a year.

    At the other end of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans
    believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of evolution (many
    believe it had a helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate
    of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five times greater than
    in Europe and ten times higher than in Japan.

    All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and
    antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to
    suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

    At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions
    preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals
    a different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s
    ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will
    respect social customs and laws.

    All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far
    so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.
    Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or
    “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do not share their
    sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”,
    they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their
    priority becomes not the world they live in but themselves.

    The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the
    weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior.
    Hence gun laws which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow
    human beings who deserve protection, but as potential aggressors who deserve to
    die. And hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than
    the ill.

    As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In
    other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of
    unwanted pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the
    right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit
    society as a whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them
    that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I
    say”. The result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually
    transmitted infections.

    Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as
    creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.
    Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions
    assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal
    logic, no matter how absurd to outside observers.

    The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is
    irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public
    discussion. Look no further than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western
    nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime time television.

    Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than
    violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere.
    As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory
    Paul’s study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you
    should tell them that God does not exist.”

    I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that
    God would be an atheist,

    i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies
    become secular.

    http://www.humaniststudies.org/enews/index.html?id=219&article=7

  • bizbird6

    Religious People Branded As Less Intelligent Than
    Atheists In Provocative New Study

    The Huffington Post | By Macrina Cooper-White
    Posted: 08/14/2013 3:48 pm EDT | Updated: 08/15/2013
    11:47 am EDT 8

    That’s the provocative conclusion of a new review of 63 studies of intelligence and religion that span the past century. The meta-analysis showed that in 53 of the studies, conducted between 1928 to 2012, there was an inverse relation between religiosity — having religious beliefs, or performing religious rituals — and intelligence. That is, on average, non-believers scored higher than religious people on intelligence tests.

    What might explain the effect?

    Scientists behind studies included in the review most often suggested that “religious beliefs are irrational, not anchored in science, not
    testable and, therefore, unappealing to intelligent people who ‘know better.’”

    But the researchers who conducted the new meta-analysis say the answer is a bit more complicated. They suspect intelligent people might have less of a “need” for religion.

    “Intelligence may also lead to greater self-control ability,
    self-esteem, perceived control over life events, and supportive relationships,
    obviating some of the benefits that religion sometimes provides,” study
    co-author Jordan Silberman, a graduate student of neuroeconomics at the
    University of Rochester, told The Huffington Post in an email.

    So if you’re a believer, does this mean you’re a dope?

    “I’m sure there are intelligent religious people and unintelligent atheists out there,” Silberman said in the email. “The findings pertain to the average intelligence of religious and non-religious people, but they don’t necessarily apply to any single
    person. Knowing that a person is religious would not lead me to bet any money
    on whether or not the person is intelligent.”

    The researchers acknowledge the limitations of the meta-analysis. It did not look at type of religion, for example, or at the role culture might play in the interaction between religiosity and intelligence.

    In addition, The Independent pointed out that the researchers used a narrow definition of intelligence. In the paper, intelligence is defined as “the ability to reason, plan, solve problems, think abstractly, comprehend complex ideas, learn quickly, and learn from experience.” This excludes other forms of intelligence, like creative and emotional intelligence.

    The meta-analysis was published in Personality and Social Psychology Review.

    Quick Poll

    What do you think about the study’s bold claim?

    I’m a total believer in the study –it makes a lot of sense.

    56.22%

    I have no faith in the study’s findings — believers are just as smart as non-believers.

    15.81%

    It’s just researchers playing with statistics — it doesn’t apply to individual people.

    28 %

    • Larry Stauth

      Oh, and troll… ANYONE can submit anything to Huffington Post. The editors choose to only publish what they wish. And they have no accountability, if they are wrong… because they are user submitted.

      Talk to any professor, Wikipedia AND Huff Post are both banned references for educational material by ALL College and Universities in the US…

      Wonder why? Oh, I know… because they are frequently half baked ideas from idiots who’s only desire is to get published and lacked the skills to get with quality news sources.

      BTW, nut job… I have published articles to Huff Post..

      Dang moron, doesn’t even bother to check who he is trying to argue with…

      Tell me, how many college degrees do you have? How many national accreditation do you have? When you can answer 3 and 10… then we can talk..

      • bizbird6

        I don’t understand? What do you mean by “3 and 10″.

        So, how about you? How many degrees do you have?

        • Larry Stauth

          “I don’t understand”… that is your thesis.. and 3 and 10 IS the number I have..

          NOW GO AWAY TROLL

          • bizbird6

            I have as much education as you, but much MORE!!!

          • Larry Stauth

            Obviously, not… proof is all over these postings..

            NOW GO AWAY TROLL!

          • bizbird6

            Someday you will thank me for what I am telling you now!!!

    • Girlie58

      Being a genius will not get you to heaven. It is faith and belief in Jesus that will give you a chance to enter heaven. Remember, we are just passing through on earth. In the end genius or not, you either go to heaven, or hell!

      • bizbird6

        Yes, but the TRUTH is most likely to get you where you want to be.

        The SMARTER person is more likely to find the truth than the stupid person?

        If all the SMARTER persons says that God, Christ, and the Bible are JUNK!! while all the STUPID persons say to follow God, Christ, and the Bible, who is likely to be right?

        Remember that there is NOT just one Religion in the world, but 30 or more Religions. And the wrong one will lead you Nowhere.

        The Stupid person is also likely to follow Zeus and other false gods too, like God, Christ, and the Bible!

        For example, the Islamic Religion says that Christians who refuse to abandon their Christian Religion and refuse to convert to Islam will go to HELL! And Islam is NOT the only Religion to say such things.

        Is the Smart person more likely to find the TRUTH or the STUPID one?

        I think that you folks are following TOTALLY FALSE gods in Christ and the Bible………,..

        • amyl29

          the people who wrote the bible are telling the truth. bottom line. the guy and the apostles who wrote that book aren’t lying so I take it it’s them that are the creators, wouldn’t ya say?

    • amyl29

      it’s a lie put out by Satanists or pseudo intellectuals who buy whatever ‘survey’ these guy put out. Keep believing what they tell you, along with the made up stories like sandy hook and what not.
      they either know the facts and are lying to everyone or they aren’t as smart as they think they are.
      here’s my opinion, I think they may know already and for some reason want the public or those they deem ‘ the others’ or impressionable to believe what they’re putting out there.
      ignore the ‘surveys’. I found out- bible is real.

      • bizbird6

        You are SOOOOO_______________________WRONG!!!

        Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, but the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

        The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even more than
        1000 times longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

        And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTISTS would believe in the Bible, but they DON”T!!!

        Science, however, IS MARVELOUS, ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES!!

        Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

        You Bible, however, is a TOTAL FAKE!!!!

        I know the Bible EXTREMELY, EXTREMELY WELL!

        In fact, I was raised a Christian and went to Christian Schools for 12 years, so I certainly know the Bible.

        Since then, I also read books by Bible Experts like Bart D. Ehrman, Earl Doherty, and the Episcopal Bishop
        John Spong, all which claimed that the Bible is full of
        “Misquotations”, “Forgeries” and “Lies”.

        You folks should look them up on Wiki and then read their many books. All these persons studied and know the
        Bible EXTREMELY WELL. But, they all found the BIBLE is TOTALLY a FRAUD!!!

        Incidentally. Bart Ehrman in addition to being Born Christian also became a “Born Again Christian” , went to BIble College studied Christian Theology and has many degrees in CHristian Theology from the BEST Universities..

        Yet, at the end he found so many flaws in the bible that he was forced to reject the Bible and became an Agnostic. Bishop Spong was an Episcopal Bishop and he also later rejected the Bible.

        And these are just the tip of the Iceberg, and many, many more also agrees in the same thing, but these persons are a good start. This is why I rejected Christianity and the Bible. I and the people that I mentioned REJECTED the Bible out of KNOWLEDGE NOT ignorance.

        Your knowledge is LIMITED only to one side, the side that likes or FAVORS the Bible.

        You ALSO need to read about the OTHER VIEWPOINT!!!

        In LIfe, there are always two sides to every issue!!! You have not given yourself the chance to read the other viewpoint yet.

        Do me AND YOURSELF a FAVOR, look up up those persons that I mentioned in the Wiki INTERNET Encyclopedia. Read their BIo, and if at all possible, read some of their many, many books.

        Again their names are: Bart D. Ehrman, Earl J. Doherty, and the Retired Episcopal Bishop John Spong.

        ——————————————

  • Girlie58

    If you don’t have Jesus in your life then you are already dead is spirit. That is what Ted is feeling…the void ness in his heart!

    • bizbird6

      Jesus is junk!! Jesus NEVER existed or is dead and long buried.

      You need to read two Bible EXPERTS about Christ and the Bible.

      Their names are Earl Doherty and Bart Ehrman. These two persons has written over some 30 books on the Bible. You can look their up on Wiki.

      ————————————————————-

      You need to read Earl Doherty who said that Christ NEVER
      existed!!

      From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia:

      Earl Doherty

      http://www.jesuspuzzle.com

      Earl J. Doherty (born 1941)[1] is a Canadian author of The Jesus

      Puzzle (1999), Challenging the Verdict (2001), and Jesus: Neither

      God Nor Man (2009).

      Doherty argues for a version of the Christ myth theory, the thesis that Jesus did not exist as an historical figure.

      ———————————————————————-

      Bart Ehrman, claimed that the Bible is a FRAUD, with “MISQUOTATIONS”, “FORGERIES”, and LIES”

      From Wiki:

      Bart D. Ehrman (born 5 October 1955) is an American New Testament scholar, currently theJames A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill.

      Ehrman is a leading New Testament scholar, having written and edited over twenty-five books, including three college textbooks.

      He has also achieved acclaim at the popular level, authoring four New York Times bestsellers: Misquoting Jesus, Jesus, Interrupted, God’s Problem, and Forged.[2] Ehrman’s work focuses on the New Testament, New Testament textual criticism, the Historical Jesus, and early Christianity.

  • bizbird6

    CHRISTIANITY SUMMED UP!!!!!

    ————————————————-

    • Clay Davis

      I don’t normally reply to these type debates, but in this instance I have to. Bizbird6, unfortunately you are convinced you are right. The devil did the same thing while trying to exalt himself above God. It didn’t work for him as your consistent rejection will, in the end, not work for you. I’ll not waist one second trying to convert you nor rally the Christians to join me. It would prove fruitless I’m afraid. You mention somewhere in your comments that you know the bible well. In John the 5th chapter Jesus tells the Pharisees that even though they search (or know) scriptures, they do not search for the life in them. He was referring to Himself. The Bible is life giving and will always do so. From a science perspective, a theory of any kind is merely a guess or thought to be possible. Mostly, they are less than probable.

      You seem to be inelegant. I would test that inelegant and say, “Give scripture another chance”. Leave God the father out of it and simply study the red letters. Jesus was more than a man or Prophet. In the red letters lay the truth that your heart so desperately needs.

      I once thought exactly like you. I rejected everything about religions of all kinds especially the idea someone rose from the dead to atone for all man’s sins. It all seemed crazy. I was an active atheist. After all, how could a loving God let so many bad things happen to good people? I just didn’t want to believe in it. I am so happy Jesus met me there. He didn’t condemn me or judge me. He accepted me just as I was, a broken and bitter non-believer. He has proven Himself to be more than real in so many ways that I simply don’t have time to include here.

      I am available to discuss this further if you so desire. I can so relate to you. I have a website that has all my contact info listed. Feel free to reach out at any time. God bless you!

      http://www.isaiah61.us

      • bizbird6

        What you are saying is TOTALLY RIDICULOUS and FALSE!!!

        You “can NOT leave the Father out of this”. You HAVE TO INCLUDE him!!!!!!!!!

        Why?

        It is like a serial murderer saying “leave my MURDERS out of this because I am kind to animals!”. Or Hitler saying “leave my murders of MILLIONS and MILLIONS of Jews out of this because I am kind to White Germans!!!”.

        What you are saying is TOTALLY RIDICULOUS!!!

        Also, you SEEM to show a PROFOUND IGNORANCE of SCIENCE!!!

        THEORY is NOT a GUESS!!! A HYPOTHESIS s a GUESS!!!

        It takes TONS and TONS of EVIDENCES to promote a HYPOTHESIS INTO a THEORY!!!

        You CAN NOT POSSIBLY be “ONCE an ATHEIST” because ATHEIST ARE NOT that DUMB and IGNORANT!!!

        Did you read my REPORT that ATHEISTS are much Smarter than REligious types? Maybe I should include that!!!

        • bizbird6

          vvvvvv

      • bizbird6

        Religious People Branded As Less Intelligent Than
        Atheists In Provocative New Study

        The Huffington Post | By Macrina Cooper-White
        Posted: 08/14/2013 3:48 pm EDT | Updated: 08/15/2013
        11:47 am EDT

        That’s the provocative conclusion of a new review of 63 studies of intelligence and religion that span the past century. The meta-analysis showed that in 53 of the studies, conducted between
        1928 to 2012, there was an inverse relation between religiosity — having religious beliefs, or performing religious rituals — and intelligence. That is, on average, non-believers scored higher than religious people on intelligence tests.

        What might explain the effect?

        Scientists behind studies included in the review most often suggested that “religious beliefs are irrational, not anchored in science, not testable and, therefore, unappealing to intelligent people who ‘know better.’”

        But the researchers who conducted the new meta-analysis say the answer is a bit more complicated. They suspect
        intelligent people might have less of a “need” for religion.

        “Intelligence may also lead to greater self-control ability,
        self-esteem, perceived control over life events, and supportive relationships, obviating some of the benefits that religion sometimes provides,” study co-author Jordan Silberman, a graduate student of neuroeconomics at the University
        of Rochester, told The Huffington Post in an email.

        So if you’re a believer, does this mean you’re a dope?

        “I’m sure there are intelligent religious people and unintelligent atheists out there,” Silberman said in the email. “The findings pertain to the average intelligence of religious and non-religious people, but they don’t necessarily apply to any single
        person. Knowing that a person is religious would not lead me to bet any money on whether or not the person is intelligent.”

        The researchers acknowledge the limitations of the meta-analysis. It did not look at type of religion, for example, or at the role culture might play in the interaction between religiosity and intelligence.

        In addition, The Independent pointed out that the researchers used a narrow definition of intelligence. In the paper, intelligence is defined as “the ability to reason, plan, solve problems, think
        abstractly, comprehend complex ideas, learn quickly, and learn from experience.” This excludes other forms of intelligence, like creative and emotional intelligence.

        The meta-analysis was published in Personality and Social Psychology Review.

        —————————————————-

        Quick Poll

        What do you think about the study’s bold claim?

        I’m a total believer in the study —
        it makes a lot of sense.

        56.22%

        I have no faith in the study’s findings — believers are just as smart as non-believers.

        15.81%

        It’s just researchers playing with statistics — it doesn’t apply to individual people.

        28%

      • bizbird6

        What you are saying is TOTALLY RIDICULOUS and FALSE!!!

        You “can NOT leave the Father out of this”. You HAVE TO INCLUDE him!!!!!!!!!

        Why?

        It is like a serial murderer saying “leave my MURDERS out of this because I am kind to animals!”. Or Hitler saying “leave my murders of MILLIONS and MILLIONS of Jews out of this because I am kind to White Germans!!!”.

        What you are saying is TOTALLY RIDICULOUS!!!

        Also, you SEEM to show a PROFOUND IGNORANCE of SCIENCE!!!

        THEORY is NOT a GUESS!!! A HYPOTHESIS s a GUESS!!!

        It takes TONS and TONS of EVIDENCES to promote a HYPOTHESIS INTO a THEORY!!!

        You CAN NOT POSSIBLY be “ONCE an ATHEIST” because ATHEIST ARE NOT that DUMB and IGNORANT!!!

        Did you read my REPORT that ATHEISTS are much Smarter than REligious types? Maybe I should include that!!!

      • Dick

        Bizbird6 has been turned over to the devil and he believes a lie, so he will be dammed. Stop putting the pearl before the swine

        • bizbird6

          The REAL Devil is Christianity and the Bible!

          Nothing is more Phony than that.

          You Christians are such SUCKERS to believe in such NONSENSE!!!

          Read my other comments on this Website!!

      • bizbird6

        The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

        SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

        Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

        The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

        The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

        Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
        with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
        isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

        Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

        – – Jordan Valinsky

        ………………………………………….

  • bizbird6

    The Christian God is probably the most EVIL Monster of a God there is!

    There are so many gods in the World. There is the Islamic God, the
    Mormon God, the Buddhist God, etc., etc., etc.
    Remember that there are over 30 Religions or more in the world. Yet very few if any God is more guilty of murdering more INNOCENTS than the Christian God!

    The whole problem is that Christianity is a TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE Religion to use as a MORAL BASE!!!

    Why??

    Because the God that Christian worship was himself an EVIL MONSTER!

    You heard about story of Noah’s Ark have you NOT? God sent 40 days of
    rain to commit Genocide and wipe out virtually the whole human race! And how
    did the Christians justify such an EVIL deed?
    Christians claimed that God was justified because Mankind was “Wicked”.

    But did God murdered only the “Wicked”? NO! NOT AT ALL. God killed Men, women, AND CHILDREN!!!

    That is right, God MURDERED INNOCENT CHILDREN!! The CHILD could be a
    5 year old CHILD, a 3 year old CHILD, or even a 1 YEAR OLD INFANT!!

    How could children be guilty of WICKEDNESS? You have to at least reach the age of consent to be guilty of anything.

    There is probably NOT one country in the whole world that would convict a one year old child guilty of anything.

    Yet God acted as JUDGE , JURY, and EXECUTIONER in murdering THOUSANDS and maybe even MILLIONS of INNOCENT CHILDREN in the story of Noah’s ARK!

    And that is NOT just an ISOLATED case. God did the same in Sodom and Gomorrah, where he murdered thousands of INNOCENT CHILDREN there also.

    Also among the Canaanites, INNOCENT CHILDREN were victims too!

    And You heard of the “First born Egyptians” (of Moses), which God murdered thousands and thousands just to teach the stubborn Egyptian Pharaoh a Lesson?
    So what were these “First Born Egyptians” guilty of? They did absolutely nothing to deserved to be killed by God!

    If God really wanted to play it “Wise”, all he had to do was to kill the stubborn Pharaoh, not a lot of INNOCENTS who has no say at all in the ancient dictatorial Egyptian government.

    Or God could have just sent his Angels to kidnap the Pharaoh and forced the Pharaoh to obey the will of God! (Of course, the Pharaoh had Bodyguards, but the Angels of Omnipotent God couldn’t overcome them?)

    See, those are the reasons that Christianity is WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!!! And they based their moral standards on the WRONG God! They worshiped the WRONG GOD!

    The God Christians worshiped was worse than Hitler, Stalin, Attila, or Genghis Khan.

  • bizbird6

    Why am I writing all this?

    I am just doing what Christians themselves DO! They try to convert others to be Christians. I DO JUST the opposite!!!

    In my opinion Christianity is the WORST EVIL in AMERICA and the World today.
    It blocks clear thinking and degrades its believers.

    The EVIL is even in its own Bible, but Christians refuse to see it because they put a mental block!

    You can also click on to the following:

    http://www.humaniststudies.org

    Below there are more reasons that Christianity is so EVIL! Read
    below:

    ——————————

    Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

    According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

    Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief and social
    well-being was published in the Journal of Religion & Society.

    Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author
    Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

    Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in
    God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior, Paul
    found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage pregnancy
    than societies where many people profess belief in God.

    Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over
    eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God
    exists. Despite its size –over a hundred million people – Japan is one of the
    least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates of
    teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

    (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually
    unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both mothers
    and children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

    Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty
    percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced
    that there is a deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits,
    with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do twice as badly as the
    others. Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000 people a
    year.

    At the other end of the scale comes America.

    Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some
    form of evolution (many believe it had a helping hand from the Deity). The U.S.
    has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five
    times greater than in Europe and ten times higher than in Japan.

    All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and
    antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to
    suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

    At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach
    non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals a
    different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability
    to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will respect social
    customs and laws.

    All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far
    so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.

    Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or
    “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do not share their
    sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”,
    they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their
    priority becomes not the world they live in but themselves.

    The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker
    society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior. Hence
    gun laws which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings
    who deserve protection, but as potential aggressors who deserve to die. And
    hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

    As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In
    other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of unwanted
    pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the right to
    make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit society as a
    whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them that right —
    “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I say”. The
    result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually transmitted
    infections.

    Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as
    creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.

    Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions
    assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal
    logic, no matter how absurd to outside observers.

    The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is
    irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public
    discussion. Look no further than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western
    nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed
    deferentially on prime time television.

    Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than
    violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere. As
    UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory Paul’s
    study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you should
    tell them that God does not exist.”

    I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that
    God would be an atheist,

    i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies become
    secular.

    http://www.humaniststudies.org

    • http://oggi-icandothat.blogspot.com/ Oggi

      “Why am I writing all this?”

      Because you are nuts! LOL

  • bizbird6

    Did the Universe ever had a “Beginning”?

    Christians always argue that the reason that there is a God is that the Universe had a “Beginning” and that you needed a God to CREATE the Universe!

    Well, this article below says OTHERWISE, that the Universe is probably ETERNAL:

    Universe Measured With Near-Perfect Accuracy: Scientists Say It’s Probably Infinite, Flat, And Eternal

    By Ben Wolford on January 9, 2014 3:29 PM EST

    Scientists announced Thursday that they’ve pretty much figured out the universe, unlocking potential clues to mysterious “dark energy;” bolstering theories that the universe is flat, eternal, and infinite; and mapping 1.3 million galaxies down to about 1 percent accuracy.
    All of this from an experiment that isn’t even done collecting data yet. It’s supposed to keep going until June.

    “We’ve done the analysis now because we have 90 percent of [the experiment's] final data, and we’re tremendously excited by the results,” says Martin White, chair of the survey team and physicist at the
    University of California, Berkeley. They announced the findings Thursday and have submitted their paper for publication with the journal Monthly Notices of the Royal Astronomical Society. The team has good reason to be excited: no one has ever mapped the universe so accurately. As team leader David Schlegel put it, “I now know the size of the universe better than I know the size of my house.”

    They did it using a high-powered telescope at the Apache Point Observatory in New Mexico, which, for almost five years, has been hunting deep space for galaxies. Some of them are more than 6 billion light-years away and, therefore, at least as many years old (FYI, a light-year is a distance, equal to about 5.9 trillion miles). They say it may be the largest collection of redshift galaxies (galaxies moving away from us) ever compiled.

    By comparison, the new Hubble photo of deep space, said to capture the farthest reaches yet, only shows galaxies 3.5 billion light-years from earth.

    With that information, the physicists looked for clusters of galaxies called Baryon acoustic oscillations, or baryons, which arrange themselves in circles around a central cluster. They’re basically caused by pressure ripples from
    when the universe was formed about 13.4 billion years ago, which cooled and froze. In this case, they proved useful because the radius of each cluster is always the same. In effect, they are a 500-million-light-years-long measuring tape.

    The scientists translated the data into a 3-D map of the
    universe. What they discovered is that the universe is “flat” — not in the two-dimensional sense, but in the physicist jargon sense. That is, its shape adheres to principles of basic fourth-grade geometry: A triangle’s angles add up to 180 degrees, and that kind of thing. Here’s the cool part about that: “One of the reasons we care is that a flat universe has implications for whether the universe is infinite,”

    Schlegel says in the news release. “That means — while we can’t say with certainty that it will never come to an end — it’s likely the universe extends forever in space and will go on FOREVER in TIME. Our results are consistent with an infinite universe.”

    That said, there will always be dissenting voices. These physicists in Denmark say the universe could die at any moment, and that this outcome is more likely that
    previously thought. “Maybe the collapse has already started somewhere in the universe, and right now it is eating its way into the rest of the universe,” they said. “Maybe a collapse is starting right now, right here. Or maybe it will start far away from here in a billion years. We do not know.”

    —————————————————————————————

    • Jim

      Tell me: Did the Statue of Liberty evolve from lower, base metals? Did Mount Rushmore evolve through wind and rain erosion?

      If you can look at humans and believe they evolved, but look at those two things and not believe that THEY evolved, you are a fool.

      • bizbird6

        The Statue of Liberty was made by MANKIND in a few years, but mankind came from Millions and Millions years of EVOLUTION, NOT god!!!

        God does NOT exist and the Bible is a bunch of BALONEY!!!

        It is THAT simple!!

        You are a FOOL for believing otherwise!!!

        • Bev Wafford Morris

          I am so sorry that you are so closed-minded. I think you may be acting so angrily because your brain is denying what you know in your heart is true. Whether you like it or not, I’ll be praying for you.

          • bizbird6

            Both my Brain and My HEART is in TOTAL AGREEMENT!!

            You are so WRONG!!!

          • Mitch

            Me thinkest thou dost protest too much. Calm down.

          • bizbird6

            Of course, I PROTEST!!

            I resent the way that you obstruct the TEACHING of SCIENCE and EVOLUTION with your Bible NONSENSE!!!

            NOTHING is MORE truer than HONEST SCIENCE and nothing LIES more than the Bible.

            I know, because I went to Christian Schools and we know the Bible extremely well.

            However, now I know that the Bible is a TOTAL BALONEY.

            You need to read Bart D. Ehrman who was also a Borm Christian and he was even a “Born Again Christian” who finally renounced Christianity and he Bible. He is now an an Agnostic.

            You need to look him up in Wiki for his life story and how he was a Conservative Christian that later REJECTED the Bible as a COMPLETE LIE!!!!

            Other persons that he should look up in Wiki are Earl J. Doherty and Bishop John Spong of the Episcopal Church,
            both of whom were also Christians that REJECTED CONSERVATIVE CHRISTIANITY and NOW has joined the group of NONBELIEVERS.

            Do you know that Christianity is DECLINING ALL over the World and the FASTEST Rising believers are NONBELIEVERS?

            You need to join us!!!

          • bizbird6

            The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

            SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

            Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

            The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

            The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

            Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
            with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
            isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

            Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

            – – Jordan Valinsky

            —————————————–

          • bizbird6

            You are SOOOOO_______________________WRONG!!!

            Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, but the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

            The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even more than
            1000 times longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

            And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTISTS would believe in the Bible, but they DON”T!!!

            Science, however, IS MARVELOUS, ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES!!

            Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

            You Bible, however, is a TOTAL FAKE!!!!

            I know the Bible EXTREMELY, EXTREMELY WELL!

            In fact, I was raised a Christian and went to Christian Schools for 12 years, so I certainly know the Bible.

            Since then, I also read books by Bible Experts like Bart D. Ehrman, Earl Doherty, and the Episcopal Bishop
            John Spong, all which claimed that the Bible is full of
            “Misquotations”, “Forgeries” and “Lies”.

            You folks should look them up on Wiki and then read their many books. All these persons studied and know the
            Bible EXTREMELY WELL. But, they all found the BIBLE is TOTALLY a FRAUD!!!

            Incidentally. Bart Ehrman in addition to being Born Christian also became a “Born Again Christian” , went to BIble College studied Christian Theology and has many degrees in CHristian Theology from the BEST Universities..

            Yet, at the end he found so many flaws in the bible that he was forced to reject the Bible and became an Agnostic. Bishop Spong was an Episcopal Bishop and he also later rejected the Bible.

            And these are just the tip of the Iceberg, and many, many more also agrees in the same thing, but these persons are a good start. This is why I rejected Christianity and the Bible. I and the people that I mentioned REJECTED the Bible out of KNOWLEDGE NOT ignorance.

            Your knowledge is LIMITED only to one side, the side that likes or FAVORS the Bible.

            You ALSO need to read about the OTHER VIEWPOINT!!!

            In LIfe, there are always two sides to every issue!!! You have not given yourself the chance to read the other viewpoint yet.

            Do me AND YOURSELF a FAVOR, look up up those persons that I mentioned in the Wiki INTERNET Encyclopedia. Read their BIo, and if at all possible, read some of their many, many books.

            Again their names are: Bart D. Ehrman, Earl J. Doherty, and the Retired Episcopal Bishop John Spong.

      • bizbird6

        The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

        SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

        Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

        The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

        The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

        Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
        with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
        isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

        Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

        – – Jordan Valinsky————

    • Bev Wafford Morris

      This is just rehashing the old Steady State versus Big Bang debate. Do I believe Bond, Gold, and Hoyle, or do I believe Georges Lemaître? There is evidence to support both, therefore, I’m not sure either theory tells the true story. My thinking is that the truth may be a lot different than you are willing to accept.

      • Dick

        Bev: he has been turned over to his lie and is dammed. You are wasting your breath trying to convince him other wise. He will know the truth, but, it will be too late for him. If anything we should feel sorry and pity these fools.

        • bizbird6

          The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

          SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

          Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

          The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

          The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

          Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
          with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
          isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

          Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

          – – Jordan Valinsky

          ———————————–

  • amyl29

    well ted, it’s true. so I guess you make your decision. go with the truth or keep up the act on cnn with ol Obama, rosen and your sandy hook.

  • BonBon

    So, Mr. Turner,
    I was a very hardworking, honest employee for seven years for you.
    Regretfully , I was terminated when it was deemed I no longer met your
    young age criteria required for your corporation. I wonder if you have
    looked in a mirror the past 20 years?
    Seeking God would be a great thing for you to pursue. I have forgiven you and
    would even be willing to guide you to our Lord and Saviour.

    • bizbird6

      God does NOT forgive because he does NOT EXIST!!!

      You are a FOOL for believing otherwise.

      • spiderman0551

        Such anger…you willing to bet eternity on that? What harm is there in believing in eternal life after death? If we end up in the ground dead and no afterlife, I still don’t regret living my life the way God said I should (as best I could anyway)…but if I’m right, you will regret it forever. I hope you give it a chance someday.

        • bizbird6

          I won’t regret because I am Right!!!

          It is time that you admit it also!!!

          • Mitch

            You should question where all your anger and malevolence toward those of us who believe comes from. People who scream they are right usually are trying hardest to convince themselves. You believe in nothing and I hold no animosity toward you. I believe in Christ, and Him crucified and you are hostile. Shame, shame, shame.

          • bizbird6

            I am NOT shouting at ALL but I am really WHISPERING, believe it or NOT. I just like to put EXCLAMATIONS
            to emphasize my points. And I am NOT angry either.

            Christ is NOT REAL and if he ever lived at all, he died 2,000 years ago will and will NEVER RISE again.

            I just PITY you POOR IGNORANT Conservative Christians to live in IGNORANCE and FOLLY!!!

          • spiderman0551

            Yeah because science has been constantly disproving itself since they though the sun orbited the earth. Science is great and we have a lot of really smart people here on earth but to be so ignorant to think we can even begin to know, with 100% certainty, much of anything? You are delusional. The bible was written over 2,000 years ago and is proven right more so every day. That little Russian conflict we got going on? It’s biblical, along with everything else happening in the Middle East. For someone who doesn’t hate, you sure spend a lot of time telling people how wrong we are…with zero facts. One could surmise that you could be controlled by something evil to espouse so much negativity and hatred. Pray for this person.

          • bizbird6

            Religious People Branded As Less Intelligent Than

            Atheists In Provocative New Study

            The Huffington Post | By Macrina Cooper-White

            Posted: 08/14/2013 3:48 pm EDT | Updated: 08/15/2013

            11:47 am EDT

            That’s the provocative conclusion of a new review of 63 studies of intelligence and religion that span the past century. The meta-analysis showed that in 53 of the studies, conducted between

            1928 to 2012, there was an inverse relation between religiosity — having religious beliefs, or performing religious rituals — and intelligence. That is, on average, non-believers scored higher than religious people on
            intelligence tests.

            What might explain the effect?

            Scientists behind studies included in the review most often suggested that “religious beliefs are irrational, not anchored in science, not testable and, therefore, unappealing to intelligent people who ‘know better.’”

            But the researchers who conducted the new meta-analysis say the answer is a bit more complicated. They
            suspect

            intelligent people might have less of a “need” for religion.

            “Intelligence may also lead to greater self-control ability,

            self-esteem, perceived control over life events, and supportive relationships, obviating some of the benefits that religion sometimes provides,” study co-author Jordan Silberman, a graduate student of neuroeconomics at the
            University

            of Rochester, told The Huffington Post in an email.

            So if you’re a believer, does this mean you’re a dope?

            “I’m sure there are intelligent religious people and unintelligent atheists out there,” Silberman said in
            the email. “The findings pertain to the average intelligence of religious and non-religious people, but they don’t necessarily apply to any single

            person. Knowing that a person is religious would not lead me to bet any money on whether or not the person is intelligent.”

            The researchers acknowledge the limitations of the meta-analysis. It did not look at type of religion, for example, or at the role culture might play in the interaction between
            religiosity and intelligence.

            In addition, The Independent pointed out that the researchers used a narrow definition of intelligence. In
            the paper, intelligence is defined as “the ability to reason, plan, solve problems, think

            abstractly, comprehend complex ideas, learn quickly, and learn from experience.” This excludes other forms of intelligence, like creative and emotional intelligence.

            The meta-analysis was published in Personality and Social Psychology Review.

            —————————————————-

            Quick Poll

            What do you think about the study’s bold claim?

            I’m a total believer in the study —

            it makes a lot of sense.

            56.22%

            I have no faith in the study’s findings — believers are just as smart as non-believers.

            15.81%

            It’s just researchers playing with statistics — it doesn’t apply to individual people.

            28%

          • Dick

            Why would anyone believe the Washington Post, it is the biggest commie rag in the country.

          • bizbird6

            You really mean Huffington POst, don’t you?? See. that is another problem with you Conservative Christians, you can NOT READ properly!!!

          • bizbird6

            You really Mean “Huffington Post”!!

            See, this is another problem with you Conservative Christians, You can NOT read CORRECTLY!!!

          • spiderman0551

            You have som serious issues to spend this amount of time commenting on every post on here…copying and pasting crap from Huffington post (very unbiased and credible too, lol). You seem to be trying really hard to convince a lot of folks (maybe yourself???) that God doesn’t exist. Saw an article today, speaking of your science, about a scientist who is trying to convince folks that the sun does actually orbit the earth….those bozos can’t agree on anything. Sure they have made great inventions but for them to comprehend the bible when they can’t explain/agree on even how the pyramids were built or what is the purpose for Stonehenge or Easter Island….c’mon, really? You’re going to put your faith in that? Good luck, better spend more time on earth away from the keyboard cause according to you, this is your only shot at existence. Do something better than trying to disprove (poorly) something that you obviously truly don’t understand….ok, you went to church and read the bible…lots of people do that and don’t get it….in fact, lots of those folks will be in for a big surprise when their time is up. That’s too bad you don’t understand the bible… I feel sorry for you.

          • bizbird6

            The MOST IMPORTANT POINT is that our SCIENTIFIC arguments are BASED on LOGIC, EVIDENCES, and PROOF!!! And we are TOTALLY HONEST!!! while you Conservative CHRISTIANS LIE and LIE and LIE!!!.

            If we are NOT sure, we admit it and then go from there. You Conservative Christians claim certainty when there are NO EVIDENCES to back up your claim.

            Science has been around only a few hundred years and , of course, the most progress in the last 100 years. WE made tremendous Progress. We came up with ELECTRICITY, Radios, TV, Cars, Airplanes, and even that computers that you are using now!!!

            We even sent probes into outer space to seek ALIEN Life forms.

            You Conservative Christians been around for 2,000 years and you folks accomplish virtually nothing, except lie and lie and claim certainty when none exist!!!

            And what does our SMARTEST people believe? NOT in your Conservative Christians which LIE and LIE, but in HONEST, MODERN SCIENCE!!

            That is why SCIENCE is BOOMING while you Conservative Christians are DECLINING ALL over the World!!!

          • spiderman0551

            Our? Science is booming? Science can’t agree to disagree. Technology is booming. All you have is we lie but have no proof? You question praying for something and not understanding why God doesn’t grant your prayer? He’s not a genie that grants wishes. See, you have no understanding of the concept. Let me guess, you prayed for a kitty when you were a kid, didn’t get it and now you’re pissed at God. You type like a teenager so I’m going to leave you alone now. I have life to live and actual people to interact with. I’m guessing your a pseudo intellectual who read a couple of books about atheism, mixed with a severe case of self importance and a narcissistic self loathing of your life …you come on here to give your life meaning by copying and pasting articles that you didn’t write. You have no actual thought of your own except “WE LIE” and have no actual proof of anything. You don’t even read the stuff you paste on here…just a quick google, or maybe you have it saved since you have pasted the same gibberish on here many times. Must be a lonely existence, which is why you have so much time to come on here and accomplish what? You think you’re going to affect anybody’s life or change their opinion about religion just because you use upper case letters? You seem literally hell bent on proving something….but it is to yourself, nobody else gets anything out of you pasting a blog somebody with similar credentials as you wrote…which is none. All pure emotion, so you could be a woman for that matter. Oh well. On with life…peck away lonely bird.

          • bizbird6

            There is a MOVIE out now called NOAH and is very popular.

            However, a Lot of Conservative Christians are opposed to it because it DEVIATED from the Bible!!!
            However, I disagree, because I like it!!
            For one thing, It shows how Phony the Noah’s story is and how FALSE the Bible is!
            The Bible is SHEER NONSENSE. If God want a pair of every creature in the World in an Ark, it would take FOREVER!!!
            Why?
            Do you even realize how many creatures there are in the World??
            Do you realize how much time it would take for Noah’s Family to collect that?
            Animals: estimated 3.30 million
            species
            |–Invertebrates: 97% of all known
            species
            | `–+–Sponges: 10,000 species
            | |–Cnidarians: 8,000-9,000
            species
            | |–Molluscs: 100,000 species
            | |–Platyhelminths: 13,000
            species
            | |–Nematodes: 20,000+ species
            | |–Echinoderms: 6,000 species
            | |–Annelida: 12,000 species
            | `–Arthropods
            | `–+–Crustaceans: 40,000
            species
            | |–Insects: 130 million+ species
            | `–Arachnids: 75,500 species
            `–Vertebrates: 3% of all known
            species
            `–+–Reptiles: 7,984 species
            |–Amphibians: 5,400 species
            |–Birds: 9,000-10,000 species
            |–Mammals: 4,475-5,000 species
            `–Ray-Finned Fishes: 23,500
            species
            And that is just the tip of the Iceberg. Hundred of new Species are discovered every year Scores of Scientists are combing the world just
            searching for NEW species of all kinds.
            And some are existing in only certain parts of the World! Can you imagine Noah flying all over the World just collecting Species?
            For example, the Siberian Tigers indigenous only in Siberia, so you are saying that Noah flew to Siberia just to trap and import a pair of Siberian
            Tiger to his Ark??
            And Kangaroos from Australia or Buffalos from Americas?. The same thing is true with other Animals, like you know that Africa Elephants and
            Asian Elephants are very different? And there are also rarer species that most people never hear of either? And
            The same is true with other Mammals, insects, Fishes, Birds, Germs, etc., etc., etc.
            Just insects alone number 130 Million species. Does Noah have a PHD in the study of Insects? Does he know even where to start?

            And how would Noah get to all those places? Were there Operating Airlines in those days?? Does he go to his closest Travel Agency and Book a Flight?
            Does he start Safari????

            And how would Noah collect all those species?? By using his family???

            So how big is his Family??? He had his wife and some daughters?

            Absolutely Ridiculous!!!
            The Noah’s Ark story is pure NONSENSE and the whole Bible is a complete FANTASY!!!

            —————————————-

          • bizbird6

            You are SOOOOO_______________________WRONG!!!

            Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, but the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

            The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even more than 1000 times longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

            And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTISTS would believe in the Bible, but they DON”T!!!

            Science, however, IS MARVELOUS, ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES!!

            Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

            You Bible, however, is a TOTAL FAKE!!!!

            I know the Bible EXTREMELY, EXTREMELY WELL!

            In fact, I was raised a Christian and went to Christian Schools for 12 years, so I know the Bible extremely well.

            Since then, I also read books by Bible Experts like Bart D.
            Ehrman, Earl Doherty, and the Episcopal Bishop John Spong, all which claimed that the Bible is full of “Misquotations”, “Forgeries” and “Lies”.

            You folks should look them up on Wiki and then read their many books. All these persons studied and know the Bible EXTREMELY WELL. But, they all found the BIBLE is TOTALLY a FRAUD!!!

            Incidentally. Bart Ehrman in addition to being Born Christian also became a “Born Again Christian” , went to BIble College studied Christian Theology and has many degrees in CHristian Theology from the BEST
            Universities..

            Yet, at the end he found so many flaws in the bible that he was forced to reject the Bible and became an Agnostic. Bishop Spong was an Episcopal Bishop and he also later rejected the Bible.

            And these are just the tip of the Iceberg, but they are a good start. This is why I rejected Christianity and the Bible. I and the people that I mentioned REJECTED the Bible out of KNOWLEDGE NOT ignorance.

            Your knowledge is LIMITED only to one side, the side that likes or FAVORS the Bible.

            You ALSO need to read about the OTHER VIEWPOINT!!!

            In LIfe, there are always two sides to every issue!!! You have not given yourself the chance to read the other viewpoint yet.

            Do me AND YOURSELF a FAVOR, look up up those persons that I mentioned in the Wiki INTERNET Encyclopedia. Read their BIo, and if at all
            possible, read some of their many, many books.

            Again their names are: Bart D. Ehrman, Earl J. Doherty, and the Retired Episcopal Bishop John Spong.

          • Jennifer Futch

            The earth was not described as flat in the Bible. Since God made it, makes sense that He knows what it looks like.

            It is the Lord who sits above the circle of the earth. And compared to him, people are like grasshoppers. He rolled open the skies like a piece of cloth. He stretched out the skies like a tent to sit under. (‭Isaiah‬ ‭40‬:‭22‬ ERV)

          • bizbird6

            Of course, TEchnology is BOOMING, but what is Technology based on? SCIENCE and SCIENCE and SCIENCE, of course!!!

            Certainly NOT RELIGION which is some 2,000 years old and has produced NOTHING, but IGNORANCE and the DARK AGES!

            THat is WHY Conservative Christianity s decling all over the World while SCIENCE (with TECHNOLOGY) is BOOMING!!!

            That is why I advise you to ABANDON FALSE Christianity and join us SCIENCE and TECHNOLOGY BELIEVERS!!!

            And you WON”T be “LONELY”, because “NONBELIEVERS are the FASTEST GROWING Group in this WORLD today!!

            Conservative Christian WILL be LONELY because it is declining so FAST!!!

          • bizbird6

            ·
            You remind me of this Conservative
            Christian that I know.

            When this person prays, and what he pray for ACTUALLY happens, then He is extremely grateful to
            God for granting his prayer. He will remember God’s Generosity for years.

            However, if what he is praying NEVER happens, then he’ll make EXCUSES for God, like God “works in mysterious ways”, or “God in his INFINITE Wisdom decided that what
            he prayed for should Not be”! ETc., Etc., Etc.

            So either way, “God WINS” This is why you Conservative
            Christians are talking Nonsense!!!.

            See, this is what you are doing!!! Your facts for God are NONEXISTENT!!! You are talking NONSENSE!!!

          • bizbird6

            You are talking NONSENSE because the Bible is WRONG and WRONG on ALL counts.

            If it is “Right”, it is because you Conservative Christians deliberately made it right by BENDING the Truth to FIT the Bible.

            Everything can be interpreted as “Biblical”, if you tried hard enough, but the Bible is still a completely LIE!!!

            No objectively thinking person would accept such BALONEY!!!.

          • bizbird6

            This is NOT SCIENCE that does NOT agree, but HUMANITY in general which can NEVER REACH 100% consensus!!

            In Life, We always have difference of opinion, and NOT in Science!! Just look at Religions, for example. How many different Religions and even Christian denominations there are in the World, like Baptists, Methodists, Episcopalean, . , Scientology, Mormonism, , ETC., ETC., Etc.,

            Even Islam has different sects. And even Baptist, you have “New World Baptists”, “Southern Baptists”, etc., etc., Etc.

            This just reflect our diverse Society with Divergent opinions.

            Science s general is very UNITED because we follow LOGIC, EVIDENCES, and PROOFS, unlike Religion which based on “Blind Faith”. When something is based on Blind Faith, then the Sky is the Limit on what to believe in!!!

          • bizbird6

            You are SOOOOO_______________________WRONG!!!

            Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, but the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

            The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even 10 time longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

            And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTIST would believe in the Bible, but they DON”T!!!

            Science, however, IS MARVELOUS. ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES!!

            Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

            You Bible, however, is a TOTAL FAKE!!!!

            I know the BIble EXTREMELY WELL!

            In fact, I was raised a Christian and went to Christian Schools for 12 years, so I know the Bible extremely well.

            But I also read books by Bible Experts like Bart D. Ehrman, Earl Doherty, and the Episcopal Bishop John Spong, all which claimed that the Bible is full of “Misquotations”, “Forgeries” and “Lies”.

            You folk should look them up on Wiki and then read their many books.

            Incidentally. Bart Ehrman was also born a Christian and became a “Born Again Christian” but at the end realized that the Bible is Inaccurate and totally false.

            Ehrman rejected the Bible and became an Agnostic. Bishop Spong was a Bishop and he also later rejected the Bible.

            This is why I rejected Christianity and the Bible. I and the
            people that I mentioned REJECTED the Bible out of KNOWLEDGE NOT ignorance.

            Your knowledge is LIMITED only to one side, the side that likes or FAVORS the Bible.

            You ALSO need to read about the OTHER VIEWPOINT!!!

            In LIfe, there are always two sides to every issue!!! You have not given yourself the chance to read the other side yet.

            Do me and YOURSELF a FAVOR, look up up those persons that I mentioned in the Wiki INTERNET Encyclopedia. Read their BIo, and if at all possible, rea some of their many, many books.

            Again their names are: Bart D. Ehrman, Earl J. Doherty, and the Retired Episcopal Bishop John Spong

          • bizbird6

            You are talking NONSENSE because the Bible is WRONG and WRONG on ALL counts.

            If it is “Right”, it is because you Conservative Christians deliberately made it right by BENDING the Truth to FIT the Bible.

            Everything can be interpreted as “Biblical”, if you tried hard enough, but the Bible is still a completely LIE!!!

            No objectively thinking person would accept such BALONEY!!!.

          • bizbird6

            You remind me of this Conservative Christian that I know.

            When this person prays, and what he pray for ACTUALLY happens, then He is extremely grateful to God for granting his prayer. He will remember God’s Generosity for years.

            However, if what he is praying NEVER happens, then he’ll make EXCUSES for God, like God “works in mysterious ways”, or “God in his INFINITE Wisdom decided that what he prayed for should Not be”! ETc., Etc., Etc.

            So either way, God WINS.

            See, this is what you are doing!!! Your facts for God are NONEXISTENT!!! You are talking NONSENSE!!!

          • Dick

            We must pity this idiot. Let him believe their is no GOD. When he croaks than he will know the truth, but, it will be too late. Do not put the pearl before the swine. Shake the dust from your feet and move on. He doesn’t welcome you into his home.

          • bizbird6

            Science will prove everything, in addition to what it has already proven. Religion and Christianity has proven NOTHING even though it is some 2000 years old, except that it is capable of untold Torture, Murder, and EVIL. How many have already died in the Inquisition, Witch Burning, Religion Wars, and persecution of Religious Minorities?
            Christianity has more BLOOD in its hands than any MONSTER or SERIAL KILLER.

            Believers share the GUILT of CHRISTIANITY because they are AWARE of the TERRIBLE SKELETON in Christianity’s CLOSET and ye still cling on to it. Do you share the GUILT of the MILLIONS that DIED in the name of RELIGION?

          • John W. Kerr

            When will you dig up the missing link? (and all the other missing links proving life actually evolves rather than devolves)

          • bizbird6

            Science will prove everything, in addition to what it has already proven. Religion and Christianity has proven NOTHING even though it is some 2000 years old, except that it is capable of untold Torture, Murder, and EVIL. How many have already died in the Inquisition, Witch Burning, Religion Wars, and persecution of Religious Minorities? Christianity has more BLOOD in its hands than any MONSTER or SERIAL KILLER.

            .

          • John W. Kerr

            No, you will soon be dead, but not ever right!

          • bizbird6

            You need to read on BOTH sides of the Question. There are ALWAYS 2 sides.

            I know, because It used to be a Christian and went to a Christian School for 12 years. However, I started to read about the other side.

            The World is changing!

            The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

            SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

            Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

            The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

            The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five
            Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

            Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never
            having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

            Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

            – – Jordan Valinsky

        • bizbird6

          The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against your Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

          SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

          Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

          The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

          The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

          Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
          with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
          isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

          Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

          – – Jordan Valinsky

          ——————————

      • heilbama

        Psalm 14:1: ‘The fool in his heart says “There is no God”.’

        • bizbird6

          This TIME the “Fool” is RIGHT!!!

          You should learn also!!!

  • bizbird6

    There is a MOVIE “Noah” out that is presently Number # 1, Box Office now. It shows the familiar Noah and his Ark Bible story that all Bible Readers know about.

    All this shows is that the Bible WAS NOT written by God who should know how many species there is in the World (Especially if it was God that “Created it in the first place!!!

    A Creator that does NOT even know how many species there are which he personally created?? Ridiculous!!!

    Because if God were knowledgeable about Science, he would realize that since there are so many thousands and Millions of Species spread out all over the world and in so many different places that it is virtually IMPOSSIBLE for ONE man Noah and his small family to collect and put into his Ark.

    And that is only the tip of the Iceberg. Don’t forget that there are also 40,000 different Crustaceans, 130 Millions species of Insects, 75,000 species of Arachnids, 5,400 species of Reptile, 5,400 species of Amphibians, over 9,000 species of Birds, etc., etc., etc.

    And remember again that hundreds of new Species are discovered every year And again, scores of Scientists are combing the world just searching for NEW species of all kinds.

    Just 130 Million Insects alone would make it impossible to Collect, let alone all the thousands and thousands and thousands of other creatures?.

    Now just how big is Noah’s Family??? Would you include only his immediate family? Or can you include his more distant relatives as well???? Does Noah have a PhD in Insect Study? Then how would h know which Insects to Collect?

    Also, Noah would have to go to Australia to get a pair of Kangaroos, to Africa to get a pair of African Elephants, to India to get Asian Elephants, to Siberia to get Siberian Tigers, to America to get Buffalos., Monkeys from Africa, etc., etc., etc. So many creatures are indigenous to only certain areas only. And we are only talking about some 5,000 Mammals.

    And even if Noah wanted to do just this, how would he do it? Would he go to his local travel office to book an airplane flight to all those places all over the world? And even if he were rich enough to form many Safaris , how easy is it to transport elephants, Tigers, Giraffes, Hippopotamus, etc., etc., etc., back to his Ark?

    Obviously it is a HUMAN person that wrote the Bible and the
    Noah Ark story and this Human person was very Ignorant of Science.

    That is why the Bible s a complete Fiction!!! It is written by a HUMAN person with very limited knowledge of Science, especially regarding the Science of Species. This is why the Noah Ark story is total FICTION!!!!

    And if Noah’s Ark s Fiction, so is the WHOLE BIBLE!!! The Whole Bible is a COMPLETE FICTION and a COMPLETE FRAUD!!!

    • John W. Kerr

      Wow! You made a fool of yourself twice?

      • bizbird6

        Predominantly Atheist Countries Have Lowest Crime Rate

        According To Study by bawomolo(m): 11:21pm On Mar 18, 2008

        Several weeks ago, a ground-breaking study on religious belief
        and social well-being was published in the Journal of Religion & Society.
        Comparing 18 prosperous democracies from the U.S. to New Zealand, author Gregory S Paul quietly demolished the myth that faith strengthens society.

        Drawing on a wide range of studies to cross-match faith – measured by belief in God and acceptance of evolution – with homicide and intimate behavior, Paul found that secular societies have lower rates of violence and teenage
        pregnancy than societies where many people profess belief in God.

        Top of the class, in both atheism and good behavior, come the Japanese. Over eighty percent accept evolution and fewer than ten percent are certain that God exists. Despite its size – over a hundred million people – Japan is one of the least crime-prone countries in the world. It also has the lowest rates
        of teenage pregnancy of any developed nation.

        (Teenage pregnancy has less tragic consequences than violence but it is usually unwanted, and it is frequently associated with deprivation among both mothers and children. In general, it is a Bad Thing.)

        Next in line are the Norwegians, British, Germans and Dutch. At least sixty percent accept evolution as a fact and fewer than one in three are convinced that there is a deity. There is little teenage pregnancy , although the Brits, with over 40 pregnancies per 1,000 girls a year, do twice as badly as
        the others. Homicide rates are also low — around 1-2 victims per 100,000
        people a year.

        At the other end of the scale comes America. Over 50 percent of Americans believe in God, and only 40 percent accept some form of evolution (many believe it had a helping hand from the Deity). The U.S. has the highest rate of teenage pregnancy and homicide rates are at least five times greater than
        in Europe and ten times higher than in Japan.

        All this information points to a strong correlation between faith and antisocial behavior — a correlation so strong that there is good reason to suppose that religious belief does more harm than good.

        At first glance that is a preposterous suggestion, given that religions preach non-violence and intimate restraint. However, close inspection reveals a different story. Faith tends to weaken rather than strengthen people’s ability to participate in society. That makes it less likely they will respect social customs and laws.

        All believers learn that God holds them responsible for their actions. So far so good, but for many, belief absolves them of all other responsibilities.
        Consciously or subconsciously, those who are “born again” or
        “chosen” have diminished respect for others who do not share their sect or their faith. Convinced that only the Bible offers “truth”, they lose their intellectual curiosity and their ability to reason. Their priority becomes not the world they live in but themselves.

        The more people prioritize themselves rather than those around them, the weaker society becomes and the greater the likelihood of antisocial behavior.
        Hence gun laws which encourage Americans to see each other not as fellow human beings who deserve protection, but as potential aggressors who deserve to die. And hence a health care system which looks after the wealthy rather than the ill.

        As for sex… Faith encourages ignorance rather than responsible behavior. In other countries, sex education includes contraception, reducing the risk of
        unwanted pregnancies. Such an approach recognizes that young people have the
        right to make their own choices and helps them make decisions that benefit
        society as a whole. In America faith-driven abstinence programs deny them
        that right — “As a Christian I will only help you if you do what I
        say”. The result is soaring rates of unwanted pregnancy and sexually
        transmitted infections.

        Abstinence programs rest on the same weak intellectual foundation as
        creationism and intelligent design. Faith discourages unprejudiced analysis.
        Reasoning is subverted to rationalization that supports rather than questions
        assumptions. The result is a self-contained system that maintains an internal
        logic, no matter how absurd to outside observers.

        The constitutional wall that theoretically separates church and state is
        irrelevant. Religion has overwhelmed the nation to permeate all public
        discussion. Look no further than Gary Bauer, a man who in any other western
        nation would be dismissed as a fanatic and who in America is interviewed deferentially on prime time television.

        Despite all its fine words, religion has brought in its wake little more than violence, prejudice and intimate disease. True morality is found elsewhere.
        As UK Guardian columnist George Monbiot concluded in his review of Gregory Paul’s study, “if you want people to behave as Christians advocate, you should tell them that God does not exist.”

        I might express that another way. The flip side of Monbiot’s argument is that God would be an atheist,

        i think this shatters the thinking that morality is lost when societies become secular.

        http://www.humaniststudies.org

        • Kurinto

          Secular Humanism and Evolution Theory (Uniformitarianism) are both State-subsidized and enforced RELIGIONS. There are meetings. (congregations) There are tenents. (see the “Georgia Guidestones” and the “Communist Manifesto.” The more notable adherents to these “faiths” are the likes of Hitler, Stalin, Pol Pot and Mao Tse Tung. Yeah, your professors will tell you about their “original” religious affiliations, like Christianity (Catholicism; Eastern Religions, etc.) but in practice, they studied Evolution and justified the mass murder of their own people and other “lesser forms of humankind” when expedient for their positions of power and control…AND their “Utopian Goal” of a Perfect World. With evolution teaching in schools for the past several decades, you think Christianity is the problem? Where have you been?

          • bizbird6

            Certainly Christianity is NOT the ONLY Problem, but it CERTAINLY is a MAJOR Problem. Just look at the resistance Christianity is putting up in regards to the teaching of Evolution.

            The Other problems are being worked on, and some have been Solved, like Communism and Fascism are Dead.

            At least Christianity is DECLINING. If you don’t believe me on that, read the other inputs that I put in this Website. Survey after survey shows that Christianity is in a DECLINING BOTH in the USA and the World.

            Today, the NEW SAVIOR is NO LONGER Christianity and Religions, but SCIENCE.

            Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, while the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

            The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even more than 1000 times longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

            And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTISTS would believe in the Bible,
            but they DON”T!!!

            Science, however, IS MARVELOUS. ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES are all worthy slaves of Mankind!!

            Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

            SCIENCE will be our SAVIOR and our FUTURE. I TRUST in SCIENCE and Secularism, NOT religion.

  • bizbird6

    There is a MOVIE out now called NOAH and is very popular.

    However, a Lot of Conservative Christians are opposed to it because it DEVIATED from the Bible!!!
    However, I disagree, because I like it!!
    For one thing, It shows how Phony the Noah’s story is and how FALSE the Bible is!
    The Bible is SHEER NONSENSE. If God want a pair of every creature in the World in an Ark, it would take FOREVER!!!
    Why?
    Do you even realize how many creatures there are in the World??
    Do you realize how much time it would take for Noah’s Family to collect that?
    Animals: estimated 3.30 million
    species
    |–Invertebrates: 97% of all known
    species
    | `–+–Sponges: 10,000 species
    | |–Cnidarians: 8,000-9,000
    species
    | |–Molluscs: 100,000 species
    | |–Platyhelminths: 13,000
    species
    | |–Nematodes: 20,000+ species
    | |–Echinoderms: 6,000 species
    | |–Annelida: 12,000 species
    | `–Arthropods
    | `–+–Crustaceans: 40,000
    species
    | |–Insects: 130 million+ species
    | `–Arachnids: 75,500 species
    `–Vertebrates: 3% of all known
    species
    `–+–Reptiles: 7,984 species
    |–Amphibians: 5,400 species
    |–Birds: 9,000-10,000 species
    |–Mammals: 4,475-5,000 species
    `–Ray-Finned Fishes: 23,500
    species
    And that is just the tip of the Iceberg. Hundred of new Species are discovered every year Scores of Scientists are combing the world just
    searching for NEW species of all kinds.
    And some are existing in only certain parts of the World! Can you imagine Noah flying all over the World just collecting Species?
    For example, the Siberian Tigers indigenous only in Siberia, so you are saying that Noah flew to Siberia just to trap and import a pair of Siberian
    Tiger to his Ark??
    And Kangaroos from Australia or Buffalos from Americas?. The same thing is true with other Animals, like you know that Africa Elephants and
    Asian Elephants are very different? And there are also rarer species that most people never hear of either? And
    The same is true with other Mammals, insects, Fishes, Birds, Germs, etc., etc., etc.
    Just insects alone number 130 Million species. Does Noah have a PHD in the study of Insects? Does he know even where to start?

    And how would Noah get to all those places? Were there Operating Airlines in those days?? Does he go to his closest Travel Agency and Book a Flight?
    Does he start Safari????

    And how would Noah collect all those species?? By using his family???

    So how big is his Family??? He had his wife and some daughters?

    Absolutely Ridiculous!!!
    The Noah’s Ark story is pure NONSENSE and the whole Bible is a complete FANTASY!!!

    • John W. Kerr

      Fantasy= your post………..Reality=you will die and discover the answer to all spiritual mysteries too late.

      • bizbird6

        The Bible is a COMPLETE FRAUD!!! MOSES NEVER EXISTED!

        MOSES?

        NOT IN THE NEW ENCYCLOPAEDIA JUDAICA

        New edition of Jewish world’s most profound encyclopedia is rather skeptical of Moses’ existence

        Associated Press

        PRINCIPLES OF MAAT 2000 YEARS BEFORE THE 10 COMMANDMENTS

        The Ten Commandments, eight of them at least, were taken (PLAGIARIZED) from the
        Egyptian Principles of Ma’at written at least 2000 years earlier.

        Written at least 2,000 years before the Ten Commandments, the 42 Principles of Ma’at are one of the world’s oldest sources of moral and spiritual instruction. Ma’at, the Ancient Egyptian divine Principle of Truth, Justice, and Righteousness, is the foundation of natural and social order and unity.

        1. I have not committed murder, neither have I bid any man to slay on my behalf;

        2. I have not committed rape, neither have I forced any woman to commit
        fornication;

        3. I have not avenged myself, nor have I burned with rage;

        4. I have not caused terror, nor have I worked affliction;

        5. I have caused none to feel pain, nor have I worked grief;

        6. I have done neither harm nor ill, nor I have caused misery;

        7. I have done no hurt to man, nor have I wrought harm to beasts;

        8. I have made none to weep;

        9. I have had no knowledge of evil, neither have I acted wickedly, nor have I wronged
        the people;

        10. I have not stolen, neither have I taken that which does not belong to me,
        nor that which belongs to another, nor have I taken from the orchards, nor
        snatched the milk from the mouth of the babe;

        11. I have not defrauded, neither I have added to the weight of the balance,
        nor have I made light the weight in the scales;

        12. I have not laid waste the plowed land, nor trampled down the fields;

        13. I have not driven the cattle from their pastures, nor have I deprived any of that which was rightfully theirs;

        14. I have accused no man falsely, nor have I supported any false accusation;

        15. I have spoken no lies, neither have I spoken falsely to the hurt of another;

        16. I have never uttered fiery words, nor have I stirred up strife;

        17. I have not acted guilefully, neither have I dealt deceitfully, nor spoken
        to deceive to the hurt another;

        18. I have not spoken scornfully, nor have I set my lips in motion against any man;

        19. I have not been an eavesdropper;

        20. I have not stopped my ears against the words of Right and Truth;

        21. I have not judged hastily, nor have I judged harshly;

        22. I have committed no crime in the place of Right and Truth;

        23. I have caused no wrong to be done to the servant by his master;

        24. I have not been angry without cause;

        25. I have not turned back water at its springtide, nor stemmed the flow of
        running water;

        26. I have not broken the channel of a running water;

        27. I have never fouled the water, nor have I polluted the land;

        Sins

        28. I have not cursed nor despised God, nor have I done that which God does
        abominate;

        29. I have not vexed or angered God;

        30. I have not robbed God, nor have I filched that which has been offered in
        the temples;

        31. I have not added unto nor have I minished the offerings which are due;

        32. I have not purloined the cakes of the gods;

        33. I have not carried away the offerings made unto the blessed dead;

        34. I have not disregarded the season for the offerings which are appointed;

        35. I have not turned away the cattle set apart for sacrifice;

        36. I have not thwarted the processions of the god;

        37. I have not slaughtered with evil intent the cattle of the god;

        Personal Transgressions

        38. I have not acted guilefully nor have I acted in insolence;

        39. I have not been overly proud, nor have I behaved myself with arrogance;

        40. I have never magnified my condition beyond what was fitting;

        41. Each day have I labored more than was required of me;

        42. My name has not come forth to the boat of the Prince;

        It should be obvious that the Forty-two Affirmations of Right and Truth are far more inclusive than the so-called Ten Commandments. Even when the rest of the Jewish laws are considered, they pale in the light of the Pagan Egyptian Law.

      • bizbird6

        You will DIE TOO and you will find Christianity is ALL a LIE.

        Or maybe, even WORST, you will find NOTHING at ALL there!

  • bizbird6

    The TREND is MOVING more and MORE against Conservative Christian Belief. Read below:

    SURVEY SAYS 10:05AM ET

    Bible skepticism doubles in three years, survey finds

    The number of Americans skeptical of the Bible has doubled over the past three years, a new survey reveals.

    The State of the Bible poll discovered that those who believe that the Bible is “just another book of teachings written by men that contains stories and advice” doubled from 10 to 20 percent since 2011. The survey, which was conducted by the Barna Group, found that one in five Americans read the Bible at least four times week — equal to the percentage of those who are skeptical of it.

    Although the Bible obviously remains a “highly valued, influential force” in America, as theChristian Post says, it’s also certainly a polarizing document
    with millennials. Forty percent of those aged 18 to 29 admitted to never having read it because they were “busy,” and 30 percent think the Bible
    isn’t influential enough in society (versus 50 percent of adults).

    Read the rest of the survey at the Christian Post.

    – – Jordan Valinsky

  • skinnyed

    So many people here who are expressing belief in the movie Noah. Which is a fictional story written by MEN. They then express their disbelief in the Bible which is inspired by God.
    These same folks cannot discuss the Bible intelligently because they haven’t read it thoroghly (studied it). It is not a collection of unrelated stories. The entire Bible, when taken as a whole, points to one thing. – Jesus.

    • bizbird6

      Bart D. Ehrman IS AN EXPERT on the Bible! IN fact, he is considered to be the World’s #1 EXPERT on the Bible. He has written some 30 Books on the Bible. Read below.

    • bizbird6

      You are SOOOOO_______________________WRONG!!!

      Science had PROVEN ITSELF RIGHT, but the Bible is CONSTANTLY WRONG!!!

      The Bible was written 2000 years , but how long has MANKIND believed the World was FLAT, even more than 1000 times longer than the Bible. TIME and Age mean NOTHING.

      And NOTHING in the Bible has been proven RIGHT. It if has, then all the SCIENTISTS would believe in the Bible, but they DON”T!!!

      Science, however, IS MARVELOUS, ELECTRICITY, COMMUNICATIONS, TV, RADIO, CARS, AIRPLANES!!

      Even the Computer that you are using now is due to the WONDERS of SCIENCE.

      You Bible, however, is a TOTAL FAKE!!!!

      I know the Bible EXTREMELY, EXTREMELY WELL!

      In fact, I was raised a Christian and went to Christian Schools for 12 years, so I know the Bible extremely well.

      Since then, I also read books by Bible Experts like Bart D. Ehrman, Earl
      Doherty, and the Episcopal Bishop John Spong, all which claimed that the
      Bible is full of “Misquotations”, “Forgeries” and “Lies”.

      You folks should look them up on Wiki and then read their many books. All
      these persons studied and know the Bible EXTREMELY WELL. But, they all found the BIBLE is TOTALLY a FRAUD!!!

      Incidentally. Bart Ehrman in addition to being Born Christian also became a “Born Again Christian” , went to BIble College studied Christian Theology and has many degrees in CHristian Theology from the BEST Universities..

      Yet, at the end he found so many flaws in the bible that he was forced to reject the Bible and became an Agnostic. Bishop Spong was an Episcopal Bishop and he also later rejected the Bible.

      And these are just the tip of the Iceberg, but they are a good start. This is why I rejected Christianity and the Bible. I and the people that I mentioned REJECTED the Bible out of KNOWLEDGE NOT ignorance.

      Your knowledge is LIMITED only to one side, the side that likes or FAVORS the Bible.

      You ALSO need to read about the OTHER VIEWPOINT!!!

      In LIfe, there are always two sides to every issue!!! You have not given yourself the chance to read the other viewpoint yet.

      Do me AND YOURSELF a FAVOR, look up up those persons that I mentioned in the Wiki INTERNET Encyclopedia. Read their BIo, and if at all possible, read some of their many, many books.

      Again their names are: Bart D. Ehrman, Earl J. Doherty, and the Retired Episcopal Bishop John Spong.

  • skinnyed

    Christian prayer is not always about asking for specific things. It is also about praise, repentance, and supplication.
    When in prayer if things are asked for God provides only 2 possible answers. 1- yes or 2-I have a better idea. Trust in God and lean not upon thine own understanding.

    • bizbird6

      You remind me of this Conservative Christian that I know.

      When this person prays, and what he pray for ACTUALLY happens, then He is extremely grateful to God for granting his prayer. He will remember
      God’s Generosity for years.

      However, if what he is praying NEVER happens, then he’ll make EXCUSES for God, like God “works in mysterious ways”, or “God in his INFINITE Wisdom decided that what he prayed for should Not be”! Etc., Etc., Etc.

      So either way, God “WINS”.

      See, this is what you are doing!!! Your facts for God are NONEXISTENT!!! You are talking NONSENSE!!!

      • John W. Kerr

        NONSENSE is a FOOL copying and reposting his NONSENSE 5 times on the same thread! Congradulations, you win the “FOOL” award here. Sadly you will die and then comprehend all spiritual mysteries.

        • bizbird6

          MOSES NEVER EXISTED!

          MOSES? NOT IN THE NEW ENCYCLOPAEDIA JUDAICA

          New edition of Jewish world’s most profound encyclopedia is rather skeptical of Moses’ existence

          Associated Press

          PRINCIPLES OF MAAT 2000 YEARS BEFORE THE 10 COMMANDMENTS

          The Ten Commandments, eight of them at least, were taken (PLAGIARIZED) from the Egyptian Principles of Ma’at written at least 2000 years earlier.

          Written at least 2,000 years before the Ten Commandments, the 42 Principles of Ma’at
          are one of the world’s oldest sources of moral and spiritual instruction.

          Ma’at, the Ancient Egyptian divine Principle of Truth, Justice, and Righteousness, is the foundation of natural and social order and unity.

          1. I have not committed murder,
          neither have I bid any man to slay on my behalf;

          2. I have not committed rape, neither have I forced any woman to commit
          fornication;

          3. I have not avenged myself, nor have I burned with rage;

          4. I have not caused terror, nor have I worked affliction;

          5. I have caused none to feel pain, nor have I worked grief;

          6. I have done neither harm nor ill, nor I have caused misery;

          7. I have done no hurt to man, nor have I wrought harm to beasts;

          8. I have made none to weep;

          9. I have had no knowledge of evil, neither have I acted wickedly, nor have I wronged
          the people;

          10. I have not stolen, neither have I taken that which does not belong to me, nor that which belongs to another, nor have I taken from the orchards, nor
          snatched the milk from the mouth of the babe;

          11. I have not defrauded, neither I have added to the weight of the balance, nor have I made light the weight in the scales;

          12. I have not laid waste the plowed land, nor trampled down the fields;

          13. I have not driven the cattle from their pastures, nor have I deprived any of that which was rightfully theirs;

          14. I have accused no man falsely, nor have I supported any false accusation;

          15. I have spoken no lies, neither have I spoken falsely to the hurt of another;

          16. I have never uttered fiery words, nor have I stirred up strife;

          17. I have not acted guilefully, neither have I dealt deceitfully, nor spoken
          to deceive to the hurt another;

          18. I have not spoken scornfully, nor have I set my lips in motion against any man;

          19. I have not been an eavesdropper;

          20. I have not stopped my ears against the words of Right and Truth;

          21. I have not judged hastily, nor have I judged harshly;

          22. I have committed no crime in the place of Right and Truth;

          23. I have caused no wrong to be done to the servant by his master;

          24. I have not been angry without cause;

          25. I have not turned back water at its springtide, nor stemmed the flow of running water;

          26. I have not broken the channel of a running water;

          27. I have never fouled the water, nor have I polluted the land;

          Sins

          28. I have not cursed nor despised God, nor have I done that which God does abominate;

          29. I have not vexed or angered God;

          30. I have not robbed God, nor have I filched that which has been offered in
          the temples;

          31. I have not added unto nor have I minished the offerings which are due;

          32. I have not purloined the cakes of the gods;

          33. I have not carried away the offerings made unto the blessed dead;

          34. I have not disregarded the season for the offerings which are appointed;

          35. I have not turned away the cattle set apart for sacrifice;

          36. I have not thwarted the processions of the god;

          37. I have not slaughtered with evil intent the cattle of the god;

          Personal Transgressions

          38. I have not acted guilefully nor have I acted in insolence;

          39. I have not been overly proud, nor have I behaved myself with arrogance;

          40. I have never magnified my condition beyond what was fitting;

          41. Each day have I labored more than was required of me;

          42. My name has not come forth to the boat of the Prince;

          It should be obvious that the Forty-two Affirmations of Right and Truth are far more inclusive than the so-called Ten Commandments. Even when the rest of the Jewish laws are considered, they pale in the light of the Pagan Egyptian Law.

          ———————————-

          • Kurinto

            2 Peter 3:3: “Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts,”
            4:”And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning..”

            Oh,
            no! My Faith is “so shaken!” You think we don’t know about “Good Society” writings from other cultures from the other peoples of the
            world? “The Codex of Hammurabi,” “The Book of Five Rings?” You think that these, others and the one you posted in this thread have “tenure” due to their “earlier” dates? Have you practiced this same “drop your faith” strategy with the muslims? Betcha haven’t. Regardless, you’ve got some learning to do. Maybe if you took a walk outside of your university library, you might just learn some things that they dare not include in the curriculum.

            P.S.: Apparently, the Egyptian code of virtues has the characteristics of an ‘I’ve done no wrong doing’ “dream resume,” as it has obviously not been followed nearly to the extent as Judeo-Christianity, as history has made clear. Why no criticism on that?

          • bizbird6

            Christianity is EQUALLY FALSE!

            Christians have been waiting for 2000 years already for his “Coming”, and yet he has NEVER come. I laugh at all the other FALSE “Comings” that NEVER came to be. And he will NEVER come!

            I pity those POOR Christian Believes that lived on FALSE Promises that will NEVER be FORE FILLED.

          • bizbird6

            Science will prove everything, in addition to what it has already proven. Religion and Christianity has proven NOTHING even though it is some 2000 years old, except that it is capable of untold Torture, Murder, and EVIL. How many have already died in the Inquisition, Witch Burning, Religion Wars, and persecution of Religious Minorities?
            Christianity has more BLOOD in its hands than any MONSTER or SERIAL KILLER.

            Believers of Christianity share the GUILT of CHRISTIANITY because they are AWARE of the TERRIBLE SKELETON in Christianity’s CLOSET and yet still cling on to it. Do you share the GUILT of the MILLIONS that DIED in the name of RELIGION?

            It is like the German people share the guilt of Hitler even though most have never been born until after he has died.
            Christians are much worse, since they knowingly become Christians even they aware of the TERRIBLE GUILT of Christianity’s Bloody Hands in History.

  • Harry K James

    I gave up on reading the comments because of this bizbird6 fruit cake who is probably Ted Turner or Jane Fonda.

    • bizbird6

      Many people read ABOUT Bart D. Ehrman but too few ACTUALLY READ Bart D. Ehrman. That is why I included this writing by Bart D. Ehrman because some gives a taste of What he believes in.

      Basically he says that the Bible is EXTREMELY INACCURATE and FULL of
      “MISQUOTATIONS”, “FORGERIES” and “LIES”!

      Bart D. Ehrman

      Author, ‘Forged: Writing in the Name

      of God—Why the Bible’s Authors Are Not Who We Think They Are’

      Who Wrote The Bible and Why It Matters

      Posted: 03/25/11 09:38 PM ET

      Apart from the most rabid fundamentalists among us, nearly everyone
      admits that the Bible might contain errors — a faulty creation story here, a
      historical mistake there, a contradiction or two in some other place. But is it
      possible that the problem is worse than that — that the Bible actually
      contains lies?

      Most people wouldn’t put it that way, since the Bible is, after all,
      sacred Scripture for millions on our planet. But good Christian scholars of the Bible, including the top Protestant and Catholic scholars of America, will tell you that the Bible is full of lies, even if they refuse to use the term. And here

      is the truth: Many of the books of the New Testament were written by people who lied about their identity, claiming to be a famous apostle — Peter, Paul or James — knowing full well they were someone else. In modern parlance, that is a lie, and a book written by someone who lies about his identity is a forgery.

      Most modern scholars of the Bible shy away from these terms, and for
      understandable reasons, some having to do with their clientele. Teaching in Christian seminaries, or to largely Christian undergraduate populations, who wants to denigrate the cherished texts of Scripture by calling them forgeries built on lies?

      And so scholars use a different term for this phenomenon and call such
      books “pseudepigrapha.” You will find this antiseptic term throughout the writings of modern scholars of the Bible. It’s the term used in university classes on the New Testament, and in seminary courses, and in Ph.D. seminars. What the people who use the term do not tell you is that it literally means “writing that is inscribed with a lie.”

      And that’s what such writings are Whoever wrote the New Testament book
      of 2 Peter claimed to be Peter. But scholars everywhere — except for our
      friends among the fundamentalists — will tell you that there is no way on
      God’s green earth that Peter wrote the book.

      Someone else wrote it claiming to be Peter. Scholars may also tell you
      that it was an acceptable practice in the ancient world for someone to write a book in the name of someone else.

      But that is where they are wrong. If you look at what ancient people actually said about the practice, you’ll see that they invariably called it lying and condemned it as a deceitful practice, even in Christian circles. 2 Peter was finally accepted into the New Testament because the church fathers, centuries later, were convinced that Peter wrote it. But he didn’t. Someone else did. And that someone else lied about his identity.

      The same is true of many of the letters allegedly written by Paul. Most
      scholars will tell you that whereas seven of the 13 letters that go under
      Paul’s name are his, the other six are not.

      Their authors merely claimed to be Paul. In the ancient world, books
      like that were labeled as pseudoi — lies.

      This may all seem like a bit of antiquarian curiosity, especially for
      people whose lives don’t depend on the Bible or even people of faith for whom biblical matters are a peripheral interest at best. But in fact, it matters sometimes.

      Whoever wrote the book of 1 Timothy claimed to be Paul. But he was lying about that — he was someone else living after Paul had died. In his book, the author of 1 Timothy used Paul’s authority to address a problem that he saw in the church.

      Women were speaking out, exercising authority and teaching men. That had to stop. The author told women to be silent and submissive, and reminded his readers about what happened the first time a woman was allowed to exercise authority over a man, in that little incident in the garden of Eden. No, the author argued, if women wanted to be saved, they were to have babies (1 Tim.
      2:11-15).

      Largely on the basis of this passage, the apostle Paul has been branded, by more liberation minded people of recent generations, as one of history’s great misogynists. The problem, of course, is that Paul never said any such thing.

      And why does it matter? Because the passage is still used by church
      leaders today to oppress and silence women. Why are there no women priests in the Catholic Church? Why are women not allowed to preach in conservative evangelical churches?

      Why are there churches today that do not allow women even to speak? In no small measure it is because Paul allegedly taught that women had to be silent, submissive and pregnant.

      Except that the person who taught this was not Paul, but someone lying
      about his identity so that his readers would think he was Paul.

      It may be one of the greatest ironies of the Christian scriptures that
      some of them insist on truth, while telling a lie.

      For no author is truth more important than for the “Paul” of
      Ephesians. He refers to the gospel as “the word of truth” (1:13); he
      indicates that the “truth is in Jesus”; he tells his readers to
      “speak the truth” to their neighbors (4:24-25); and he instructs his
      readers to “fasten the belt of truth around your waist” (6:14). And
      yet he himself lied about who he was. He was not really Paul.

      It appears that some of the New Testament writers, such as the authors
      of 2 Peter, 1 Timothy and Ephesians, felt they were perfectly justified to lie in order to tell the truth. But we today can at least evaluate their claims and realize just how human, and fallible, they were. They were creatures of their time and place. And so too were their teachings, lies and all.

      Bart D. Ehrman is the James A. Gray Distinguished Professor of Religious Studies at the University of North Carolina, Chapel Hill, and the New York Times bestselling author of MANY BOOKS.

  • sadlyso

    You got that right Kevin. You’re an inspiring person.

    • bizbird6

      Kevin?

      Who is Kevin?

  • The Bear

    Right now we should all pray form this mans salvation. The apostle Paul persecuted Christians and God used him. Never under estimate the Lord God Almighty!

    • bizbird6

      I got this from the Internet. See, this is why Christianity and the
      Bible is DECLINING. These are MINISTERS who are VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE about Christ and the Bible and yet they are having all these problems.

      I hate to be in their shoes.

      Again, I keep saying, I PITY and have COMPASSION about these POOR
      Ignorant Christians. Real below:

      Why I De-Converted from Evangelical Christianity

      Wednesday, May 19, 2010

      Evangelical Pastors are Discouraged and Depressed

      The son of the late Jerry Falwell is concerned about what is happening
      among evangelical pastors. Half of pastors would leave the ministry tomorrow if they could. Seventy percent are fighting depression and 90

      percent can’t cope with the challenge of ministry. Those are the statistics
      Pastor Jonathan Falwell laid out to thousands of ministers who were in
      Lynchburg, Va., Tuesday for the “Refuel” conference. The

      well-known pastor stated bluntly, “Something is wrong in ministry”
      (see article).

      While I would not criticize anyone for having clinical

      depression, depression due to discouragement is another matter when it comes to an evangelical Christian pastor.

      He (there aren’t very many shes in evangelical pastorates) is supposed
      to be a child of God, have direct access to the throne of God to ask for help and provision, be certain of going to heaven when he dies, have all of his sins and guilt removed, what in the world does he have to be depressed about–if what he believes is really the truth?

      The very name of the conference is interesting– Refuel . Why is it that
      Christians have to constantly be refueled and recharged in order to keep going? Why do they have to be reminded all of the time that their God is real?

      Another article reveals even more telling statistics based on a survey
      of 1,050 evangelical Pastors (note these are evangelical pastors not liberal pastors):

      89% considered leaving the ministry at one time.

      57% said they would leave if they had a better place to go—including
      secular work.

      77% felt they did not have a good marriage!

      75% felt they were unqualified and/or poorly trained by their seminaries
      to lead and manage the church or to counsel others. This left them disheartened in their ability to pastor.

      71% stated they were burned out, and they battle depression beyond
      fatigue on a weekly and even a daily basis.

      38% said they were divorced or currently in a divorce process.

      30% either has an ongoing affair or a one-time sexual encounter with a
      parishioner.

      23% said they felt happy and content on a regular basis with who they
      are in Christ, in their church, and in their home!

      The same article also gives the following research distilled from Barna,
      Focus on the Family, and Fuller Seminary.

      1500 pastors leave the ministry each month due to moral failure, spiritual
      burnout, or contention in their churches.

      50% of pastors’ marriages will end in divorce.

      80 percent of pastors feel unqualified and discouraged in their role as
      pastor.

      50% of pastors are so discouraged that they would leave the ministry if
      they could, but have no other way of making a living.

      80% of seminary and Bible school graduates who enter the ministry will
      leave the ministry within the first five years.

      70% of pastors constantly fight depression.

      40% of pastors polled said they have had an extra-marital affair since
      beginning their ministry.

      Now why I am posting this? To gloat?

      No, I truly feel sorry for anyone who is depressed or who feels locked
      into an occupation that they don’t enjoy. Life is too short to go through it
      like that.

      I post this because, in my opinion, it confirms my conclusion that
      evangelical Christianity is not true. It seems to me that if it were true,
      there would be a marked difference between Christians, especially Christian
      leaders, and the rest of society. If anything, it seems that evangelical
      pastors are in a worse condition than the average nonbeliever.

      Posted by Ken Pulliam at 2:53 PM

      Labels: Evangelicalism, Pastors